Thats what ive always said....Too many freedoms ISNT a good thing.

Yup, it's like the old saying, "Those who don't know history are doomed to repeat it." (Referring to the fall of the Romans for all yee ingnorant non history knowing folk)

Yeah the U.S.A. is definantly gonna fall because we are to soft, hopfully not any time soon though.

Agree

It's funny you mention that because we had a 35 minute discussion about it in World History today.

If the 'States does fall (and I hope to God it never will) it will most likely to be the same way the Romans did. They were greedy, only cared about themselves, and thought everyone else was inferior(sp). 

There is a homosexual rebellion going on, people constanly complaining about unimportant stuff, and some people are so greedy, they'll sue McDonalds because their cup of cofee was too hot! Please, have some patriotism. Be glad that you live in a country like this. Otherwise, go crawl into a hole or something.

in new jersey we don't even have a right to protect our home from burglars, rapists, or murderers... but we've got some fine tomatoes...

Hades wrote: Beats growing a beard, wearing a turban, and never seeing any womanly flesh.

We're going to become Shriners?

fractus.scud wrote: even in dumb games like empire Earth in about 1000 years the USA is no longer, it's China and Europe. IMO we have to many liberal left wingers in our country. Im more of the hard core right winged patriot

Good, the military will be looking forward to your service. 

ThEeViLcHiCkEn wrote: Sandman, i agree with you i hate to admit it but before the next cenerty turns, america will fail unless something is done, i know i know i sould like hitler but we need to do something about the population of america, NOT KILL PEOPLE but just "fix" them like a dog when they are born, starting now

Please list who gets cut.  Let's get this Final Solution ball rolling...

Yes america today is full mof lazt ignorant selfish people with no real self view. And yes the country is going to hell. But I dont see the collapse of the U.S. Think of our military and technological differences from ancient rome. I really dont see it as a possibility. The government and military are too powerful. What i forsee is one crap hole of a country in our future while still maintaing military dominance. Are current style of life will disappear but the union wont collapse

-Kasey

ThEeViLcHiCkEn wrote: -ProDigY- wrote: ThEeViLcHiCkEn wrote: Sandman, i agree with you i hate to admit it but before the next cenerty turns, america will fail unless something is done, i know i know i sould like hitler but we need to do something about the population of america, NOT KILL PEOPLE but just "fix" them like a dog when they are born, starting now Yeah, cut off everybody's balls at birth. That would fix all our problems. No you dont cut the ballls off, god you're an idiot they stick a needle though your sack, then something eles and your fixed, you dont get your balls choped off. It like they would even know, we could just tell them only the selected few can have sex and mate

Do you play with fire or torture animals?

SandMan wrote: <RANT> Freedom to the extent that the USA offers cannot sustain its self and will eventually self destruct. An exclusive emphasis on freedom and liberty, combined with inordinate wealth, creates a selfish, mentally lazy, and ignorant population which will eventually collapse from within. If you don't believe me, do a little looking into who the Romans were and why they fell. I support mandatory military service. I support stricter and more carefully enforced laws as well as steeper penalties for breaking those laws. I believe strongly that the United States of America needs to lose some of their freedoms and liberties in order to rediscover their soul and national identity. Because we're too comfortable, we manufacture our own problems. We don't have to worry about where our next meal is coming from, so we redirect all our emotional energy to stupid crap like baby seals and political agendas. We think the sudden death of 3,000 people is a huge, earth shattering event. We weep like children instead of standing up and taking the hit like an adult. We live far too much in our fantasies, ideals, and illusions because the world does not force us to face reality. The vast majority of out national production revolves around our entertainment industry. We eat for pleasure instead of for necessity. It's a sick state of affairs when you stop to think about it. And when it crumbles, millions will weep, but certain of us will stand unphased, knowing that justice has finally come. </RANT>

true after highschool i travled around to other contys. it really makes you greatfull for what i have.

america isnt free

rave5910 wrote: 1. The freedom to be stupid

*Obvious retort suppressed*

2. Letting just any couple have a kid (if you have to take a test to drive you should have to do it to have kids) 3. Take away the right for some people to breath

When viewed in conjunction with #1, these are particularly humurous...   but viewed by themselves they sound a lot like the policies of every totalitarian regime ever, including all the ones against the US has fought wars.

gg

pballa j.r. wrote: They should take away the right to sue people just because they can.

Think about that one for a second...

make it shorter and i will

just read the last 3 sentences if u dont want to read all of it maybe that'll get my point across might not be enough though so dont quote me on just the last three

edit: and isnt that what sandman is talking about how we're getting too lazy and pampered? then again, tu es francais non? alors je regrette mon ami. (sorry for misspellings only in 3rd yr of french)

Clark Kent wrote: pballa j.r. wrote: They should take away the right to sue people just because they can. Think about that one for a second...

So suits like the one for mcdonalds making the lady fat should be allowed?

He isnt saying we shouldnt have any rights, but some of the rights we have we shouldnt.

Gatyr wrote: So suits like the one for mcdonalds making the lady fat should be allowed?

So how do we decide if a lawsuit is too stupid to be allowed?

Answer:  We will have a judge decide if the lawsuit is too stupid.

This, of course, is exactly the current system.

All that balla's proposal would do is to add another layer of lawsuits - you would have to "sue for the right to sue" or somesuch.

That was my point.

fireufool wrote: thats probably the dumbest argument i've ever heard its a violation of rights not to be allowed to have a weapon used to kill in a bar a place of impared people (due to alcohol) where fights frequently start?

the polotician that was arguing that also chalanged anouther polotican to a duel

^^ to rephrase i am trying to contradict sandman when he said we should be stricter i think the laws are fine and should be enforced but not MORE

i'm sorry for not being clear

yes every1 does fall only because of human flaw and if human flaw didnt exist then we'd all be communist it makes sence in theory but human flaw prevents it and also as of now the USA is i believe to powerful to fall to anything becides a total world assult or something close

rave5910 wrote: Darur wrote: This country was formed for people to be free. Most likely, if Americas founders saw the state it was in today they would cry... they would cry like little girls... little girls that just lost their dollies..... dollies with pink ribbons in their hair.

Why do you say that?  What is "the state" that is so bad?

I would think the Founders would be rather proud...

i dont think the founders really cared if it was free, they just wanted power

freedom of speach dosnt exist. if you say somthing like kill all the black people wont respect your opinion at all, they will yell and such at  you. and you also cant go up to a 10 year old girl and tell her to get in the car for.... you get it.

as for the paper thing, the school has a right to edit the paper, the paper dosnt belong to the writters, it belongs to the school.

all it means is that you can have an opinon, agein if its the "rong" opinon people will hate you

I disagree with Sandman on everypoint he has made, Save one .

I believe every able bodied/minded individual should serve a mandatory term of duty in the armed forces , ALSO !! I believe arms training (firearms) should be a mandatory requirement of every american citizen , and every adult should be required to carry that weapon with them through out their day (put it in a safebox , for like bars , and what not ) , would a mugger try something against an armed person ?, think not,, , would burglars attempt going into a house ,if they knew the owners were trained in the use of firearms ,and had one readilly available ? , think not , and hey so what if they did , most likely ,they would end up getting removed from the gene pool , permanantly..

Everything that has a beginning has and end.

--The Matrix

I agree. Freedom is definately overrated.

We should institute mandatory concentration camps, and the Fourth Reich shall rise.

Variable - yes, the Founders were against political parties.  I also suspect they would find a number of other things they wouldn't like.  But I do believe that, on the whole, they would be proud to have created this country that has already lasted 200+ years and still going strong.

Ryan - Heinlein's politics in Starship Troopers are tempting, and Heinlein (as always) makes a good case (in the book Heinlein argues that only veterans should have a vote).  The word for that, however, is "military oligarchy."  This is just code for military dictatorship.  The same arguments that Heinlein made for his military oligarchy can be applied in favor of almost any other limited democracy - landowners only can vote, millionaires only can vote, elected officeholders only can vote (think about that one), and so forth and so on. 

In any of these cases, the result would be contrary to the (current) American view that voting is a RIGHT not a PRIVILEGE.  If we decide to make voting a privilege and not a right, then Heinlein's scenario becomes more attractive.  It is still (as described in the book) very impractical, but that is a different issue.

If, however, we plan on starting to restrict voting to certain classes, I would put military service far down on the list of qualifiers, despite Heinlein's persuasiveness.  What about intelligence?  We generally try to elect smart leaders - what better way than to only let smart people vote?  Or maybe use education as a test?  Or a combination?  Or maybe you have to take a test, before each election, to show that you have an inkling of the issues and won't be voting for the best hair?

As good a book as that was, I do not buy Heinlein's societal structure.

Shadowminion wrote: I disagree with Sandman on everypoint he has made, Save one . I believe every able bodied/minded individual should serve a mandatory term of duty in the armed forces , ALSO !! I believe arms training (firearms) should be a mandatory requirement of every american citizen , and every adult should be required to carry that weapon with them through out their day (put it in a safebox , for like bars , and what not ) , would a mugger try something against an armed person ?, think not,, , would burglars attempt going into a house ,if they knew the owners were trained in the use of firearms ,and had one readilly available ? , think not , and hey so what if they did , most likely ,they would end up getting removed from the gene pool , permanantly..

your joking right?

all americains arnt good citazens (or spellers) but now everytime somone got into a fight theyd pull out a gun and shoot the other guy, and say it was in self defence wich it may or may not have been