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Phenom needs new asa and double trigger
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carnivore View Drop Down
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    Posted: 20 August 2010 at 5:06am
Phenom needs new asa and double trigger
 
Tippmann please, make a new asa for the phenom, with the brass air line us tank on ballers cant change them out for a more streemline aftermarket asa with an on/off one without the co2 angle.
Is there any chance that Tippmann or some company will make one, or an adapter?
How bout a double trigger too?  one thats is walkable unlike killjoys
 
 
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ImHUGEnJapan View Drop Down
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Points: 30 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ImHUGEnJapan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 August 2010 at 6:36pm
There are some inherent issues with the design of the grip that makes the Phenom more difficult to walk compared to high end electro's.
 
It's going to be difficult for any company to design a trigger to make the Phenom "walkable" in the mechanical mode.  The trigger has a pretty stiff pull to begin with compared to a marker that uses a micro switch design.  You have to overcome the force of the spring and the trigger pin pushing down on the trigger.  I don't see an easy work around for this.
 
The trigger definately has a shorter pull using the egrip settings. The shorter trigger pull is a step in the right direction to making the trigger more walkable, but it's still a little stiff (for the same reasons listed above).
 
Another issue that you face is the design of the HE sensors and the way they work.  The magnet must pass between the two hall effect sensors before it will fire.  The trigger must then travel far enough away from the sensors and then pass back through them in order to register the next shot.  If you make the trigger pull too short, then the HE sensors will not register a new shot.  There is a fine line here and it's difficult to design around.
 
The best egrip setting that is close to "walkable" as you are going to get is the response setting.  It's egrip assisted, but you can certainly increase your BPS  vs a single trigger on the same setting.
 
You can also increase your BPS using just the "semi" setting on your egrip, but once again the pull is a little stiff.  Don't get me wrong, it's a nice improvement over the single trigger, but don't expect to hit 15-17 bps like you can if your shooting an EGO or DM. Your never going to walk a phenom like you can an EGO.  I know, becuase I own both.  It's more of an issue with the design of how the trigger works, than the trigger itself.  
 
I hope this helps.
 
 


Edited by ImHUGEnJapan - 23 August 2010 at 9:07am
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SSOK View Drop Down
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Points: 5919 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SSOK Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 August 2010 at 12:44am
Im sure someone will eventually come out with a new Phenom ASA, but aftermarket only. No GTA there.
 
Although I dont see the compaints about it, and I have always found on/offs useless.
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Bubs View Drop Down
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Points: 11 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bubs Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 August 2010 at 9:01pm
Carnivore, definitely don't need the walkable trigger on the phenom....I  used my phenom in some tournament play earlier this season, and turned the heads of players with BL vices, DMs and various other "speedball" markers. Like SSOK said, in response mode the marker is very close to what it seems you're looking for.
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Points: 5676 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote oldpbnoob Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 August 2010 at 10:08am

I thought the HE sensor worked by the magnet simply getting close enough to the sensor to fire simliar to how an Emag works? I handled my brothers Phenom for a short bit, but didnt get around to really studying how it is layed out. Wouldn't  a lighter trigger spring similiar to the "pen spring mod" help decrease the spring pressure? Just spitballing here, since I haven't actually opened it up to look at it yet. Didn't someone already come up with a walkable double trigger for the HE A5? Why wouldn't it be the same/similiar?

"When I grow up I want to marry a rich man and live in a condor next to the beach" -- My 7yr old daughter.
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ImHUGEnJapan View Drop Down
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Points: 30 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ImHUGEnJapan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 August 2010 at 1:06pm
Originally posted by oldpbnoob oldpbnoob wrote:

I thought the HE sensor worked by the magnet simply getting close enough to the sensor to fire simliar to how an Emag works? I handled my brothers Phenom for a short bit, but didnt get around to really studying how it is layed out. Wouldn't  a lighter trigger spring similiar to the "pen spring mod" help decrease the spring pressure? Just spitballing here, since I haven't actually opened it up to look at it yet. Didn't someone already come up with a walkable double trigger for the HE A5? Why wouldn't it be the same/similiar?

Technically, you are correct the magnet just needs to get close enough to the sensor to fire.  A lighter trigger spring will help decrease the spring pressure.  The pull is a little lighter on the A-5/X7 HE egrip because you do not have to overcome the pressure of the trigger pin pushing down on the top of the trigger.  It's not a lot of pressure, but it's never going to be the same as walking high end electro's. 
 
I make double triggers for the HE e-grip as well. Tech-T and RI also make them.  The Phenom triggers are similar to the older HE egrips, but the internal portion of the triggers are completely different.  They still operate on the same priciple.


Edited by ImHUGEnJapan - 25 August 2010 at 1:08pm
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Points: 5676 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote oldpbnoob Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 August 2010 at 1:22pm
I didnt realize the trigger pin made contact in E mode. Again, I thought it was like the Emag which doesnt really make contact with the trigger pin unless it is in mechanical mode. I'll have to grab my brothers marker and look closer at it.
"When I grow up I want to marry a rich man and live in a condor next to the beach" -- My 7yr old daughter.
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Points: 30 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ImHUGEnJapan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 August 2010 at 3:26pm
I'm pretty sure it does, maybe i'm wrong, but the trigger pull feels the same to me in both settings.  I know that pin sticks out a little ways once the marker is gassed up. 
 
The trigger lever still needs to engage the pin in order for the marker to fire in either setting.  In the mechanical mode you push the pin in manually.  In the egrip setting the you only have to pull the trigger about half the distance, because the trigger lever is electonically assisted and the electronics take over once you trip the HE sensor.  The hook on the trigger prevents you from pulling the trigger all the way.  The pin is still pressing down on top of the trigger lever in either mode.   
 
The trigger pull is definately lighter when the marker is not gassed up.  Try pulling the trigger before you put any air on the marker and you will notice a difference.  Feel the trigger after you put air on the marker and you will feel a little bit of tension in the pull. 


Edited by ImHUGEnJapan - 25 August 2010 at 3:40pm
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