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What are your thoughts on DUI check point
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Hysteria View Drop Down
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Originally posted by Susan Storm Susan Storm wrote:


This is the #2 reason why drunk drivers are so incredibly dangerous - their alcohol-induced self-confidence (which in some people apparently carries over to their sober state).

Congratulations, Hysteria - you are a menace to society.



For one, I do not drive "drunk".  Would it be over the legal limit?  Sure, but studies have been done that show talking on a cell phone is worse than driving with a .08 BAC.  Not only this, my driving ability has nothing to do with self-confidence.  When I drive after drinking any amount, I drive slower, I keep it between the lines 100% of the time (when driving sober on the back roads I drive down I often drive over the line around easy turns and whatnot), I wear my seatbelt (again, don't do this a lot of the s time sober), I brake slower and more carefully, I turn slower, et cetera. 

I am glad to know that driving slightly intoxicated at four in the morning down back roads on which I never see anyone is bad enough to put me in a group with child molesters and rapists.

Edit*  Haha, woops.  I deleted my post so I could add the top paragraph without editing and it messed everything up.  Susan's response to this is on the last page.

Edited by Hysteria - 05 December 2007 at 3:24pm
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Originally posted by Susan Storm Susan Storm wrote:

Originally posted by Hysteria Hysteria wrote:

Originally posted by Susan Storm Susan Storm wrote:

Congratulations, Hysteria - you are a menace to society.


I am glad to know that driving slightly intoxicated at four in the morning down back roads on which I never see anyone is bad enough to put me in a group with child molesters and rapists.

I am quite sure that is not what I said.  But now that you suggested it, I'll go ahead and agree.

So yes - you are a menace to society.  Death by drunk driver is a much - MUCH - more common disaster in this country than death by child molesters or rapists.

While drunk drivers may not be as evil as rapists, they are far more dangerous.  Your casual attitude about engaging in publicly reckless behavior is downright awful.

The US is embarassingly behind on this.  Many other countries have punishments that fit the crime - in many countries DUI carries a lengthy jail sentence and huge fines, even if nobody gets hurt.  Heck, there are even a couple of countries, I believe, where DUI carries the death penalty.

I got paged because of your delete...    :)

As to driving only "a little" drunk - while you are looking at studies, check out the ones that show that even a single drink drastically inhibits your reaction times and motor control.  Another common myth among drunk drivers is that you have to be "really drunk" to be dangerous.

Is the 0.3 BAC guy more impaired than the 0.08 BAC guy?  Sure - but this isn't a contest.  Even after a single drink you are dangerously impaired.

 



Edited by Susan Storm - 05 December 2007 at 3:26pm
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Originally posted by Susan Storm Susan Storm wrote:

I am quite sure that is not what I said.  But now that you suggested it, I'll go ahead and agree.

So yes - you are a menace to society.  Death by drunk driver is a much - MUCH - more common disaster in this country than death by child molesters or rapists.

While drunk drivers may not be as evil as rapists, they are far more dangerous.  Your casual attitude about engaging in publicly reckless behavior is downright awful.

The US is embarassingly behind on this.  Many other countries have punishments that fit the crime - in many countries DUI carries a lengthy jail sentence and huge fines, even if nobody gets hurt.  Heck, there are even a couple of countries, I believe, where DUI carries the death penalty.

As to driving only "a little" drunk - while you are looking at studies, check out the ones that show that even a single drink drastically inhibits your reaction times and motor control.  Another common myth among drunk drivers is that you have to be "really drunk" to be dangerous.

Is the 0.3 BAC guy more impaired than the 0.08 BAC guy?  Sure - but this isn't a contest.  Even after a single drink you are dangerously impaired.


Sure, you didn't originally come out and say that I was as bad as rapists and what not, but you did call me a menace to society, which they are.  Then again, you did agree after I brought it up, so it doesn't matter.

Are you kidding me?  A single drink drastically inhibits motor functions? Inhibits?  Sure, but drastically?  I think that is a bit drastic.

So you agree with the heftier fines and jail time for drunk driving because of the potential it has to kill people?  By that mentality we should outlaw unhealthy foods because they can kill people too.  Outlaw guns because they can be used to kill people.  We should outlaw computers because sitting here on my rump will make me unhealthy and that also has the potential to kill me.
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"Drastic" was a rather unscientific choice of words on my part - I'll go with the more specific "significant".

A quick visit to Google provided this article (and there are many, many more):  http://pubs.niaaa.nih.gov/publications/aa25.htm

Originally posted by NIH Study NIH Study wrote:

Low to moderate BAC's (0.03 to 0.05 percent) interfere with voluntary eye movements, impairing the eye's ability to rapidly track a moving target.

Steering is a complex psychomotor task in which alcohol effects on eye-to-hand reaction time are superimposed upon the visual effects described above. Significant impairment in steering ability may begin as low as approximately 0.035 percent BAC and rises as BAC increases.

...

Research on the effects of alcohol on performance by both auto-mobile and aircraft operators shows a narrowing of the attentional field beginning at approximately 0.04 percent BAC

...

Results of numerous studies indicate that divided attention deficits occur as low as 0.02 percent BAC

...

radio communication during simulated flight was impaired significantly by divided attention deficit at BAC's as low as 0.04 percent.

...

A review of six ground-traffic simulator studies demonstrated consistently poorer performance at BAC's of 0.048 percent and above

...

Serious errors increased significantly at the lowest BAC, 0.025 percent, compared with performance at 0 percent BAC

...

investigators have not found an absolute BAC threshold below which there is no impairment of any kind. Certain skills important for driving are impaired at 0.01 to 0.02 percent BAC, the lowest levels that can be measured reliably by commonly used devices

The science is pretty solid.  Even after one drink you are in trouble.

Your comparisons to unhealthy foods and computers are silly and useless.

I frankly don't care if you go and kill yourself driving drunk - but I care a whole lot that you might kill somebody else.  Yes, we regulate recklessly dangerous behavior in this country, when it is dangerous to others - as we should.  This is a primary function of laws.  And drunk driving isn't just a little dangerous - it is a LOT dangerous.  In the US, almost 40% of all traffic deaths are alcohol related to some extent.  That's a pretty big deal, and not a theoretical bogeyman.

Or, to put it differently - living next to a drunk driver is a lot more dangerous than living next to a rapist or child molester.



Edited by Susan Storm - 05 December 2007 at 4:03pm
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First time I have disagreed with you in this thread Susan:

Drinking one drink will not put MOST people in the range of dangerously impaired.

Oh and as you go higher in an aircraft, the effects of being drunk will exponentially increase. A statistic on alcohol on flying has little to do with drunk driving when we are talking about small amounts of alcohol.

Histeria:

Quote So you agree with the heftier fines and jail time for drunk driving because of the potential it has to kill people? By that mentality we should outlaw unhealthy foods because they can kill people too. Outlaw guns because they can be used to kill people. We should outlaw computers because sitting here on my rump will make me unhealthy and that also has the potential to kill me.


No, fast foods can only be used to kill yourself. Drunk driving can kill others. So what is your point because they are different mentalities?

Unless your comnputer is wired to a death ray, you are only endangering yourself.

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Originally posted by carl_the_sniper carl_the_sniper wrote:


Drinking one drink will not put MOST people in the range of dangerously impaired.

Obviously, all things are relative, and more drinking is more dangerous than less drinking, but I note this from the article I linked above:

Originally posted by Article Article wrote:

Certain skills important for driving are impaired at 0.01 to 0.02 percent BAC, the lowest levels that can be measured reliably by commonly used devices

If you aren't getting 0.01 from one drink, you are too fat to fit in a car.
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Originally posted by Hysteria Hysteria wrote:

And yes, I do drive better when I am intoxicated because I am more careful and more aware of my surroundings.


How many times does this need to be proven wrong before people stop saying it?
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Originally posted by Hysteria Hysteria wrote:

Sure, but studies have been done that show talking on a cell phone is worse than driving with a .08 BAC.


This is true, but I can always hang up my cellphone if I see traffic is getting unruly.

You, however, cannot snap your fingers and un-drunk yourself.
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Originally posted by Man Bites Dog Man Bites Dog wrote:


Originally posted by Hysteria Hysteria wrote:

Sure,
but studies have been done that show talking on a cell phone is worse
than driving with a .08 BAC.
This is true, but I can always hang up my cellphone if I see traffic is getting unruly.You, however, cannot snap your fingers and un-drunk yourself.

Exactly.
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Originally posted by Man Bites Dog Man Bites Dog wrote:

Originally posted by Hysteria Hysteria wrote:

Sure, but studies have been done that show talking on a cell phone is worse than driving with a .08 BAC.


This is true, but I can always hang up my cellphone if I see traffic is getting unruly.

You, however, cannot snap your fingers and un-drunk yourself.


Traffic getting unruly doesn't always have everything to do with it.  You could be paying more attention to the conversation than the road and have someone pull out in front of you or have one of a hundred different such things happen.
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Originally posted by Man Bites Dog Man Bites Dog wrote:

And yes, I do drive better when I am intoxicated because I am more careful and more aware of my surroundings.


The day I could do that is the day I could poop in a swinging bucket.


Edited by What to do? - 06 December 2007 at 9:33am
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Originally posted by Kayback Kayback wrote:

And if you willing to freely ignore the drink driving laws, how likely is it you stick to 25?


Quite likely.

Apparently I don't become an ass when drunk.
If you obey all traffic laws, you don't get pulled over. Therefore, if you are drunk and driving, obey all traffic laws. Complete stops, speed limit, turn signal, no brights when other cars are coming, don't swerve (obviously), and don't brake/accelerate too quickly.
I do those things at all times while driving, including on the rare occasions when I do drive under the influence.
It really isn't that hard to maintain some level of self control while drunk (at least for me it isn't).
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It would be quite amusing to take all of you for a car ride while I was drunk. I know people who trust me to drive their vehicle while I am drunk and they are sober.

Back in my highschool days, I used to drive home from parties and whatnot all the time. My dad asked me to drive home from my older sister's wedding reception because he was tired (and sober). They didn't approve of me drinking, so I couldn't say I was drunk; I tried not to, but he insisted, so I did. I drove around 60 miles (from Detroit to Ortonville) during heavy traffic with a trailer full of crap behind me after having 6 mixed drinks. I actually almost got run off the road by some other drunk asshole, but avoided it.
And my mom/dad had no idea I was drunk.

So that led me to the conclusion that, while unreccomended, I can drive home drunk if I'm in Ortonville. I've never had an accident, been pulled over, hit a dog, etc. no matter what my state of mind. And that's more than most people can say after 4 1/2 years driving around 20k miles a year.

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Originally posted by Hysteria Hysteria wrote:



Traffic getting unruly doesn't always have everything to do with it.  You could be paying more attention to the conversation than the road and have someone pull out in front of you or have one of a hundred different such things happen.


Very true, which is why I do not drive and talk on the phone, and also part of the reason you should not drive after drinking.




Edited by Man Bites Dog - 06 December 2007 at 12:53pm
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Are there people who think that driving drunk isn't a bad idea?  Wow.
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Originally posted by Man Bites Dog Man Bites Dog wrote:

Originally posted by Hysteria Hysteria wrote:



Traffic getting unruly doesn't always have everything to do with it.  You could be paying more attention to the conversation than the road and have someone pull out in front of you or have one of a hundred different such things happen.


Very true, which is why I do not drive and talk on the phone, and also part of the reason you should not drink after drinking.




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Originally posted by Susan Storm Susan Storm wrote:

Originally posted by Hysteria Hysteria wrote:

And yes, I do drive better when I am intoxicated because I am more careful and more aware of my surroundings.

  Few things are funnier than watching drunk guys trying to pretend they aren't drunk, because they actually think they are doing a good job of hiding it. 

That's a pretty sexist comment. Woman are just as guilty.
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Originally posted by Skillet42565 Skillet42565 wrote:

Are there people who think that driving drunk isn't a bad idea?  Wow.

Isn't it just amazing?  This is why I think we need to spend a LOT more effort on education and PR on this subject.  Laws are all well and good, but what we really need is an attitude adjustment.
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I know people who think its the funniest thing in the world go out on the road high/drunk (impaired) and drive like jackasses doing burn outs ect ect. I can't wait till they get their licenses revoked. 
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I've never been drunk while driving. However being high is a different story for me.  Never had a problem either even when the police have pulled me over.
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