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carl_the_sniper View Drop Down
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    Posted: 09 September 2008 at 5:48pm
I am looking at buying a gaming desktop in the near future for around $2500 (could spend more, would prefer to spend much less).

I have no keyboard or monitor or anything so that budget needs to include everything.

I have a few questions that maybe the collective forum in their infinite computer wisdom can answer:

1) If I am correct, than dual core would be superior to quad core for gaming for the time being? How about if I want my computer to last 3 years?

I am looking at getting one custom built from scratch online. How do I choose a motherboard? How about a power supply? Do most motherboards include a sound card?

What specs should I be looking at for around that budget? Specifically things such as ram speed as I don't know much of what is good in that sense right now (for example: I was told that faster ram is more important than having more ram meomory) Should I just download more?

Hopefully that will make sense, I really don't have much time right now.

Thanks
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why would dual> quad?
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Originally posted by carl_the_sniper carl_the_sniper wrote:

I am looking at buying a gaming desktop in the near future for around $2500 (could spend more, would prefer to spend much less).

Lets see if I can work my magic.

I have no keyboard or monitor or anything so that budget needs to include everything.

For a monitor, I would suggest this one: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16824009 145. Thats the best bang for your buck 22" I found in about 5 seconds of searching.

I have a few questions that maybe the collective forum in their infinite computer wisdom can answer:

1) If I am correct, than dual core would be superior to quad core for gaming for the time being? How about if I want my computer to last 3 years?

Whoever told you "dual core > quad core" was smoking crack. It is true that most programs today cannot multi-thread worth a damn, but the fact that quad cores are so cheap now negates any argument against them. For a Processor, I would recommend a Q6600: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819115 018

I am looking at getting one custom built from scratch online. How do I choose a motherboard? How about a power supply? Do most motherboards include a sound card?

Don't waste your money on those "we build it for you" sites. A retard, if properly instructed could put a computer together. Choosing the parts is the hard part, not the actual assembly. For a motherboard I would suggest this one: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813136 055&Tpk=dfp%20jr. That board is MicroATX which means I will fit in almost any case, also because It is MicroATX you will have more room to work with in your case. Most motherboards include a sound card. There is really no reason to get an aftermarket sound card, unless your on-board card sounds like garbage. As far as a power supply I would suggest soemthing like this: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817153 059. I prefer modular cabling, and personally I think anything over 600w is overkill.

What specs should I be looking at for around that budget? Specifically things such as ram speed as I don't know much of what is good in that sense right now (for example: I was told that faster ram is more important than having more ram meomory) Should I just download more?

You want at least 4gb of RAM today. Right now, I would suggest DDR2 ram because DRR3 is not a very mature technology yet. This is the RAM I would buy: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820227 298

I hope to f'n god you were kidding about the "download more ram"...

Hopefully that will make sense, I really don't have much time right now.

Thanks


For a Hard Drive, I would suggest a 500gb SATA drive. Those can be gotten around $100.
DVD Burners are cheap, you can get a good one for about $40. Make sure you get a SATA model, not IDE. IDE is junk and outdated.
For graphics, I would suggest a HD4850. They run between $175-200.

So the total cost is about: $1100.

Note that I didn't include a keyboard, mouse, or case as those are personal preference things.


Edited by Snake6 - 09 September 2008 at 7:29pm
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Darur View Drop Down
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You build a very nice set-up for your budget, it depends entirely on if you want to overclock or not however.

Snake covered pretty much everything, just a few personal recommendations/extra bits of info here:

Motherboard:  Your chipset will only be key if your overclocking, otherwise go for the board that will support your components the best.  Personally I'd recommend either a X48 or P45, but you should overclock with those chipsets. The P45 is supposed to work better for quads when overclocking.

CPU: This will be determined by your chipset choice.  I'd definetely recommend a quad if your overclocking since it can be made to outperform the dualies with ease, if you are not its a bit of a toss up. The higher clocked dual cores may be more effective for your situtation but a quad offers much better future proofing. With your budget again I'd reccomend a newer 45nm quad which perform better then their 65nm predecessors.

RAM: DDR3 all the way. Prices are leveling out a lot and it offers much better performance to DDR2, most of the resentment towards it is just the overclocking community being reluctant to accept higher latencies.  4GB would be ideal, probably in the DDR3 1333 speed.

GPU: I'd highly reccomend an ATI 4870x2 which are outperforming anything out there right now.

PSU: I'm going to disagree with Snake here.  Using a 510w PSU myself I'm practically over capacity on my system which is much older.  In general parts get changed out but PSUs tend to stay.  Invest a bit more and pick up something in the 800-900w range, preffereabley from PC Power and Cooling, OCZ or Silverstone.

Hard drive: Same drive I always reccomend, WD 640GB Cavier, its a fine drive and no one is reporting failures that I can find. Plus at the prices they offer it, you can get a nice RAID 1 solution which offers not only redundency by greatly improved read speeds.

All in all that should come out under $2000 leaving room for a case, monitor and peripherals.  Its much closer to your total budget but thats a rig that will last for a long while to come.
 
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Darur, why are you suggesting something that high-end? For a casual gamer that is really overkill. Unless you are trying to run resolutions of like 1900x1200 there is no reason to go with the 4870x2. A 4850 is fine in

As far as the 65nm vs 45nm quads, I will throw my opinion in here. The Q9450 is the best bang for your buck 45nm quad out there, but it overclocks like ass-crack. If you not overclocking, it might be a good chip but as far as overclocking is concerned, the Q6600 or Q6700 is a much better choice. The only real advantage to the peryons is SSE4, which isn't really used yet.

My recommendation for the PSU was based on a casual gamer, not you or I. I run a 1000w personally but I am also running a 4870, RAID 5, etc.
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For us canucks, find everything you want to buy at www.tigerdirect.com

It's cheaper than anywhere else I've tried.
A second class drive is always better than a first class walk.

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carl_the_sniper View Drop Down
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Originally posted by Snake6 Snake6 wrote:



Originally posted by carl_the_sniper carl_the_sniper wrote:

I am looking at buying a gaming desktop in the near future for around $2500 (could spend more, would prefer to spend much less).

<span style="color: rgb(255, 0, 0);">Lets see if I can work my magic.</span>I have no keyboard or monitor or anything so that budget needs to include everything.
<span style="color: rgb(255, 0, 0);">For a monitor, I would suggest this one: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16824009 145. Thats the best bang for your buck 22" I found in about 5 seconds of searching.</span>
I have a few questions that maybe the collective forum in their infinite computer wisdom can answer:

1) If I am correct, than dual core would be superior to quad core for gaming for the time being? How about if I want my computer to last 3 years?
<span style="color: rgb(255, 0, 0);">Whoever told you "dual core > quad core" was smoking crack. It is true that most programs today cannot multi-thread worth a damn, but the fact that quad cores are so cheap now negates any argument against them. For a Processor, I would recommend a Q6600: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819115 018 </span>
I am looking at getting one custom built from scratch online. How do I choose a motherboard? How about a power supply? Do most motherboards include a sound card?
<span style="color: rgb(255, 0, 0);">Don't waste your money on those "we build it for you" sites. A retard, if properly instructed could put a computer together. Choosing the parts is the hard part, not the actual assembly. For a motherboard I would suggest this one:</span><a style="" href="http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16 813136055&Tpk=dfp%20jr"> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813136 055&Tpk=dfp%20jr</a><span style="color: rgb(255, 0, 0);">. That board is MicroATX which means I will fit in almost any case, also because It is MicroATX you will have more room to work with in your case. Most motherboards include a sound card. There is really no reason to get an aftermarket sound card, unless your on-board card sounds like garbage. As far as a power supply I would suggest soemthing like this: </span><a style="" href="http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16 813136055&Tpk=dfp%20jr"> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817153 059</a><span style="color: rgb(255, 0, 0);">. I prefer modular cabling, and personally I think anything over 600w is overkill. </span>
What specs should I be looking at for around that budget? Specifically things such as ram speed as I don't know much of what is good in that sense right now (for example: I was told that faster ram is more important than having more ram meomory) Should I just download more?
<span style="color: rgb(255, 0, 0);">You want at least 4gb of RAM today. Right now, I would suggest DDR2 ram because DRR3 is not a very mature technology yet. This is the RAM I would buy:</span> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820227 298<span style="color: rgb(255, 0, 0);">I hope to f'n god you were kidding about the "download more ram"...</span>
Hopefully that will make sense, I really don't have much time right now.

Thanks
For a Hard Drive, I would suggest a 500gb SATA drive. Those can be gotten around $100.DVD Burners are cheap, you can get a good one for about $40. Make sure you get a SATA model, not IDE. IDE is junk and outdated.For graphics, I would suggest a HD4850. They run between $175-200.So the total cost is about: $1100.Note that I didn't include a keyboard, mouse, or case as those are personal preference things.


-Can't shop on newegg in canada but isin't 5ms too low anyways?

-It's not that I heard dual>quad, it's just that games can't take advantage of quad right now so the better value is in dual. I can get a 3.16 dual core for the price of a 2.6 quad core from most places. (which would I be better with?) AMD or intel? The AMD quad cores seem to have higher bus speed and are less money but are they any good?

-For the most part I am looking for advice on how I would go about picking a motherboard. (I have no clue what to look for). "we build it for you sites" may be my best option since I have no place to solder here really. (Don't you need to solder processors to motherboards or something?) Otherwise, I would love to build my own since I allready have a somewhat basic idea of how it all works.

-The second link is corrupted but I can't use newegg anyways... so anything over 600 watts is a waste in your opinion?

-I was kidding about downloading ram. I'll probably go with something like that.

-Should I look for a 10K rpm+ drive?

-That is a really good price. I will definately consider doing that. My only problem with that is having no warranty.

Thanks

Originally posted by Darur Darur wrote:

You build a very nice set-up for your budget, it depends entirely on if you want to overclock or not however.Snake covered pretty much everything, just a few personal recommendations/extra bits of info here:Motherboard:  Your chipset will only be key if your overclocking, otherwise go for the board that will support your components the best.  Personally I'd recommend either a X48 or P45, but you should overclock with those chipsets. The P45 is supposed to work better for quads when overclocking.CPU: This will be determined by your chipset choice.  I'd definetely recommend a quad if your overclocking since it can be made to outperform the dualies with ease, if you are not its a bit of a toss up. The higher clocked dual cores may be more effective for your situtation but a quad offers much better future proofing. With your budget again I'd reccomend a newer 45nm quad which perform better then their 65nm predecessors.RAM: DDR3 all the way. Prices are leveling out a lot and it offers much better performance to DDR2, most of the resentment towards it is just the overclocking community being reluctant to accept higher latencies.  4GB would be ideal, probably in the DDR3 1333 speed.GPU: I'd highly reccomend an ATI 4870x2 which are outperforming anything out there right now.PSU: I'm going to disagree with Snake here.  Using a 510w PSU myself I'm practically over capacity on my system which is much older.  In general parts get changed out but PSUs tend to stay.  Invest a bit more and pick up something in the 800-900w range, preffereabley from PC Power and Cooling, OCZ or Silverstone.Hard drive: Same drive I always reccomend, WD 640GB Cavier, its a fine drive and no one is reporting failures that I can find. Plus at the prices they offer it, you can get a nice RAID 1 solution which offers not only redundency by greatly improved read speeds.All in all that should come out under $2000 leaving room for a case, monitor and peripherals.  Its much closer to your total budget but thats a rig that will last for a long while to come. 


-I am unsure about overclocking. I have tried it before to little success but would give it another shot for sure. I would prefer to not do it at all though.

-I don't know how to tell if my motherboard will support my components.

-I've been looking at the 4870 X2 a lot but it is expensive. Is there really any point of allocating extra money for a better graphics card if the processor is going to slow it down anyways?

-Ok... well I might go a bit higher on the power supply then. They aren't that much more money anyways to upgrade.

Snake: I am buying this desktop for orgasgaming not casual gaming. I just don't have an extreme budget for it.

Thor: tigerdirect works nicely for me because their stores are so close to where my parents live.

Edited by carl_the_sniper - 10 September 2008 at 10:16am
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Again, don't get a WD hard drive.
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I would suggest getting 16 gigs of St. Louis Ram.
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DON'T FORGET YOU CAN SAVE MONEY IF YOU GO SMALL ON THE RAM AND JUST DOWNLOAD MORE AFTER YOU BUILD THE COMPUTER.
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Anyone here remember SoftRAM? More RAM on a floppy...

Carl, you do not need to solder the processor to the
motherboard. The hardest thing about building your own
system is matching up the case wiring to the
motherboard, and that's not really hard at all. Build
your own, and save some $$ or get more for your $$...

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Originally posted by High Voltage High Voltage wrote:

Again, don't get a WD hard drive.


Why? I have no problems with my WD external.
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Snake, In general I agree with you, however when you say your building a gaming computer very seldom do you mean casual gaming.

Carl, 
I just showed you how to tell if a board will work for you.
Things that matter:
- Chipset (P45 or X48)
- RAM standard (DDR3, doesn't matter which speed necessarily)
- Number of PCI-E 2.0 lanes (2 is ideal, but you only need 1)
- Number of SATA connectors (depending on how many hard drives you want)

Other then that most of it is personal preference.  I will disagree with snake here again and recommend against microATX. Unless the particular board is being well noted for its cost to performance, or you need a smaller form factor, its usually wise to stick to the standard ATX.

If you don't feel good about overclocking then its very easy to avoid it. Avoid botique motherboards loaded to the top with overclocking tools and crap, get something simple. Stay away from the higher end DDR3 and get something cheaper from G.Skill or Patriot or whatever is reasonabley cheap. Its all up to you, but you only need to pick out the hardware you want now, you don't necessarliy need to decide to overclock now. I'm definetely not reccomending it if you don't feel comfertable with it.

As for your other questions:
AMD quads are performing nearer to Intel Quads with every generation, however they lag behind by a bit still.  Its not a case of speeds, its how the arcitecture works. The bus speed isn't really relevant in your case.

Building a computer is like building something with legos, you just stick the pointy ends in the right holes.  No soldering, limited thinking unless you need to be cognizant enough to remember not to eat the parts.
 
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my opinion on AMD vs Intel is, if your going budget, get AMD, if your going to spend enough to where you could be buying a core2, then intel is probably your bet.

however, in all honesty the cpu is not as important as the gpu for gaming purposes.
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Dude, buy the components. *I* can put together a working pc, so you can definately do it.

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im thoroughly pleased with my 280gtx, running crysis at 1900/1200 every setting on ultra high and AAx2 with 40 fps...its ridiculous
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Originally posted by carl_the_sniper carl_the_sniper wrote:

I am looking at buying a gaming desktop in the near future for around $2500 (could spend more, would prefer to spend much less).

I have no keyboard or monitor or anything so that budget needs to include everything.

I have a few questions that maybe the collective forum in their infinite computer wisdom can answer:

1) If I am correct, than dual core would be superior to quad core for gaming for the time being? How about if I want my computer to last 3 years?

When multi-core processors came out there was a big debate over whether it was worth it to go with more cores or a single high-speed core. The argument was that programs were not designed to take advantage of multiple cores working simultaneously so they would effectively be using just one of the cores at any given time. For that reason, the only difference between a dual-core or single core chip as far as that application is concerned is the clock speed. However, dual-core chips hit the market years ago now and programs are designed to make use of them now (most of them anyway). Newer games like Crysis are designed to make use of the cores so it probably does make sense to go for the extra cores, especially since you can always overclock to up speeds. And if you want this thing to be good for 3 years, go with the extra cores. Multi-core support will only be on the rise and I think you'd be shooting yourself in the foot by going with a dual-core with quads priced so low.

I am looking at getting one custom built from scratch online. How do I choose a motherboard? How about a power supply? Do most motherboards include a sound card?

As Darur said, you want to look at the chipset if you plan on overclocking. Intel chipsets tend to be pretty solid though the newer Nvidia ones aren't too bad (680i and newer). If you don't care much about overclocking then just look at what processors and RAM is supported and make sure it will work with the CPU and RAM you plan on using. A good site will list everything the board supports in the specs but you can also look it up on the manufacturer's site. Socket type is important but also make sure that it lists your processor because, for example, you can find socket 775 boards that quad core chips can fit on but the BIOS (software on the motherboard) does not support quad cores. Sometimes a BIOS update will add support but if it didn't ship with that update then you'll either have to use another processor until you can flash your board or send it in to be flashed, either way it's a hassle. Nearly all boards come with some sort of integrated audio now but read the specs anyway just to make sure.


Power supplies are very important, don't go cheap there. You don't have to buy one that can power your whole neighborhood but don't get a weak one either. A power supply can be useful for a good 5 years easily if you get a good one so pick one that is high quality and has decent power output so you don't have to worry about it when you build your next computer. The comanies Darur mentioned are good options and you can also check out the X-connect series from Ultra if you like the idea of modular cabling. I have used Ultra PSU's quite a bit in the last few years and had good luck with them so far. As for power ratings, the amount of power you need depends on the hardware. For a cheap desktop that isn't meant for gaming you can get away with 300-400w. However, when you start adding in extra hard drives, quad-core CPU's, and beastly video cards, you need a ton of extra power and signal quality is important for overclocking. Both will cost you extra money. For this machine, I would get as much power as possible but you would probably be fine in the 800w area. But like I said, the more the better.

What specs should I be looking at for around that budget? Specifically things such as ram speed as I don't know much of what is good in that sense right now (for example: I was told that faster ram is more important than having more ram meomory) Should I just download more?

That's only true to an extent. Speed and capacity need to be balanced, both are important in different situations. With an XP system I recommend about 2GB for a gaming system. XP runs best with 1GB or more of memory and then your game will also need some for which that extra 1GB should be sufficient. That said, you could have 100GB of RAM but if it's extremely slow your performance will still suck. Get the fastest RAM you can get 2GB of. If you're using Vista then you'll probably want to have 4GB of RAM. DDR3 is fast but still a bit pricey since it's fairly new. The RAM itself will cost more and so will a motherboard that supports it. The performance gain isn't tremendous according to the tests I've seen (may have improved a little since then) but it's your money so you decide if it's worth it. I wouldn't spend big bucks for better latency because it doesn't make a huge difference and you probably wouldn't even notice it unless you overclocked significantly.

Hopefully that will make sense, I really don't have much time right now.

Thanks


I'm judging by the budget that you want a pretty serious gaming computer but it's hard to tell exactly how powerful of a system you need because different games have different needs. Some people just play things like WOW which even a crappy video card can handle while others want to max out Crysis or other new games that need the latest hardware. Here's a build that I would recommend but you may need to revise certain things.

Motherboard
Asus P5Q $119
It's a nice, cheap board with a good feature list. I've had good experience with Asus and I actually just bought this board for a computer I built my friend. It uses an Intel P45 chipset and supports pretty much any processor worth using on socket 775 and then some. The only limitations are that you can't use multiple video cards or DDR3 but there are other versions of this board supporting both.

or

Asus P5Q3 Deluxe $209.99
The sexier version of the first board. Supports DDR3 and multiple video cards among other things but it'll cost you a little more.

CPU
Intel Q6600 $188.50
If you want something that'll last you a few years, this is your chip. It's good at stock speeds and even better overclocked should you find it lacking later on. The fact that it has 4 cores will help you run multiple applications simultaneously and it'll drastically increase speed in multi-threaded applications.

Memory
2GB OCZ Gold Gamer eXtreme XTC $49.80
Not the absolute fastest you can get but it's probably a good deal cheaper than the best DDR2 and won't sacrifice any noticeable amounts of performance. Get 4GB if you're going with Vista.

or

2GB OCZ DDR3 $136
Also not the fastest DDR3 you can get but it's about twice the bandwidth of the DDR2 I recommended. I picked this because it'll let you compare them more easily; twice the bandwidth, nearly 3 times the cost, not necessarily twice the performance. It depends greatly on the game whether or not you'll see an improvement over DDR2. It could be significant, unnoticeable, or somewhere in between. If you want, you can look for benchmarks online and see if you can find tests that show performance change between the two memory types. Last I checked, it wasn't $100 worth of change in my opinion (even more counting the money for the better mobo). Again, you're call here.

PSU
OCZ GameXstream 1010w $159.99
This is basically a nicer looking version of a PC Power & Cooling PSU without the hefty price tag. PCP&C makes PSU's for OCZ so you are basically getting the same thing but cheaper. With 1010w you shouldn't have a problem powering anything even with a fully loaded system. It also doesn't seem to be abnormally long like a lot of high-output PSU's are so you won't have fitment issues.

Video Card
HIS Radeon HD 4850 512MB $179.99
Pretty good video card that should be able to handle most games maxed out and won't cost you an arm and a leg. You can even get two and put them in Crossfire for a good boost in performance. It may not scale linearly so you might not see exactly twice the performance but it will likely be a significant gain. I ran two 7600 gs's in SLI for a while and it was pretty good for a while and cheaper than a single card of similar performance at the time. I eventually got an 8800GTS 320MB because I wanted the extra performance and DX10 capability but at this point, it seems like AMD is back in the game and Nvidia may not be your best choice. I'm also liking crossfire more now that it has developed. Crossfire allows multiple cards like SLI but with less limitations.

or

Diamond Radeon HD 4870x2 2GB $529.99
Simply put, it's a beast. It'll spank most cards out there and even beats Nvidia's latest. That said, it's clearly not cheap. You may be able to get similar performance from two 4850's. Heck, if you could fit 3 of them on your board then that would be about the same price and may even beat the 4870x2.

Hard Drive
Western Digital Caviar SE16 640GB $82.90
Plenty of space and if you want speed then you can get two and put them in a RAID array. RAID 0 is good for read/write speed without sacrificing storage space, RAID 1 is good for read speed and data security but you get half the storage space. RAID 0 is the most common for gamers.

Case
Cooler Master Centurion 590 $69.99
Case is mostly personal preference. This will let you use an ATX motherboard like the ones I picked for you as well as micro ATX and has space for plenty of fans. That's basically all you have to look for in a case; mobo specs (ATX, micro ATX, etc.) and cooling options. Antec makes some good stuff too.

Monitor
Hanns-G 22" Wide $221.99
This one has decent specs. For a monitor you want to look for a high contrast ratio, low response time, high resolution, and high brightness. The specs on this monitor are pretty much what you want.

Keyboard & Mouse
Microsoft wired combo $20.99

or

Logitech Deluxe 660 $29.99
Wireless if you'd rather have that.

Total: $1093.15

Add on shipping/tax and that's your real total. I used the cheapest options for that price so it'll be more expensive if you go with DDR3 or the better video card but that's a good base line.
oreomann33: Everybody invades Poland

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DzXs View Drop Down
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2 strike, language, 1/17

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Points: 391 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DzXs Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 September 2008 at 5:37pm
any 512 card is too slow for todays games...
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Strike 1 - 7/29, Bad Linky

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Points: 11259 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote carl_the_sniper Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 September 2008 at 6:52pm
Ok, I have decided that I am most likely going to build one.

What about cooling?

Anything else that hasn't been mentioned?

Darur: I wouldn't mind being able to max out crysis

I kinda built one that I am looking at let me know what you think...

Asus p5qc motherboard

Ati radeon 4870X2

Quad core q9400 2.66 ghz

(is upgrading to a 3ghz worth the extra $200?)

22" 2ms monitor

4 gigs of ddr3 ram

WD hard drive 300gb 10K rpm

Nice case with 800 watt psu

(is 800 watts enough? does it come with leds?... don't make fun of me)

Would that work together? Any places where I should be buying something extra or places where I am spending extra money uselessly?

Also note that everything is more expensive in Canada.
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High Voltage View Drop Down
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Fire in the disco

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Points: 14179 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote High Voltage Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 September 2008 at 7:16pm
Originally posted by pntbl freak pntbl freak wrote:

Originally posted by High Voltage High Voltage wrote:

Again, don't get a WD hard drive.


Why? I have no problems with my WD external.

GOOD FOR YOU. MY 500GB INTERNAL CAVIAR DRIVE DIED ON ME, AND NOT IN A NICE MANNER EITHER. I THINK IT LASTED ALL OF A YEAR PLUS A MONTH? THE REST OF MY DRIVES, EXCLUDING THE 1TB HITACHI, ARE 3 TIMES OLDER AND STILL RUNNING FINE.
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