Gun control |
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Clark Kent
Platinum Member Joined: 02 July 2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 8716 |
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Another random slogan... Some people spend too much time on the NRA website, and not enough time thinking originally. Now all we need is somebody to say "Guns don't kill people. People kill people."
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Darur
Platinum Member Stare directly into my avatar... Joined: 03 May 2003 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 9178 |
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Right, but until the slogan's point has been dissproven it still applies, true? |
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Real Men play Tuba
[IMG]http://img89.imageshack.us/img89/1859/newsmall6xz.jpg"> PH33R TEH 1337 Dwarf! DONT CLICK ME!!1 |
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Clark Kent
Platinum Member Joined: 02 July 2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 8716 |
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There are oh so many things wrong with this. You appear to believe that a gun is the only difference between helping and not helping. Both parts of that are problematic. You can help with a cell phone. You can help by yelling loudly. You can help by noting the plate number. If you need to satisfy your machismo, you can help by rasslin' the guy to the ground. You can help by following in your car, or in a cab (and you get to yell "follow that car!"). And so on, depending on the particulars of the situation. If you had a gun, would you go charging in? Sounds like the situation was quite ambiguous, and you were far away. Do you plan on taking pot shots at 200 feet with a pistol, into a potential hostage situation with bystanders? Do you plan on shooting before you fully understand the situtation? Do you plan on running across the street with gun drawn in public (which might get you shot by another vigilante, in a cruel twist of fate)? Would you try to confront the guy, now having found your courage, and try to outdraw him, old West style, if he has a shootin' iron too? What exactly do you expect to accomplish with your gun in this scenario? Here's what this sounds like to me: Father sees questionable situation, and doesn't have the gumption to do anything about it. Not wanting to appear weak in front of his kid, daddy pulls off a lame line about "son, I wouda helpt her, but I don't got my gun." Fact is, most of the best ways to "help" in this situation have absolutely nothing to do with guns, and everything to do with brains, eyes, quick decisions, and perhaps a cell phone. Some people like to augment their testicles with firearms. While they are certainly welcome to do so, that doesn't mean that guns are as important as some people think they are.
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636andy636
Moderator Group Joined: 30 November 2002 Location: Canada Status: Offline Points: 5891 |
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your telling me you seen a kid napping happen and did not try and stop it. yeesh. if i seen that happening and i had no protection i would still check that out. because i would at least trying to prevent that. or run in and go to the clerk and ask for the bat behind the counter... |
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Clark Kent
Platinum Member Joined: 02 July 2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 8716 |
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Nope. These slogans haven't met their prima facie case. They are nonsense until somebody provides some evidence of legitimacy. Example: "If you can read this, you aren't the President" Does that make you feel like you have to now prove that Bush can read? Of course not - it's a stupid slogan. Same thing goes for most everything the NRA is responsible for.
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Darur
Platinum Member Stare directly into my avatar... Joined: 03 May 2003 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 9178 |
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Well, the Hitler one technically isnt a slogan and it is true in that he said that . . . Ah crap, I'm proving your point, right? |
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Real Men play Tuba
[IMG]http://img89.imageshack.us/img89/1859/newsmall6xz.jpg"> PH33R TEH 1337 Dwarf! DONT CLICK ME!!1 |
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Clark Kent
Platinum Member Joined: 02 July 2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 8716 |
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:)
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Slothbutt
Platinum Member Cant find the short bus Joined: 10 June 2002 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 2617 |
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How many rapes are there every year?
How many of those women own cell phones? |
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Homer J
Member Strike 2 for drug related images Joined: 22 March 2003 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 4673 |
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Let's say your wife and children are upstairs sleeping. What are you going to do when someone breaks into your house, wielding a machete, and is high on PCP? Call the cops? Reason with him? Accept your "fate" (and decide your family's fate at the same time)? Keep in mind, stabbing him likely won't faze him, he's so out of it.
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Clark Kent
Platinum Member Joined: 02 July 2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 8716 |
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First - Bizzarrely unlikely. Do you also walk around with a lightning rod strapped to your back, just in case lightning strikes? Second - There are non-gun preventative measures. Phones in the bathroom (so that after you yell out, your wife can call the cops locked in the bathroom), alarm systems, non-gun weaponry, reinforced doors, etc. Third - Even if you had a gun: Are you sitting downstairs, awake, gun in hand, keeping watch all night while your family is sleeping? That gun does you no good unless it is in your hand, and you are awake and alert to fire it. And even then you still might end up chop suey. The whole "must defend family from home invaders" generally creates the false idea that you are (a) helpless without a gun, and (b) invincible with a gun. Neither are true. In some cases, I would suggest that a gun is even a hindrance rather than an aid. As I said above, if you want to enhance your testicles with firearms, be my guest. If you actually want to improve your safety situation, a more comprehensive and rational approach should be taken. |
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Zesty
Platinum Member Guested - 3 Strikes and hes out Joined: 05 October 2002 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 6050 |
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I keep a 12guage shotgun leaning against the wall by the bed where I sleep.
The magazine tube holds 8 rounds with one in the chamber, but I just keep the magazine full. If I hear something that wakens me, and it sounds like anything out of the ordinary, I reach over, rack my shotgun, and stay silent. If I hear some more commotion, I may go out to check what's up, but most likely I'm gonna sit and listen. Basically, I live about 5 miles out of town, and your suggestion of using a phone in place of a gun truly made me laugh! You are speaking with a closed mind...you sound like some neighborhood watch man that feels his whole block is safe because you look out your window every hour. If the prior scenario comes down to an intruder entering my house, armed, looking to take my property or life, I personally don't want to rely on the speedy service of my local law enforcement! If you want to, that's fine. But I would prefer to rely on my Winchester Defender and 8 shots of double-ott rather than some donut-dunking pig that doesn't give a crap about anything but going home to HIS family at the end of the night. |
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Clark Kent
Platinum Member Joined: 02 July 2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 8716 |
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I should clarify further. Are there situations where a gun is the appropriate safety tool? Clearly. If I lived in the boonies, I would certainly have numerous firearms handy. No doubt. But most people don't live in the boonies. And even so, most people vastly overestimate the effectiveness of guns for home protection. You keep your shotgun by the bed - would you keep the loaded gun there if you had a 6-year-old wandering around at night? Most people with small children keep their guns at least tucked away, which reduces their effectiveness. Most people are sleeping at night, which further reduces the effectiveness of the gun. Most people are under covers, in the dark, and generally not alert, all of which reduces the effectiveness of the gun. I am in no way saying that guns are useless for home defense, or even that there aren't times when they are the best solution. What I AM saying is that many people vastly overestimate their utility, as aptly demonstrated by the example earlier in this thread about not intervening in a potential abduction because "I didn't have my gun". Most people have a very unrealistic picture of how something like this would actually go down, and are living in some John Wayne fantasy. That is my point. And as to weapons, there are other choices than guns. While firearms are clearly the most effective weapon available to most folks, it is TOO effective, to the point where it has to be locked up, and may cause collateral damage, which reduces their utility. A good knife, for instance, is not nearly the weapon that a gun is, but a knife is more likely to be handy than a gun, and a knife in hand is better than a gun in rack. A knife is also less likely to accidentally kill the guy in the guest room, so you can use it without worrying about backstop issues. I always have a knife in a pocket - do you carry a gun all day in your house? I am not advocating that knives are "better" than guns - I am simply suggesting that "it ain't that simple". Clearly, yes - in a deathmatch with an intruder I would love to have a gun. But home invasions aren't like that - they don't call ahead. |
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whoknowswho
Member Joined: 08 September 2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 411 |
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That is the most pointless argument. If we outlaw everything that could hurt you if misused, then forks, lawn mowers, paintball markers, books, spoons, sticks, rocks, paper, metal objects, cars, letter openers, glass, computers, hands, feet, food, beer, gasoline, doors, shoes, shoe laces, magic markers, coins, trees, fences, crayons, firecrackers, and everything else I forgot would need to be outlawed to keep us safe. BTW, I think both Zesty and Clark Kent have valid points. Hunting, sport shooting, target competitions, all of these are situations in which firearms are needed. Also, a gun usually provides a great deterrent and helps prevent crimes. I think that firearms are a useful tool. No amount of laws will prevent gun crime. Just take a look at Australia. They have really benefitted from banning firearms. I do think that laws are necessary though. There is no reason for anyone to have a fully automatic weapon in their personal collection. Laws should be strictly enforced with NO leeway. Edited by whoknowswho |
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Bunkered
Platinum Member What AM I smoking? Joined: 10 June 2002 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 5708 |
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Clark, how about this slogan:
Guns don't kill people... I kill people. Name that movie. |
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Clark Kent
Platinum Member Joined: 02 July 2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 8716 |
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UHF Gotta do better than that... :) |
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Bunkered
Platinum Member What AM I smoking? Joined: 10 June 2002 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 5708 |
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Hrm. I was thinking Happy Gilmore (his old boss's t-shirt), but whatever. They probably stole it from the one you named.
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tippmannboy2
Member I don’t believe in Karma. I just don’t. Joined: 06 April 2003 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 503 |
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OK Most of the anti gun arguments are from people that have never shot a gun or been in a situation when you needed one. I carry a .22 pistol in my truck and under my matress when im not in the truck. The gun is unloaded,magizine is not in, and the action is open. That gun has never been pointed at anybody and probably never will but it makes my mom feel safer and I. I dont live in the "boonies" (well kinda) but I do live where ALOT of break ins and robberies happen. If somebody is stealing inside my house they certianly will get a leg full of lead. I dont want to kill anybody. I wont kill any one unless my life or the life of a loved one is certianly at risk. I shoot guns every saturday for fun and hunt with guns. I also hunt bows. If they outlaw guns only outlaws will have them. I personaly dont care if they do outlaw them. I always have and always will own multiple firearms. |
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Long Live The Confederacy
I am an AMERICAN AND IM PROUD OF IT! |
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WGP guy
Gold Member Quoted F and S bomb. Joined: 14 August 2004 Location: Lao People’s Dem. Rep. Status: Offline Points: 1333 |
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Dune
Platinum Member <placeholder> Joined: 05 February 2004 Status: Offline Points: 4347 |
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Just the same old rhetoric of "we must protect ourselves." Being an officer and someone who uses guns daily, I don't like the thought of just anyone having a gun with them, and we do not have tight enough legislation currently that makes me feel safer. |
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Clark Kent
Platinum Member Joined: 02 July 2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 8716 |
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I forgot about that t-shirt... another great movie. In UHF there was a mini-commercial with grumpy old guy telling the camera this fine slogan... |
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