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Topic: question
Posted By: kuhndog599
Subject: question
Date Posted: 16 August 2005 at 1:12pm

why is the tommy gun classified as a sub machine gun and not an assault rifle



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Replies:
Posted By: Predatorr
Date Posted: 16 August 2005 at 1:16pm
because it doesnt have variable rates of fire.  Its either semi, or automatic.  Thats my guess anyway


Posted By: Hades
Date Posted: 16 August 2005 at 1:18pm
Good Marketing?

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Posted By: holysmartone
Date Posted: 16 August 2005 at 1:27pm
Im assuming it also has something to do with size and ammo caliber. The tompson is only .45 caliber, short bullets, M16s are 5.56, but longer ammo. I may just be making up a reason, but it seems logical to me. May also have to do, like pred said, with the fire rates.


Posted By: Random_Person
Date Posted: 16 August 2005 at 1:34pm

Because it is a .45 caliber. It does not fire a round large enough to classify it as an "Assult Rifle."  Plus in the early 19-hundreds when the Tompson was first invented, the term "Assult Rifle" did not exist (the term "Assult Rifle" was coined in the early 90's by the Clinton admisistration, to give the misconception that certain rifles were only used for violent purposes).

 

That's why.



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Posted By: Clark Kent
Date Posted: 16 August 2005 at 1:36pm

I hereby dub the Tommygun an "Assault Rifle".

Feel better now?



Posted By: hashi2008
Date Posted: 16 August 2005 at 1:36pm
 Try shooting a Thomson a someone just once from 100 yrds away.  I'm willing to be that you don't hit them very often.  The M16 however, can hit a target 5/5 times at 200 yrds.

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Posted By: Clark Kent
Date Posted: 16 August 2005 at 1:38pm
100 yards?  Heck, try hitting something with a Tommy from 20 yards.  That thing is impossible to control.


Posted By: PlentifulBalls
Date Posted: 16 August 2005 at 1:41pm
Originally posted by Random_Person Random_Person wrote:

Because it is a .45 caliber. It does not fire a round large enough to classify it as an "Assult Rifle."  Plus in the early 19-hundreds when the Tompson was first invented, the term "Assult Rifle" did not exist (the term "Assult Rifle" was coined in the early 90's by the Clinton admisistration, to give the misconception that certain rifles were only used for violent purposes).

 

That's why.



.45 cal is bigger than a 5.56mm. Alot bigger. 5.56 is .223 cal if I'm not mistaken. The cartridge is bigger on the 5.56 though.


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Posted By: usafpilot07
Date Posted: 16 August 2005 at 1:44pm
Originally posted by Random_Person Random_Person wrote:

Because it is a .45 caliber. It does not fire a round large enough to classify it as an "Assult Rifle."  Plus in the early 19-hundreds when the Tompson was first invented, the term "Assult Rifle" did not exist (the term "Assult Rifle" was coined in the early 90's by the Clinton admisistration, to give the misconception that certain rifles were only used for violent purposes).

 

That's why.



I love you


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Posted By: bluemunky42
Date Posted: 16 August 2005 at 1:45pm
Originally posted by Clark Kent Clark Kent wrote:

100 yards? Heck, try hitting something with a Tommy from 20 yards. That thing is impossible to control.

hence the huge clip. you've gotta hit the target a few times with that many bullets

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Posted By: Random_Person
Date Posted: 16 August 2005 at 1:50pm
Originally posted by PlentifulBalls PlentifulBalls wrote:

Originally posted by Random_Person Random_Person wrote:

Because it is a .45 caliber. It does not fire a round large enough to classify it as an "Assult Rifle."  Plus in the early 19-hundreds when the Tompson was first invented, the term "Assult Rifle" did not exist (the term "Assult Rifle" was coined in the early 90's by the Clinton admisistration, to give the misconception that certain rifles were only used for violent purposes).

 

That's why.



.45 cal is bigger than a 5.56mm. Alot bigger. 5.56 is .223 cal if I'm not mistaken. The cartridge is bigger on the 5.56 though.

In diameter yes, but as far as power,range, and speed are concerned, no.  The .223 has a much smaller and lighter bullet, and much more powder in the case than the .45, and more powder means more power.  The size of the bullet is not the major determining factor in the power of the cartridge.

 

P.S. I love you to usaf



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Posted By: hashi2008
Date Posted: 16 August 2005 at 1:51pm
 Well, the term "assault rifle" describes a gun that is, in a sense, half rifle and half sub machine gun.  They were designed to be able to fire rapidly, but still have a decent accuracy. Ideally, you should be able to use an "assualt rifle" as both rifle and sub-machine gun.  At least, this is what the Military channel told me.?.

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Posted By: Hairball!!!
Date Posted: 16 August 2005 at 1:53pm
Read the word. Sub-machine gun. It's shooting a round that's less than a machine gun. IE: pistol round.


Posted By: Predatorr
Date Posted: 16 August 2005 at 3:21pm
somebody go to wikipedia and settle this...


Posted By: Monk
Date Posted: 16 August 2005 at 3:26pm
Originally posted by Predatorr Predatorr wrote:

somebody go to wikipedia and settle this...


Ill wiki your pedia.

Im sorry, I just want to fit in.


Posted By: DBibeau855
Date Posted: 16 August 2005 at 3:36pm
That gun was meant to be like a broom rather than a true asault riffle. It was meant to put down a lot of fire in very little time. The thompson sub machine gun is also very very inacurate. Its a terrible weapon to use offensivly. Its more suited for CQB(close quarter battle) origionaly it was used as a trench sweeper.

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Posted By: southernboy51
Date Posted: 16 August 2005 at 4:52pm
yeah the tompson is not good for trying to flank or something but for holding off the enemy like just charging that is the gun i would have wanted


Posted By: DBibeau855
Date Posted: 16 August 2005 at 4:56pm
Were you listening at all? The thompson wasnt good for much of anything. It jammed all the time, the reciever rusted and it had terrible acuracy. The only thing it was good for was laying down a lot of fire at close ranges.

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Posted By: southernboy51
Date Posted: 16 August 2005 at 4:59pm
that is what i mean if someone is charging at me i would have wanted a thompson


Posted By: DBibeau855
Date Posted: 16 August 2005 at 5:03pm
No you wouldnt want a thompson. If you were comming up on a bunker. You would want a thombson. If someone is charging you, you would have wanted a grease gun, or a BAR.

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Posted By: southernboy51
Date Posted: 16 August 2005 at 5:09pm
yeah i see your point there but u cant forget the 30cal. machine gun but as far as other guns i would have wanted either a shotgun if i was in the pacific or a BAR they are sweet


Posted By: Dune
Date Posted: 16 August 2005 at 9:43pm

What about the British Sten gun?



Posted By: black04
Date Posted: 17 August 2005 at 12:00am

The definition of an "assault rifle": An Assault rifle is a type of automatic rifle. They have been defined
various ways, but they are generally understood to be selective fire
rifles or carbines (depending on the particular firearm's size), using
intermediate-powered ammunition. They can be considered a compromise
between the more powerful light machineguns and the long rifle
(or battle rifle), and the weaker submachine gun. Assault rifles are a
standard small arm in most modern armies. The name stems from a
translation of the German Sturmgewehr for a machine carbine they had
developed during WW2, and gradually became a popular term for these
sorts of firearms. The term has since been retro-actively applied to
earlier weapons with similar traits.

The difinition of a "submachine gun": A submachine gun is a firearm that combines the automatic fire of a
machine gun with the ammunition of a pistol, and is usually between the
two in weight and size. They were first experimented with in the form
of stocked pistols being turned fully automatic in the late 1800s and
early 1900s.

The first dedicated designs were developed in the latter stages of
WWI both as improvement on earlier stocked pistols, and to offer an
advantage in trench warfare. They rose to prominence as a front-line
and commando weapon during WWII, and are now widely used by police and
paramilitary organizations. They are ideal for close-range combat in
enclosed urban environments, where a weapon's range and accuracy is
less important than the ability to easily and instinctively spray a
target with bullets. They were also popularized in the 1920's and
30's as weapon of choice of gangsters. Submachine guns lack long-range
power and accuracy compared to higher power rifles, limiting their use
in the open.

Stocked automatic weapons firing a pistol rounds were developed around
the same time during World War One, by Italy, Germany, and the U.S.


 



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Posted By: Clark Kent
Date Posted: 17 August 2005 at 12:32am
Originally posted by Dune Dune wrote:

What about the British Sten gun?

Also ridiculously hard to shoot - it pulls up and right (for a right-handed shooter), but with the sideways magazine there is no good place to grip for good control. 

At least that has been my experience...



Posted By: Homer J
Date Posted: 17 August 2005 at 2:20am
It uses .45 ACP ammunition instead of rifle ammunition.


Posted By: Gilaga_Demon
Date Posted: 17 August 2005 at 3:38am

the reason its a sub-machine gun is because it uses a pistol round

just like the 9mm ar15 is classified as a sub-machine gun

also u wouldnt want a grease gun or a sten gun over a thompson they r junk i think the sten gun cost about 5 dollars to create and were designed so that the french resistence could make them easily u could make a sten gun in yur garage easily if u knew how

the problem about the thompson is that it weighs alot

also full auto guns r hard to control thats y yur supposed to fire in bursts

i have a thompson(semi-automatic) and the only trouble i had was with wolf ammo that was the only time that mine has jammed



Posted By: Geoduck
Date Posted: 17 August 2005 at 4:32am
I knew it was pistol ammo that makes rapid-fire guns submachine guns.

But here's a question for you all: what about the P90? Is that a submachine gun?

(I know the answer and why)


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Posted By: Kpoofs
Date Posted: 17 August 2005 at 4:55am
Originally posted by Random_Person Random_Person wrote:

Because it is a .45 caliber. It does not fire a round large enough to classify it as an "Assult Rifle."  Plus in the early 19-hundreds when the Tompson was first invented, the term "Assult Rifle" did not exist (the term "Assult Rifle" was coined in the early 90's by the Clinton admisistration, to give the misconception that certain rifles were only used for violent purposes).

 

That's why.




Assault*


God that was annoying me.


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Posted By: DBibeau855
Date Posted: 17 August 2005 at 4:56am
Ah, nitpick much?

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Posted By: black04
Date Posted: 20 August 2005 at 1:00am

Originally posted by Geoduck Geoduck wrote:

I knew it was pistol ammo that makes rapid-fire guns submachine guns.

But here's a question for you all: what about the P90? Is that a submachine gun?

(I know the answer and why)

because the weapon can be considered an SMG because its companion sidearm, the Five-seveN pistol, takes the same caliber rounds.



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my setup:
Ion
CP trigger
SP Q-lock feedneck
Check-it unimount 2
14" AA barrel


Posted By: druidsdecendant
Date Posted: 20 August 2005 at 1:23am
Originally posted by kuhndog599 kuhndog599 wrote:

why is the tommy gun classified as a sub machine gun and not an assault rifle

 

Sub machine-guns fire pistol rounds. Assault Rifles fire rifle rounds. It has to do with the size (length) of the cartridge casing.



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Posted By: WGP guy
Date Posted: 20 August 2005 at 10:30am
Originally posted by Geoduck Geoduck wrote:

I knew it was pistol ammo that makes rapid-fire guns submachine guns.

But here's a question for you all: what about the P90? Is that a submachine gun?

(I know the answer and why)


Yes it is because the FN 5-7 uses the same bullets that the FN P90 does.


Posted By: Geoduck
Date Posted: 20 August 2005 at 9:38pm
YUP!

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Calling Bush dumb is like calling a headless man blind.


Posted By: choopie911
Date Posted: 20 August 2005 at 10:05pm
Originally posted by Hades Hades wrote:

Good Marketing?

Rofl


Posted By: Smitty
Date Posted: 20 August 2005 at 10:12pm
Originally posted by Clark Kent Clark Kent wrote:

100 yards?  Heck, try hitting something with a Tommy from 20 yards.  That thing is impossible to control.
Which is why in movies, you see people using Tommy Guns just holding the trigger and swinging it back and forth.



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