sniper |
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blizzakee
Member Joined: 13 March 2006 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 5 |
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Posted: 13 March 2006 at 5:24pm |
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ok the olny guns i use when i paintball is tipmans.(wether im just out with freinds paint balling or at hi-tec..a local paint ball field. im just wondering which gun is best to snipe with a 98 custom or an a5 i have 2 a5s and 1 custom but i dont know which 1 to use to snipe with... and just to prove somthing to a freind a 24" barrel is better to snipe with than a flat line aint it? |
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The_GOAT
Member What happened to my post count? Joined: 03 January 2006 Status: Offline Points: 0 |
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OMG, go eat a brillo pad |
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SP Vision Imp w/ ALL NDZ internals, CP flame drop w/ on/off, Freak-AA tip, lowrise feedneck, NDZ Pro-Mag trigger, tapeworm, NDZ lpr cap, NDZ ti. bolt pin, maybe thats it?
EggII 88/4500 Crossfire |
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blizzakee
Member Joined: 13 March 2006 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 5 |
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ok ok all i wanna know is which is best to snipe with if i get a stock and a 24" barrel? an a-5 or a 98c? |
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The_GOAT
Member What happened to my post count? Joined: 03 January 2006 Status: Offline Points: 0 |
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do not, i repeat do not get a 24 inch barrel or a flatline both will be the end of you. To "Snipe" it doesnt matter between a 98 or A-5. Because you seem to think you can snipe with a paintball gun. Now if you said to make your gun milsim, i wouldnt of told you to eat a brillo pad. Get a good paint to bore match in a barrel like the bigshot or all american or cp barrel, and youll have pretty good accurasy, get hpa and youll have even better accurasy Now do not, i repeat do not say any reference to "sniping" or "sniper" again |
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SP Vision Imp w/ ALL NDZ internals, CP flame drop w/ on/off, Freak-AA tip, lowrise feedneck, NDZ Pro-Mag trigger, tapeworm, NDZ lpr cap, NDZ ti. bolt pin, maybe thats it?
EggII 88/4500 Crossfire |
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Clark Kent
Platinum Member Joined: 02 July 2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 8716 |
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Troll?
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Ashdawg
Member Official Forum Drama Queen of the Night Joined: 01 February 2006 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 442 |
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it's spelled TIPPMANN, not "tipman" !!!!!
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"Too close for missles, switching to guns..."
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OOshanis
Member Joined: 02 February 2006 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 511 |
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he got to the site...and there is Tippmann written everywhere...its called "long-shorthand"...you drop a few letters, but it's still the same word, even though it's a name |
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Snake6
Platinum Member Outranked by guitarguy? Joined: 11 September 2003 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 11229 |
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Now I guess its time to break it out again:
The History of Military Sniping, and how it relates to the Game of Paintball. Ok. So I got bored, and I am sick and tried of this stupid sniper debate. I got a Barnes and Noble gift card for Christmas, and didn’t know what else to get so I picked up several books on Military Snipers. Here are my findings. < -- Note: Due to a problem with my code, you have to Highlight my rifle comparison tables to see them. It’s a bother, but if someone knows how to fix it, PM me. -- > First lets go over the basics of what a sniper is, and what a sniper is not. “A sniper…is considered a specialist, whose prime function is to kill selected high value targets at long range using superior skill and armament. A sharpshooter, by contrast, is a rifleman (proficient or otherwise) who acts in an opportunist manner, taking shots at the enemy when the chance arises” From SNIPER by Adrian Gilbert Keep this in your mind as you read the rest of the article. The American Revolution (1775-83) Sniping first came onto the battlefield during the American Revolution. Standard infantry of this period were equipped with “Brown Bess” smoothbore muskets. The Continental Congress approves 10 independent companies, armed with long rifles. The men of these companies were the first snipers. Comparison between the “Brown Bess” musket, and the Long Rifle. “A soldiers musket, if not exceedingly ill bored (as many are), will strike the figure of a man at 80 yards: it may even at 100, but a soldier must be very unfortunate indeed who shall be wounded by a common musket at 150 yards, provided that the antagonist aims at him; as to firing at a man at 200 yards, with a common, musket, you might as well fire at the moon.” –British Major Hanger, on the “Brown Bess” musket In contrast, the American Long Rifle (as carried by the Irregular
companies), was effective in ranges up to 300 yards, and headshots could be
achieved at 200. At these ranges American Snipers picked-off high ranking
British Officers. During the battle of
As you can see from the table, the Rifle outranged the common muskets of the time by over 200 yards. The War of Northern Aggression (American Civil War) (1861-65) During the Civil War, the standard infantry rifles were the Confederate Snipers were selected in a manner which has been used to select snipers in most present wars. The best men from each infantry regiment entered into shooting competitions. They were required to hit man-sized boards at 500 yards. The best shooters were given the prized Kerr and Witworth rifles. They then went through extensive training in the use of these rifles. The snipers were warned never to get within 400 yards of the enemy, but to use their superior range, to keep the enemy at a safe distance.
World War I (1914-18) US Snipers during World War I used modified, and accurized versions of
the standard service rifle the World War II (1938-45) World War II snipers were selected in different manners during the war. I will concentrate on the Marine Corps Snipers trained at Green’s Farm because the documentation of this school and its snipers is the best. There, snipers were instructed in 5 week courses in marksmanship, camouflage, and field craft. They were trained to approach a target using stealth and to eliminate the target from long distances. These snipers were required to hit a moving target at 500 yards, and to hit a stationary target at 1000. They were equipped much the same way as snipers in WWI were. These snipers used accurized versions of the M1903 Springfield service rifle, the A1 or A3 variants equipped with 2 or 4 power scopes. Marine Infantry qualified at 500 yards.
Vietnam (1965-75) Vietnam is the perfect example of how a sniper can be employed during combat. The restrictive ROE and vast open fields and rice paddy’s of Vietnam became prime sniper territory. The Marine Corps and the Army both Fielded Snipers. Army snipers were equipped with accurized versions of the M14 service rifle, accurate out to 700 yards. The Marine Corps fielded snipers equipped with Winchester Model 70 Hunting rifles firing the .30-06 cartridge, and later in the war snipers carried the M40, which fired the standard 7.62x51mm(.308) cartridge both of these rifles had an effective range of over 1000 yards. Also snipers used modified M2 .50 caliber machine guns, fitted with scopes. These were accurate to ranges out to 2500 yards. Normal infantry of the time fired the M16 Assault Rifle, and the enemy fired the AK-47 assault rifle. These rifles were designed for infantry combat which takes place in ranges of only around 200 yards, and can only be fired accurately up to 500 yards. Thus snipers were able to operate with impunity from beyond the range of effective return fire of the enemy.
Now through all these wars several things have remained in common among snipers, lets analyze these facts: A sniper acts independently from standard infantry, not as a part of a
unit but in a one or two man team. This is possible in paintball, most of the time in scenario games, I am alone behind enemy lines trying to accomplish a mission. But you do very little if any tactical good for your team waiting in one spot for an entire game, hoping a target of high-value (such as the opposing general) walks by. A sniper does not act at random, he selects targets of high value and
eliminates them. Targets of High Value in a military sense are:
Targets of High Value in Paintball:
The problem with selecting high value targets in a scenario paintball game is, there are very few. The vast majority of players play independently, not under any command and they do what they want. What officers and team captains there are do not look any different than any other players. The Sniper fires at targets from
beyond the range of return fire by the standard infantry weapons, or from
distances that were beyond the training of the normal infantryman. As you can see from the diagrams of the Sniper Rifles of the Period in comparison to the standard issue infantry weapons, the sniper rifle always has a great deal more range than infantry weapons, and the sniper has been trained to an accuracy standard that is beyond that of standard infantry training. This is where sniping in paintball fails. All paintball markers except those equipped with the Flatline or Apex systems fire the same distance, around 25 yards or 75 feet. The Flatline will reach ranges of up to 150 ft, but because the ball loses velocity at the same rate as a normal paintball, the chances of getting a break, or a single accurate shot at those ranges are close to zero. The sniper uses a single accurate shot to take his targets down. The ammunition expended to kill ratio of a sniper in Vietnam was 1.7 rounds per kill. The average infantryman expended 50,000 rounds per confirmed kill. It is possible to take targets down with a single shot in paintball. However it is near impossible to eliminate a target with a single shot from beyond the effective range of return fire by the enemy. A sniper uses camouflage and
concealment to hide himself from his enemies to eliminate his targets. No qualms with this, it can be done. Most every scenario paintball player does it. Using camouflage doe not make you sniper. Now as you can see there are several places where sniping fails in paintball. Now look at the definition of a Sharpshooter: “A sharpshooter… is a rifleman (proficient or otherwise) who acts in an opportunist manner, taking shots at the enemy when the chance arises” From SNIPER by Adrian Gilbert Ok, this looks a little more feasible in the game of paintball than the sniper definition doesn’t it? For paintball purposes we can strike rifleman, because there are no rifles in paintball. “who acts in an opportunist manner, taking shots at the enemy when the chance arises” This sounds feasible. The definition of a sniper that Spec Ops puts forth is one of an “ambush player” that fires from concealment, using camouflage. The problem with the Spec Ops definition of a sniper is that it perfectly describes the definition of a sharpshooter in a military sense. So we will set forth the definition of a Sharpshooter in paintball. This is what most of you would call a Sniper in paintball. A sharpshooter takes shots from concealment, shoots at targets as the opportunity arises, and uses a marker that has the same range as everyone else’s. This is not a Sniper. This is a sharpshooter. You will never be a sniper in paintball simple ballistics prevent this from ever happening. The fact of the matter is if you think you are a sniper in paintball, your terminology is wrong. The definition of a sharpshooter, fits paintball a lot closer that the definition of a sniper. But for those of you who insist that you are still snipers, look at an analogy: You work for a living. Your job is to go to people’s houses and businesses, to pick up their trash and take it to the dump. You drive a Garbage Truck. What would you be called, a Garbage Man, or a Professional Truck Driver? You would be called a Garbage Man, would you not? As much as you would prefer to be called a Professional Truck Driver, everyone would call you a Garbage Man because it fits what you are doing better than the title Professional Truck Driver does. The definition
of Sharpshooter, or a Designated Marksman fits what you are doing in paintball
a whole lot better than Sniper does. Stop fooling yourself. References: SNIPER- Adrian
Gilbert One Shot-One
Kill- Charles W. Sasser and Craig Roberts Marine Sniper-
Charles Henderson Authors Note:
In my haste of writing this, I may have gotten some minor facts mixed up, or in
the wrong place. Please contact me with the correct info if you have something
to add, or a correction. |
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xTippyx
Member Strike 1 - Poop Pic 1/10/06 Joined: 25 December 2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 592 |
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^^must we bring out the long sniping thread again snake??
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Snake6
Platinum Member Outranked by guitarguy? Joined: 11 September 2003 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 11229 |
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Yes, we must. |
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The_GOAT
Member What happened to my post count? Joined: 03 January 2006 Status: Offline Points: 0 |
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agreed
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SP Vision Imp w/ ALL NDZ internals, CP flame drop w/ on/off, Freak-AA tip, lowrise feedneck, NDZ Pro-Mag trigger, tapeworm, NDZ lpr cap, NDZ ti. bolt pin, maybe thats it?
EggII 88/4500 Crossfire |
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ionpride
Member Strike 1 - F-Bomb 2/28 Joined: 20 February 2006 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 359 |
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but why noone ever reads it ?
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im the closet thing that u will come to war !!!
SMART PARTS ION 3000/47 PURE ENRGY AIR DYE 03 STICKIES TEARDROP BARREL HALO B HOPPER |
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brat mann
Member Strike 2 - Idiot Joined: 14 July 2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 88 |
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Not to say your post was not well thought out (it was), but I do want to bring out a bit of termenological arguments as to the word "sniper" and the sport of paintball. First off, Paintball, understood as the woodsball variant, not the turnament ball varient, is meant to be SIMMALER to, but not exactely the same as war in all aspects. Now, these aspects range from how you move up, which is not done as properly as in the milatary, to temenology. Now, common termonology in paintball would have it that "SNIPER" means "SHARPSHOOTER". Now, the accuracy of this term depends widely upon which angle you look at it from. You could look at it from the prospective of a mariene, which would have it be incorrect due to your defenition. OR, you could look at it from the prospective of a paintball player, which would have it be a correct term, as paintball is supposed to be SIMMALER to war, but not EXACT, which entailes this term.
Point in simple, please don't bug this buy because he said "Sniper" and you think he meant "Sharpshooter". |
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CO/CA
Member Joined: 14 March 2006 Status: Offline Points: 3 |
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ok people, a paintball "sniper" is someone who sets up an ambush to silently take out opponents and is stealthy, they follow the motto "one shot, one kill" which gives them the sniper name, if you need any more info go to specialopspoaintball.com
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Nobody cares about threats over the internet.
Don't try to act hardcore with the keyboard. Fighting online is like racing in the special olympics; even if you win, you're still retarded. |
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Snake6
Platinum Member Outranked by guitarguy? Joined: 11 September 2003 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 11229 |
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Wow you cant even link right. Sorry, but your arguement doesn't hold water. Hell, I don't even know if that was an argument. The fact of the matter is this: Spec Ops is a buisiness. They are trying to make money, in order to make money they must sell you things. In order to sell their items they must come up with uses for them. Hence their "Paintball Position" charts and their "UBER 1337 5N1P3R" equipment. They don't care if what they are selling works effectively in paintball, they are trying to make a profit. This is the reason why I hate specops. They do not care about Paintball itself, they are just want to sell you a product so they can make money. Welcome to Marketing 101, congratulations I guess their marketing does work.
You, my friend need to take some English Classes. I am not bugging him because he said Sniper. I am stating a fact that it is physically impossible to be a sniper in the game of paintball. Yes, it is terminology problem but the thing is that most people don't think of it that way. As long as you cannot engage a high-value target with a single shot, from beyond the effective range of return fire, you are not a sniper. Its that simple. Any military sniper will agree with me on that. Therefore I refer to to my the above about marketing. Edited by Snake6 - 15 March 2006 at 8:09am |
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Ashdawg
Member Official Forum Drama Queen of the Night Joined: 01 February 2006 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 442 |
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in woodsball, everyone should strive to be a "sharp-shooter"!!!! That would be great! Imagine the possibilities...
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"Too close for missles, switching to guns..."
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CO/CA
Member Joined: 14 March 2006 Status: Offline Points: 3 |
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im not trying to link right, if someone wants to go there they can do it themselves, and i could really care less what most people think BUT there are some of us that like to use their positions and they work very well
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Nobody cares about threats over the internet.
Don't try to act hardcore with the keyboard. Fighting online is like racing in the special olympics; even if you win, you're still retarded. |
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rednekk98
Moderator Group Dead man... Joined: 02 July 2002 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 8995 |
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Then feel free to crawl back over there and stay put. People have posted crap from their site about sniping, and there's still absolutly nothing in it that makes it differ from a standard ambush. Sorry, spec ops isn't going to help this aregument at all. Sitting in the bushes with a ghillie suit and trying t make one shot kills at targets of opportunity is going to get you light up as soon as you do shoot, since you will be in range, and you'll probably miss anyways. I'll conceed that there are some scenarios that allow a person to fire on someone else in such a way as to prevent return fire, however, there's a differance between "sniping someone" as in taking a shot of opportunity from a concealed position which anyone can do and being a "sniper". Besides, special ops videos are blatantly staged. You really have to take their motives into account when you read their articles. I mean seriously, they trademarked the word "woodsball" how are they not trying to dominate the scenario market by whatever means necessary?
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txsniper
Member Joined: 16 March 2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 3 |
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Tippmann Pro-Carbine w/16" J&J Ceramic 95 feet 4 out of 5 everytime. Please get your facts striaght before putting down a marker or a product, and that was using Draxxus Rec Sport paint |
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RavenGuard
Gold Member Joined: 31 October 2005 Location: Canada Status: Offline Points: 1861 |
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... How are these people allowed to own weapons?
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Tippmann A-5
Polished Internals E-Grip Ape Board JCS Blade Trigger QEV 8" Bigshot + Apex Ricochet R-5 / Tac Cap Palmers Stabilizer 68/4500 Crossfire |
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