I Have a Confession to Make
Printed From: Tippmann Paintball
Category: News And Views
Forum Name: Thoughts and Opinions
Forum Description: Got something you need to say?
URL: http://www.tippmannsports.com/forum/wwf77a/forum_posts.asp?TID=135338
Printed Date: 23 December 2025 at 9:14am
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 12.04 - http://www.webwizforums.com
Topic: I Have a Confession to Make
Posted By: jmstallard
Subject: I Have a Confession to Make
Date Posted: 13 June 2005 at 10:08am
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I wiped paint in the last game I played. It was a large scenario game, and a group of us were guarding the path down the tapeline. Maybe 200ft. down that trail was ~10 enemy players, clumped up and slowly inching forward. One of them was shooting full-auto at us, but we were so far out of range, the balls would hit the ground 50 ft. in front of us, then roll into our positions. After a few minutes of his wasted paint, I looked down and noticed a broken ball on my hopper. I wiped it and told myself that he didn't earn the hit so it was okay to wipe. Yes, I was wrong; I know that. I'm not trying to justify my decision; I'm hear to admit my guilt and ask forgiveness from my fellow players.
Let me just say that my personal rule is that I will leave the game, and have on several occassions, if they got a good hit on me, REGARDLESS of whether the ball broke or not. If they earned the kill, I give it to them, even if a fluke prevents the ball from breaking. So, you see, it's not that I just don't like getting out. I guess I figured that, because the guy didn't earn the kill, I wasn't going to give it to him. I realize now that I have no right to make that kind of call. He hit me, and that should have been it. That's the first time I've ever wiped, and it WILL be the last time. I'm sorry. |
Replies:
Posted By: RenegadeGopher
Date Posted: 13 June 2005 at 10:09am
| You are not forgiven my son. To repent for this grave sin, you must sign up for the Yahoo Pool tournament. GO! OR I'LL USE THE BRICK!!! |
Posted By: BLand
Date Posted: 13 June 2005 at 10:10am
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We're sorry but, Tippmann Pnuematics does NOT tolerate cheating of ANY
kind. If you have acted in any form of cheating you must send you're
marker in right away. If you don't know how to play fair games of paintball, theres is no need for you to have a gun. Tippmann Management, Dylan ------------- 
|
Posted By: Linus
Date Posted: 13 June 2005 at 10:10am
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Big woop, EVERYONE has cheated at one time or another.
If I get shot in the leg running to a bunker I slide on it, nothing wrong with that. I;m not going to stop midway and check to see if it broke. Let the refs do their jobs, I was a ref so I know what it’s like. |
Posted By: jmstallard
Date Posted: 13 June 2005 at 10:18am
That doesn't make it right though. But hey, hearing about how dishonest you are, I don't feel so bad. Thanks! |
Linus wrote:Posted By: RenegadeGopher
Date Posted: 13 June 2005 at 10:19am
| Excuse me, I see no sign-up on the Pool tournament.. |
Posted By: Linus
Date Posted: 13 June 2005 at 10:22am
|
I never said cheating was right. But it’s also not Black and White. Splat magazine did a good article on it a while back, when I get home I’ll try and type it all up…
JM, when I was saying everyone did it, I meant in some form or another I slide if shot in leg, some say cheating, some say not. I consider cheating what Chris Lasoya does. He cheats paintball out of fun. He cheats paintball out of fans. He cheats right infront of people/refs. There is not a single sport where you wont see someone try to cheat. |
Posted By: Reb Cpl
Date Posted: 13 June 2005 at 10:27am
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Eh. It happens. Its a game. I despise when people do it with regularity. If you do it once, it still sucks, but like I said. It happens. Don't make a habit of it and you'll be fine. ------------- ? |
Posted By: jmstallard
Date Posted: 13 June 2005 at 10:28am
| Well despite what others do, or condone, I feel bad about what I did, so in the spirit of honesty, I'm letting everyone know. Not that any of you know me though, or give damn what I do or why I do it...so maybe this is pointless. |
Posted By: Linus
Date Posted: 13 June 2005 at 10:33am
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I consider cheating stealing.
If you cheat, the person that just hit you had to shoot a paintball, and paint cost money. Cheating is stealing money. End of Discussion. Like I said, if you don’t KNOW if it broke, it isn’t cheating. |
Posted By: jmstallard
Date Posted: 13 June 2005 at 10:36am
If you're deciding to slide just to coverup a possible break, then I'd say you're cheating. |
Posted By: Hades
Date Posted: 13 June 2005 at 10:37am
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I dont call myself out if the the ball doesnt break. I dont think I should either. ------------- 
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Posted By: Reb Cpl
Date Posted: 13 June 2005 at 10:44am
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No, if the ball doesnt break, its not cheating if you don't call it. I hate cheaters. I played with the school wrestling team because the coach invited me. They were the most awful cheaters I have ever seen. It got to the point where the refs couldnt keep up with them, so they just made sure we werent hurting each other instead of calling out players who had been hit. There were guys hit 3, 4, and 5 times who were still standing and shooting. That was the only day that I conciously cheated. I was so steamed at these guys that I wiped a ball break off my hopper and kept going. You're right though. I'd feel like a jerk if I did it. It's just a game, theres no reason to get so serious about it that you've got to cheat. ------------- ? |
Posted By: Lawless
Date Posted: 13 June 2005 at 10:44am
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Ehhh...big deal. I "Marker-Whipped" my buddy cuz I got pissed that he kept lacin' paint at me after I had called out...busted the thing that keeps your strap tight to your head. And I've taken a handful of paint and smeared it in another buddy's face cuz he kept shooting past my head when I didn't have my gogs on. Oooh...and once...when I was playing one on one with my buddy George...I snuck up on him while he was taking a tinkle and came 1.5" away from shooting his "stuff*(he measured), and on top of it all...in his rush to put his *stuff* away...he tinkled himself. ------------- Name: Paul R. Warman II Location: The Boonies, MI Phone Number: (989)666-XXXX |
Posted By: Linus
Date Posted: 13 June 2005 at 10:44am
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That’s the gray area JM.
What would you like me to do? Stop halfway to a bunker and check my leg? No sorry that’s dumb. I play the snake, I’m going to slide no matter what, if it was a break oh well, let the ref do his job. I’m there to play, not ref. Now if I get shot in the mask or some place where I see it break, I call myself out, but if it’s on the side of the leg, sorry, not cheating unless I KNOW it broke… |
Posted By: ^Pirate^
Date Posted: 13 June 2005 at 10:47am
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I shot myself once in the foot and wiped.... is that cheating? ------------- 
It aint about black or white becuz we human I hope we see the light before it's ruined My ghetto gospel |
Posted By: Hades
Date Posted: 13 June 2005 at 10:48am
In most normal play marker/hooper hits count? I have never played that rule, but then I have never played anywhere a ref has been and until recently havent played the one hit your out rule.  -------------
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Posted By: BLand
Date Posted: 13 June 2005 at 10:51am
Depends. Shooting yourself is friendly fire. Fields will usually state a rule whether or not friendly fire is an out or not. -------------
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Posted By: lester98c
Date Posted: 13 June 2005 at 10:56am
 how could you!
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Posted By: EyeElPee
Date Posted: 13 June 2005 at 10:57am
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Send your marker to me and you will be forgiven.
------------- 
I would like to touch Bland for making me that sig^ |
Posted By: Hysteria
Date Posted: 13 June 2005 at 11:46am
No, but you could check it once you got there. If you get hit, and refuse to look down even after you are under cover then you are indeed cheating. |
Posted By: Linus
Date Posted: 13 June 2005 at 11:50am
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Hysteria, I was a referee for a year. You’ve never been a ref. I know how both sides think.
Did I ever say I wouldn’t check it? No, I said I’d slide on it. Once to a bunker I would check it because if it DID break I don’t want to keep playing. If it broke and I saw it and kept playing a ref could pull me and a buddy or two. |
Posted By: hybrid-sniper
Date Posted: 13 June 2005 at 12:52pm
I once shot the lid off my team mates hopper. He LOVED that. |
Posted By: Atrosity
Date Posted: 13 June 2005 at 12:58pm
|
Would stepping on paint from the previous game count as cheating? It's
not realy my fault, as i was cornered and there was like 500 balls on
the ground there....
------------- "Who me? No I'm quite blunt, like a sledghammer to the temple."-Me |
Posted By: Linus
Date Posted: 13 June 2005 at 1:00pm
| Atrosity, no because it is the referee’s job to clear the area around a bunker from paint for people that slide. |
Posted By: Cedric
Date Posted: 13 June 2005 at 1:01pm
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You're going to hell.
------------- 
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Posted By: BlackDeath7
Date Posted: 13 June 2005 at 2:21pm
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Don't worry about it. Just make sure you don't do it again though.
------------- 
Brett Favre gets sacked again. |
Posted By: Hysteria
Date Posted: 13 June 2005 at 2:27pm
No, but you implied it by saying:
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Posted By: entropy
Date Posted: 13 June 2005 at 2:29pm
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I wipe when the urge takes me. Never in small games with my friends,
though. Only in speedball off the break, and big games. Don't make a
habit of it though. |
Posted By: Panda Man
Date Posted: 13 June 2005 at 3:03pm
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Well as long as you don't do it agian, no harm no foul... I
usally find myself playing with a Ramping Gun, but since it really cant
Cycle faster then 13bps, no one really cares around here.
------------- 
|
Posted By: Homer J
Date Posted: 13 June 2005 at 5:10pm
| I wiped once because I thought we were playing Reincarnation. Turns out the game after that one was Reincarnation. The ref let me off on that one. |
Posted By: *Stealth*
Date Posted: 13 June 2005 at 5:28pm
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Burn in the Flames of fuzzy doom blasphemer.
------------- |
Posted By: Pariel
Date Posted: 13 June 2005 at 5:33pm
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Never wiped.
I hope I never will. I hate stepping on paint. I don't believe you're out if you do-depends on field rules, but it's just retarded if you are. That said, I saw a guy wipe in one game(from the sidelines), and the next game I gave him 3 nice bonus balls from about 7 feet, in the head(come on, he came out the top of his bunker-it wasn't my fault!). Don't cheat-I'll screw you up. |
Posted By: Pariel
Date Posted: 13 June 2005 at 5:44pm
This is about the 10th time *EDIT* since Friday*EDIT* I've seen this word said as a post. Seriously guys, no one wants that-it's just upping your post count. Come on. |
Posted By: jeep 98 custom
Date Posted: 13 June 2005 at 8:27pm
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I can't say I've never wiped, but I don't like it. I really feel
dishonest when I do it, so I do it VERY rarley, and of course only when
I KNOW I can get away with it. Playing on is another story, I almost always play on. Unless the refs are on me like flies on spit, every time I get hit I play on, just a few extra shots if it's obvious, or call for a paint check when I'm 99% sure it broke, just to shoot a few more balls. At a tourny a week ago, a ref told me to wipe. I got cracked on my barrel, but it all sprayed onto my hand, leaving the barrel clean. A ref checked my gun, and found nothing, then when he started looking all over me, I hid my hand and he didn't see the spary from the barrel on it. I moved to another bunker after being called clean, and began shooting with the paint on my hand fully exposed, knowing I can't get a penalty if the other ref called me clean. The new ref I was near saw it, and figured it was spary/rub, and told me to wipe it so they didn't think it was a hit. A quick rub on the pant leg, and it was gone. Then I ran through on the last guy and hung the flag. ------------- "Yes there are two path you can go back, but in the long run, there's still time to change the road you're on" 
|
Posted By: Pro_Carbine
Date Posted: 13 June 2005 at 8:39pm
------------- 98c R/T Eggy w/ Z-Board Hpa Tank Double Trigger Drop Foward 12" Smart Parts Progresive Team Morelli Company "autococker with 40 inch hammerhead barrel mounted onto a flatline"-Lester98c LOL |
Posted By: untouchable555
Date Posted: 13 June 2005 at 9:33pm
|
------------- Tippmann 98c 20 ounce Co2 tank |
Posted By: hwayhzrd
Date Posted: 13 June 2005 at 9:46pm
Speak for yourself, Linus. I
have no use for wipers/cheaters. It's the apathy about
wiping/cheating that has gotten the sport where it is now in terms of
having very little honor.
What has a person really accomplished by cheating? Proved they are better PLAYERS and SPORTSMEN or people with no respect for themselves or others? I tend to think the latter is true. After all, is there really a point to this sport if no one will admit they got eliminated? We as players and supposed supporters
of paintball can only improve things if we make a stand against people
who flout the rules of the sport.
The "take what you can while you can" mentality that currently pervades the sport just plain sucks, and if this fits you and your game, just follow that thought to it's logical conclusion. "Don't ask me what I think 'bout you, 'cause I might not give the answer that you want me to ... " ------------- If I flee, kill me If I die, avenge me |
Posted By: Apu
Date Posted: 13 June 2005 at 10:50pm
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I can honestly say in all my time of paintball, I never even THOUGHT of
cheating.. Nor does anybody at my field. People may say my field is
boring, but at least they are good guys that dont run it for the money,
but for fun, and never even think of cheating. Nor do 99.9% of its
players..
------------- I need a new Sig... |
Posted By: You Wont See Me
Date Posted: 13 June 2005 at 10:53pm
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I wiped paint once, with permission from my opponent I was playing with, It was just 1 on 1 in the backyard. Got hit in the hopper and was told to just wipe it off and keep going.
Its not really cheating, he just didnt want to have to start the game over again. ------------- A-5 E-Grip JCS Dual Trigger DOP X-CORE 8 stage x-chamber Lapco Bigshot 14" Beadblasted Optional setup: R/T Dead on Blade trigger |
Posted By: Panda Man
Date Posted: 13 June 2005 at 11:17pm
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heh. I've wiped, and once it was so obvious everyone just started laughing... Not saying cheating is cool, but you dont any more of a rush when you do the dead mans walk...  only has a 1% it works, but when it does.. good times.-------------
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Posted By: jmstallard
Date Posted: 14 June 2005 at 9:41am
| When I posted this, I expected to get a lot of people upset at my cheating (and rightfully so). I'm actually a little disappointed at the general acceptance of cheating in this forum, or this thread anyway. If this is typical of any paintball game, that means ~75% of the players will wipe when it suits them and they won't get caught. What a depressing thought. I wish there was a way to know which players were honorable and which weren't. |
Posted By: Linus
Date Posted: 14 June 2005 at 9:52am
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I can honostely say I’ve never wiped. But I can’t say that I have never slid on a un-known hit. Not necessarily cheating, check the ref’s hand book. Only cheating if you A)wipe or B) know it broke and play on.
I go back to my first point, let the refs do their job and you do yours. JM… people cheat, get used to it. If you see someone cheat, keep shooting till they call themselves out, that’s what I do. Cheating isn’t right, but it will never stop, especially when some new players see pros like Chris Lasoya wipe in clear view. |
Posted By: Reb Cpl
Date Posted: 14 June 2005 at 10:02am
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One of the reasons I didn't go to the spring west point game this year was because the last time we went the cheating there was so rampant it was rediculous. Especially during the night play, the the cheaters were in their element, because it was harder for the refs to see them (as if they cared anyway) My brother, Myself, and my girlfriends brother encircled a guy that had gotten around behind us. My brother flanked him and the three of us laid into him pretty good. He was close enough that I HEARD him grunt when he got hit...you know the "Ah..Crap!...Ow" that you hear. Well, that was several times. When we let up shooting so he could walk out, he sat up, and shot my girlfriends brother twice in the throat. We quit after that. That was only one example that I saw all day. And with all that neither me or my guys cheated the whole game. Like I said, I don't like to do it. ------------- ? |
Posted By: Linus
Date Posted: 14 June 2005 at 10:09am
| Yes, MMG at hell’s has a ton of cheating. I refuse to do scenario games because there are so many cheater… I prefer fast games where refs can keep control |
Posted By: Project Irene
Date Posted: 14 June 2005 at 10:20am
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Exactly, Reb. There is an unbelievable amount of cheating at big games (24 hour scenario/sim) I've even watched our general rub an arm hit. It's ridiculous when you nail someone in the chest sliding into a bunker, then they raise up, and start slinging paint. We've had gunfights where there is no way in hell there players didn't get hit, about the only way to get some of them out is if you cause enough pain. I've rubbed twice, and felt bad about it after both. One, at a big game because I was dead tired and didn't feel like treking half a mile, and the other because I was extremely mad.
|
Posted By: Reb Cpl
Date Posted: 14 June 2005 at 10:27am
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The last scenario game I was at, they made me semi-invincable. I was given two yellow armbands, and the only way I could get out was if I was hit in the bands. THAT was a lot of fun, but I must have gotten drilled about 200 times, and I'm not underestimating.
------------- ? |
Posted By: Linus
Date Posted: 14 June 2005 at 10:42am
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I played one scenario game at Lone Wolf, years ago, where I was the team medic. Only way medics can die is to be shot in the head.
Well, one of the other teams had the bright idea of using their medic as a moving shield and covering his head with a towel. I saw the look in my team’s eyes and I just said “HELL NO!” Wouldn’t have been good anyhow.. A 13 (back then) year old trying to shield 40 year olds
|
Posted By: Project Irene
Date Posted: 14 June 2005 at 11:03am
| ^lol At Red Dawn II a couple of weeks ago, the US tanks were one pilot holding a shied that's invincilbe, one gunner, invincible, and two other gunners who are killable. Well I had an awesome cover spot on a trail and here comes a tank. LAW rockets can take out the whole thing, but I didn't have any of those. They walk down the trail real slow, and start taking fire from my team further down. When their backs are to me, I pick off the gunners. When the pilot turned around, he didn't see me. So I spent the next 2 minutes inflicting pain on invincible players until one of our dudes showed up with a LAW. It was hilarious. |
Posted By: Reb Cpl
Date Posted: 14 June 2005 at 11:08am
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Oh, if players know you're invincible, you're in for a world of hurt. check out the photos at http://www.pbmissions.com - www.pbmissions.com
Those of us that were principals were severely railed on all day. ------------- ? |
Posted By: jmstallard
Date Posted: 14 June 2005 at 11:09am
Okay, I'll give you that, but you have no honor if you slide in an attempt to cover up a possible break.
No, I will NOT get used to it. People also steal cars. Should I get used to that too? The fact that you have gotten used to it makes you no better than the cheaters.
I disagree, but if you're right, then I sincerely hope paintball dies a quick death. |
Posted By: Linus
Date Posted: 14 June 2005 at 11:11am
| LMAO guy in white camo with a rainbow of paint.. how cute |
Posted By: Project Irene
Date Posted: 14 June 2005 at 11:14am
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Cheating will never stop dude. That's just the way things are. It's wrong, but millions of things take place every day that are wrong. Just because there are people with lesser morals doesn't mean you should want the whole sport to end. I'd rather play with cheaters then not play at all. |
Posted By: Linus
Date Posted: 14 June 2005 at 11:24am
|
JM, I was a referee for a year, I’ve seen plenty of things you never will.
I’ve kicked out many a cheater, but no matter what there will be more cheaters. “No matter how idiot(cheat) proof you make something,. Some one will come along and make a better idiot(cheater)” You’re saying I have bad morals because I slide on a possible break even though YOU are the one that wiped on purpose… |
Posted By: Bauerp0weR 18
Date Posted: 14 June 2005 at 11:33am
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I've never actually cheated by wiping, or in any other form conciously... The only time I guess you could call me cheating was last Saturday. The game was dragging out, it was only me and 2 first timers in the back of the field against two friends of mine, Matt and Mike. The ref gave the game another 30 seconds of play so as always I try to make some sort of move on them. Since in this game I was pinned and there was little chance for me surviving, I didn't make the move earlier. I ran and slid into a bunker about 10yds away where I would have had an easy shot on matt, but got shot so I just leaned on the bunker about to call myself out. A ref ran over to me and checked me. He only looked at the right side of my body and said I was clean. I was hit on my left side, but I didnt feel it and one that had bounced off my right arm was clean so I started playing again. Matt had moved up after thinking that he got me so he left his back to me and I just took one shot at him and got him out. Soon after Parker starts walking towards me after the game and tells me to stand up and shows me where I got shot. Meanwhile, Matt starts yelling at me how I cheated and all that stuff. The ref turns to me and says not to worry and it was his fault. Well Matt was pissed at me the rest of the day... Do you consider that cheating? ------------- Black Smart Parts Ion Halo B Check-It Unimount macroline 68/45 Pure Energy tank |
Posted By: Project Irene
Date Posted: 14 June 2005 at 11:36am
| According to Matt, you did it on your own volition and therefore you cheated, according to you, you did not know the shot on your left side was there so you didn't cheat. I don't think you cheated. But I can see why Matt is mad. |
Posted By: Linus
Date Posted: 14 June 2005 at 11:40am
|
If you knew it was broke on your left side and you concealed it from a ref, yes cheating… if you’re hit and a ref is doing a paint check, help them check your whole body, be fair.
Being a ref, we got shot at and the less time we have to spend checking you, less chance we will get lit up. |
Posted By: jmstallard
Date Posted: 14 June 2005 at 12:44pm
The difference is that I feel bad about what I did, and fully accept that it was the wrong thing to do. I never actually said you were a cheater (or if I did, I apologize), just that it's not honorable to cover up a possible break. It's only technically cheating if you KNEW it broke and still covered it up. EDIT: It's also dishonorable to withhold evidence from a ref when they're checking you, so you should have told them about the possible break if they checked you. I don't remember you saying a ref checked you though. The fact is that cheating will only happen if there's an environment where cheating is profitable. It's impossible to make any activity 100% cheat-proof, particularly paintball, but saying "it happens, get used to it" is just an invitation for more cheating. Blaming cheating on pros is like saying sleeping with boys is okay because Michael Jackson did it. |
Posted By: Linus
Date Posted: 14 June 2005 at 12:57pm
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JM, you have so much to learn about the sport of paintball.
I never once blamed cheating entirely and solely on pros, I said what kind of image does it portray to the new comers if they see our so called “pros” cheat all the time? Sliding on a possible break is 100% LEGAL, albeit a bit unethical. But we are debating ethics, we are debating cheating. I was a ref, so please don’t tell me what is/isn’t cheating. ------------- 
|
Posted By: jmstallard
Date Posted: 14 June 2005 at 3:32pm
I never said you did. However, by bringing it up, you're implying that SOME percentage of cheaters use pros to justify their actions. The exact figure isn't important. What's important is that using pros to justify cheating is ridiculous, whether it's one person doing it or ten million.
Go back and read what I said. I gave it to you that sliding on a possible break is NOT cheating, but that it is dishonorable. So if you slide on possible breaks, does that make you an unethical player?
Any ref who says, "cheating happens, get used to it" is not someone I want officiating my game. |
Posted By: Linus
Date Posted: 14 June 2005 at 9:17pm
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JM, until you officiate a game, don't try and tell me how good/bad I do.
When you do enough games you find out that all you can do to cheaters is yell/kick them. They will keep cheating... And like I said, we were debating cheating, not ethics. -------------
|
Posted By: Pariel
Date Posted: 14 June 2005 at 9:24pm
Too true. You just went down like 100 points in my book, Jeep. I understand you play because you're good, and you like to win-I guess that's cool, but look at the expenses: you're saying it's fine if the other guy does it, which leads to crappy situations where cheaters like you(and if you don't think that your devious, underhanded move with those two refs is cheating...well, I'm assuming you do) win the game. That's what makes tourney ball suck. |
Posted By: Nutteralex
Date Posted: 14 June 2005 at 9:52pm
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I've wiped once...It was the last game of the day and I got shot right
in the beginning...Not saying it's right, but I was a little pissed off
because of what happened. I may have cheated once more, but I was
running fast, it was indoor and I nearly ran to the other side of the
place. I felt the shot on my ancle and I'm 98% sure it didn't break
because of how fast I was running it also felt like I kicked the ball and the truth is I forgot to check if
it broke when I stopped running. So that are my experinces...I just hate the guys who constantly cheat. Like I shot this guy at least 7 times before he went out. ------------- Please for the love of god don't get a flatline. |
Posted By: Heres To You
Date Posted: 14 June 2005 at 9:56pm
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I'll be first to tell the truth. I wipe nearly every game. I can honestly say I've never been pulled for a 2 for 1 either. Everyone has different mentalitys. I look at like I do in football. Everyone knows that lineman hold all the time, but it'll only cost you 10 yards when you get caught. You take that risk when you preform the act, and it's the ref's job to catch you. You see players in the NFL all the time walking over to a ref and saying, "Watch #42, he's holding/clipping/facemasking etc...) Call me dishonarable, it really doesnt bother me. And whoever compared stealing cars and wiping paint. Lets be real, if you drive have you ever broken the speed limit conciously? ------------- |
Posted By: Hysteria
Date Posted: 14 June 2005 at 10:06pm
That is the second time that you have implied that if you are not positive it broke, you keep playing without bothering to check. You are using your reffing status quite like Bugg used his gold status. You are not God. |
Posted By: Unstable
Date Posted: 14 June 2005 at 10:56pm
|
Hey man dont worry about it. Everyone has cheated at least once or twice
on purpose or not. It happeds. As long as you dont do it regularly. |
Posted By: jmstallard
Date Posted: 15 June 2005 at 10:51am
I respect your candor, and I certainly do understand weighing the risks with the rewards. However, what exactly is the reward for cheating in a paintball game? Maybe this discussion has moved away from cheating, and toward sportsmanship. Here's the Webster definition of a sportsman: "a person who can take loss or defeat without complaint, or victory without gloating, and who treats his opponents with fairness, generosity, courtesy" It looks like not cheating is only one condition to being a sportsman, so it seems that it's possible to play by the rules and yet not have good sportsmanship. My complaint about Linus then is that he's not a sportsman, and if you don't subscribe to the rules of sportsmanship, how can I trust that person to be a good referee? |
Posted By: Linus
Date Posted: 15 June 2005 at 10:55am
And dude, I am not trying to act like God. I know the rules of paintball, JM doesn’t. I HAVE to know the rules since I was a ref… No argeuing that fact. -------------
|
Posted By: jmstallard
Date Posted: 15 June 2005 at 10:56am
So rather than try to change a flawed system, you'll just exploit it?
Now I'm pulling ethics into the discussion. Do you consider yourself an ethical player? |
Posted By: Linus
Date Posted: 15 June 2005 at 11:33am
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JM... you must have read/understood what I saud when I said kick/yell at them.
Let me spell it out for you as a referee, if you see someone cheat, all you can do to trya dn thwart someone from cheating is to keep a VERY watchful eye on all the players. And if you see soemone cheat, you have to make a scapegoat of them infront of everyone else. That is done by either yelling out or kicking them out of the field. Understand it now? And as for ethics, ethics is int he eye of the beholder. I consider sliding on a POSSIBLE, (how many times do I have to empthazise that?) possible break a little cheap, but not cheating. Un--ethical means you KNOW right from wrong, and when sliding on a possible break, there are no clear defined set in stone rules for or against it. If you don't like it, then don't do it, but until it's cheating, I and other will do it. -------------
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Posted By: ^Pirate^
Date Posted: 15 June 2005 at 11:52am
So true, I played Morpheus in a Matrix game a week ago, and I threw away the shirt I had on because it started out black and ended up yellow greenish... -------------
It aint about black or white becuz we human I hope we see the light before it's ruined My ghetto gospel |
Posted By: ShadowFalcon75
Date Posted: 15 June 2005 at 12:39pm
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Disclaimer: I wish to remain neutral in all this. I'm just stating my IMPRESSIONS of what's going on here. Tell me your opinoins of what I write, these are my opinoins (with notes attached to them). Linus: Accepts (that it happens) and will try to prevent cheating, but keeps repeating his defense. (Try to stop the flames, Linus, you were a ref after all.) jm: Angry at the general acceptance of cheating, using ethics and sportsmanship against Linus. (Try to accept some other opinions jm.) What's happening: A giant "is too!" "is not!" battle. (Calm down guys, please.) Disclaimer: I wish to remain neutral in all this. I'm just stating my IMPRESSIONS of what's going on here. Tell me your opinoins of what I write, these are my opinoins (with notes attached to them). ------------- I'm a newbie armed with correct grammar. Be afraid. Be very afraid. |
Posted By: Linus
Date Posted: 15 June 2005 at 12:42pm
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Couldn't be farther fromt he truth on both JM and I shadow
I don't say cheating is good, even if others do it. I sayit will happen, and I do as much as I can to stop it, but sliding on a possible break is NOT cheating... read a rule book sometime. And JM is angry at the general acceptence, but he doesn't justify his actions. He says that cheating is bad and he feels bad for doing it. -------------
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Posted By: ShadowFalcon75
Date Posted: 15 June 2005 at 12:48pm
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I'll edit that post. And those are impressions, remember.
------------- I'm a newbie armed with correct grammar. Be afraid. Be very afraid. |
Posted By: Linus
Date Posted: 15 June 2005 at 1:00pm
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And shadow, I wasn't flaming anyone...
And anyway, beign a ref doesn't make me perfect. I amde some bad calls, like all refs do. -------------
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Posted By: ShadowFalcon75
Date Posted: 15 June 2005 at 1:06pm
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No, no, thats not what I mean. Him flaming you, too. What I mean is you're experienced, you can probably do a better job than me to calm things down. By the way, I'm not saying refs should be perfect. Oh, and remember the disclaimer? I don't want to take sides. Sorry, but I gotta' go. I'll be back in a couple hours. ------------- I'm a newbie armed with correct grammar. Be afraid. Be very afraid. |
Posted By: Linus
Date Posted: 15 June 2005 at 2:03pm
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I appreciate you keeping things civil shadow
Now yes, when I was a ref I would have to calm situations down, but I also started some by my calls. One of my last times reffing before the field closed, I made a guy sit out for a game for taking his mask off after repeared warnings. His buddies (the whoel group was private) got mad and threatened to shoot me. Now when you're 15 and you are being threatened by thirty 40 yearolds.. kinda freaky. So I had my manager come in. They then thretaened to shoot him(smart move) so he and the owner made the group sit out for 30 min while they "discussed" the matter. Discussed as in put them into their place by sayign I was doing the job iw as paid to do. -------------
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Posted By: Hysteria
Date Posted: 15 June 2005 at 2:23pm
How many times do I have to emphasize what I'm trying to say? I understand that sliding on a possible brake is not cheating. In fact, it is the logical thing to do to avoid getting nailed while checking yourself in the open. What I'm trying to get across is this: You implied that you would not even check after you got behind cover by saying "let the ref do his job." This means even though you know you got hit, you will just disregard it as if it never happened. By the way, I know you are Bugg. |
Posted By: ShadowFalcon75
Date Posted: 15 June 2005 at 3:12pm
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No problem. ------------- I'm a newbie armed with correct grammar. Be afraid. Be very afraid. |
Posted By: Pariel
Date Posted: 15 June 2005 at 4:38pm
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Take that CPPA thing out of your sig, Here's To You.
You disgust me. |
Posted By: You Wont See Me
Date Posted: 15 June 2005 at 4:54pm
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PM him? ------------- A-5 E-Grip JCS Dual Trigger DOP X-CORE 8 stage x-chamber Lapco Bigshot 14" Beadblasted Optional setup: R/T Dead on Blade trigger |
Posted By: newport
Date Posted: 15 June 2005 at 4:57pm
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Hahah...paintball?
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Posted By: Mehs
Date Posted: 15 June 2005 at 5:47pm
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I only wipe if I get shot by my teamates (especially if they're 10 yearolds that shoot at anything that moves)
------------- [IMG]http://i27.tinypic.com/1538fbc.jpg"> Squeeze Box ☣ |
Posted By: Pariel
Date Posted: 15 June 2005 at 5:55pm
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"Newbs=teh sux"
Anyway... Yeah, playing with newbs isn't that bad-I played one game where my team(5 guys) wiped out about 20 newbs, without a loss. It was fun. |
Posted By: ShadowFalcon75
Date Posted: 15 June 2005 at 7:19pm
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Thats cool, but what does it have to do with cheating? ------------- I'm a newbie armed with correct grammar. Be afraid. Be very afraid. |
Posted By: Linus
Date Posted: 16 June 2005 at 9:14am
-------------
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Posted By: jmstallard
Date Posted: 16 June 2005 at 9:29am
Wow, I'm impressed with your (plural) restraint. Threatening to shoot a referee and manager could easily be grounds for kicking them out off the property. |
Posted By: Smitty
Date Posted: 16 June 2005 at 9:31am
| It's not like no one's wiped before. |
Posted By: Linus
Date Posted: 16 June 2005 at 11:26am
yea, we were a friendly field. We only kicked 2 groups out before thta I know of.. one for smoking pot in our paring lot(we also called cops) and another for taking barrel plug off inside staging area and pointing it at the managers face. -------------
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Posted By: hwayhzrd
Date Posted: 16 June 2005 at 2:03pm
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What I know is this ... if you wipe playing against me, expect to get lit up. If you are on my team and I see you wipe, expect a "friendly fire accident". "Death Before Dishonor" ------------- If I flee, kill me If I die, avenge me |
Posted By: Smitty
Date Posted: 16 June 2005 at 2:15pm
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Posted By: Linus
Date Posted: 16 June 2005 at 2:30pm
Imagine HWAY running at you full speed  -------------
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Posted By: hybrid-sniper
Date Posted: 16 June 2005 at 2:34pm
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Hit the deck!
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