Moussaoui lives.. why?
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Topic: Moussaoui lives.. why?
Posted By: Linus
Subject: Moussaoui lives.. why?
Date Posted: 03 May 2006 at 4:41pm
Why does he live? Seirosuly?
He's made countless admissions to wanting to kill AMericans, to being part of Al-Queda, and he said he was supposed ot be one of the hijackers.
Why does he live?
This is just a moral victory for terrorist everywhere-- we dont punish terrorist, instead we give them a better life then they had in whatever "poop"hole they came from.
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Replies:
Posted By: procarbinefreak
Date Posted: 03 May 2006 at 4:44pm
did he actually do anything? or was he just supposed to?
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Posted By: MeanMan
Date Posted: 03 May 2006 at 4:44pm
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id say put him into a military prison
you know with the people who torture people for a living, but got into trouble and got sent to prison
a life of torture is better
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hybrid-sniper~"To be honest, if I see a player still using an Impulse I'm going to question their motives."
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Posted By: Linus
Date Posted: 03 May 2006 at 4:46pm
procarbinefreak wrote:
did he actually do anything? or was he just supposed to?
| He admitted that he was supposed ot be one of the people on the planes and was sup[posed to kill Americans...
"Moussaoui has pleaded guilty to six counts of conspiracy in the only case brought in the United States in connection with the deadly hijacked airliner attacks that killed nearly 3,000 people. "
It's only conspiracy because we got to him first.
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Posted By: rednekk98
Date Posted: 03 May 2006 at 4:46pm
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He wanted to die, we're denying him that chance. I think it's just.
Al-Queda didn't even want him to be part of it, they thought he was too obvious for an operative, and too dumb to learn to fly. They proved to be right. The man is a wannabe. Ley's not turn this loser into a martyr.
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Posted By: NotDaveEllis
Date Posted: 03 May 2006 at 4:48pm
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Jury has to be unanimous for the death penalty.
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Posted By: Da Hui
Date Posted: 03 May 2006 at 4:48pm
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Him dead = Him Hero
Him tortured = Our victory
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Posted By: procarbinefreak
Date Posted: 03 May 2006 at 4:48pm
well... there is a difference... it's like saying i was supposed to go out tonight and kill a few people... but i had to help my mom clean the house...
or saying i was supposed to go sell some heroin but i didn't
i'm not saying that i wanted him to live... but i'm just saying there probably wasn't enough to put him to death.
just playing the devil's advocate here
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Posted By: Linus
Date Posted: 03 May 2006 at 4:50pm
NotDaveEllis wrote:
Jury has to be unanimous for the death penalty. | Which is why they should have debated until it became a hung jury (no pun intended)
That way, new jury.
And procarb, no. Your example isnt a conspiracy.
He had plans, he was going to do it, but got arrested.
In your example, you chose not to do it, no longer making it a viable threat (though in the future maybe...)
Dai Hui- him dead = dead martyr, but dead terrorist.
Him tortured = more worldwide outrage
Him in jail = terrorist now think w'ere too soft on terrorism. If he gets broken out, whats to say he wont kill Americans? Whats to say he wont kill prisoners?
I just hope a prisoner hates him enough that they finish the job...
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Posted By: Clark Kent
Date Posted: 03 May 2006 at 4:56pm
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I am surprised by how little I care.
Glad they got him, glad they convicted him, but death vs. life? I honestly have no opinion.
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Posted By: Da Hui
Date Posted: 03 May 2006 at 4:56pm
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Linus wrote:
NotDaveEllis wrote:
Jury has to be unanimous for the death penalty. | Which is why they should have debated until it became a hung jury (no pun intended)
That way, new jury.
And procarb, no. Your example isnt a conspiracy.
He had plans, he was going to do it, but got arrested.
In your example, you chose not to do it, no longer making it a viable threat (though in the future maybe...)
Dai Hui- him dead = dead martyr, but dead terrorist.
Him tortured = more worldwide outrage
Him in jail = terrorist now think w'ere too soft on terrorism. If he gets broken out, whats to say he wont kill Americans? Whats to say he wont kill prisoners?
I just hope a prisoner hates him enough that they finish the job... | Doubt it Al Quida has already said he was an embarrastment to their group.
If he gets tortured yes their will be outrage but also other terrorists will realize how much we despise them. Yes this is rather over the top idea but everywon here wants to know that he is in pain.
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Posted By: rednekk98
Date Posted: 03 May 2006 at 4:57pm
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I'd kind of like him thrown in a hole and forgotten about. Is the blink sheik still in prision? Did he die there yet? People can forget people like that exist.
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Posted By: Linus
Date Posted: 03 May 2006 at 5:07pm
Posted By: High Voltage
Date Posted: 03 May 2006 at 5:09pm
Clark Kent wrote:
I am surprised by how little I care.
Glad they got him, glad they convicted him, but death vs. life? I honestly have no opinion. |
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Posted By: Darur
Date Posted: 03 May 2006 at 5:14pm
Linus, I stand by the same view I had in the last thread I posted in.
Give him life in prison, not some famous huge prison, some random "average" Prison. Give him no special treatment, treat him EXACTLY like the burgler in the cell next to him and the drug dealer accross from him. Stop covering this trial now, never mention him again on the news, stop showing his face, stop saying his name on the media. The whole point of his mission was not so much to kill people as it was to invoke fear and spread their message. Yes, the objective was to bomb this places and kill thousands but the point was to spread fear. You keep publicizing him and he becomes a martyr. Hes already a martyr in fact, treat him like your average prison scum and hes just another criminal, the LAST thing he'd want.
No solitary confinement, no extra guarded cell, no special treatment or markings.
------------- Real Men play Tuba
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PH33R TEH 1337 Dwarf!
http://www.tippmann.com/forum/wwf77a/log_off_user.asp" rel="nofollow - DONT CLICK ME!!1
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Posted By: Simma Down!!
Date Posted: 03 May 2006 at 5:28pm
Da Hui wrote:
Him dead = Him Hero
Him tortured = Our victory |
To die by the infadels hands is one of the worst things they can do. Thats why they will blow themselves up or kills themselves when in danger of being captured.
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Posted By: .Ryan
Date Posted: 03 May 2006 at 5:59pm
God, a lot of you are no better than the people we are fighting....torture...please.
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Posted By: procarbinefreak
Date Posted: 03 May 2006 at 6:00pm
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my point is linus... saying you were going to do something isn't enough reason for a death sentence.
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Posted By: Cedric
Date Posted: 03 May 2006 at 6:05pm
I'm glad he's in jail, but I don't think he deserves the death penalty. Well, I don't think anyone deserves the death penalty.
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Posted By: reifidom
Date Posted: 03 May 2006 at 6:13pm
Live or die, he's never going to bother anyone again.
However I laughed when he said that America had lost because we had not given him the death penalty. I laughed because it is we who decided against killing him. He doesn't consider that his life was spared because we stuck to our justice system. We won in this case because we did not bend the rules to satisfy a morbid emotional response.
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Posted By: brihard
Date Posted: 03 May 2006 at 6:13pm
Darur pegged it.
Does he deserve death? By most standards, yes. However there were problems with the trial, and he ahs the same rights as anyone else to due process.
Letting him rot for life is actually mroe punishing. the knowledge that he cannot fight anymore will eat at him. Eventually he'll probably die in jail or kill himself, but it will be in ignomity. No sense making a martyr out of him. Reinforcing the notion that he is merely a criminal, and not some political entity is the most 'just' end to this.
My opinion of the death penalty has actually changed in the last year. In most situations I'm now opposed to it, unless a person is a risk of committing more crimes, and premeditated their first murder.
To kill for the sake of killing a person makes no sense. The vague notion of 'justice' is more often camouflage for simple retribution in this case. Obviously rehabilitation is unlikely, but 'punishment', and possibly deterrence, will be served much better by tossing the guy in a cell with Leroy or Clint.
------------- "Abortion is not "choice" in America. It is forced and the democrats are behind it, with the goal of eugenics at its foundation."
-FreeEnterprise, 21 April 2011.
Yup, he actually said that.
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Posted By: Linus
Date Posted: 03 May 2006 at 7:14pm
procarbinefreak wrote:
my point is linus... saying you were going to do something isn't enough reason for a death sentence.
| Yes, yes it is.
He had the plans, and if we didnt arrest him when we did, he would have followed through.
And Bri.. I dont want to support this scum-bag in a place where he will live a better life then where he came from when his intentions were to kill my fellow Americans. Its counter-productive to the whole war on terror.
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Posted By: brihard
Date Posted: 03 May 2006 at 7:23pm
Linus wrote:
procarbinefreak wrote:
my point is linus... saying you were going to do something isn't enough reason for a death sentence.
| Yes, yes it is.
He had the plans, and if we didnt arrest him when we did, he would have followed through.
And Bri.. I dont want to support this scum-bag in a place where he will live a better life then where he came from when his intentions were to kill my fellow Americans. Its counter-productive to the whole war on terror. |
Ah, so a person should now be put to death for hostile intentions? A legal pre-emptive strike policy directed at a single individual? Where does that slippery slope end? Where do you draw the line? How do you prove such a fantastically intangible concept as intention, and whether a eprson would actually follow through with it? You're actually starting to scare me with the lack of thought you put into your opinions, Linus- I'm starting to think your rather intelligent presentation of yourself here is merely a thin veneer for a very shallowly considered ideology of patriotism, and moreover one in which ignorance is sadly abundant.
How is it counter productive to the war on terror? You think they'd rather be locked up in Marion Federal Penitentiary than waging Jihad in Afghanistan, Iraq, Egypt, or Jordan? Not hardly. Death would martyr many who would otherwise not be particularly notable, and the impressionable youth would have another 'hero' to hold up. Ironically, were you to have been brought up in a fundamentalist islamic country, I can easily read your personality as being the sort to just as vehemently support the Jihad. You, Linus, are more a product of social conditioning than anything else. There's nothing wrong with loving and supporting your own culture by any means, but you do it blindly, and I suspect you'd wave the American flag right into tyrrany were your country truly headed in that direction. I optimistically choose to believe it isn't.
You're judging 'better life' by your own criteria again- material wealth and ignorant bliss; as long as you go to school, go to work, get weekends off, and have aTv to watch when you get home. The 'better life' for these maniacs would be matyrdom; being held up by those who share their faith as the image of a warrior, as they genuinely believe that this life is merely a transient stage on the way to Allah's right hand as long as they play their cards right. Rotting in an infidel prison would be one of the worst fates for these people.
------------- "Abortion is not "choice" in America. It is forced and the democrats are behind it, with the goal of eugenics at its foundation."
-FreeEnterprise, 21 April 2011.
Yup, he actually said that.
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Posted By: Bango
Date Posted: 03 May 2006 at 7:25pm
brihard wins!
------------- http://imageshack.us">
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Posted By: procarbinefreak
Date Posted: 03 May 2006 at 7:27pm
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ok... fine... how about another example that represents the situation a little better. school shootings... say i went around saying i was going to go to my school and go on a rampage.... i had plans, i had weapons, i had a list of names... everything. the cops showed up to my door the day before and arrest me and find all of this and i confess to all of it. am i going to be put to death? no.
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Posted By: brihard
Date Posted: 03 May 2006 at 7:28pm
procarbinefreak wrote:
ok... fine... how about another example that represents the situation a little better. school shootings... say i went around saying i was going to go to my school and go on a rampage.... i had plans, i had weapons, i had a list of names... everything. the cops showed up to my door the day before and arrest me and find all of this and i confess to all of it. am i going to be put to death? no.
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<cough>yourenotmuslim</cough>
------------- "Abortion is not "choice" in America. It is forced and the democrats are behind it, with the goal of eugenics at its foundation."
-FreeEnterprise, 21 April 2011.
Yup, he actually said that.
|
Posted By: Linus
Date Posted: 03 May 2006 at 7:33pm
brihard wrote:
Ah, so a person should now be put to death for hostile intentions? A legal pre-emptive strike policy directed at a single individual? Where does that slippery slope end? Where do you draw the line? How do you prove such a fantastically intangible concept as intention, | Lets see.. he admitted to it, he had plans, Al Queda said he was an operative, we arrested him before he got on, but during the trial countless times he said he wanted to kill Americans.. and yet, you want me to prove his intentions? Heh....
And procarb.. good point.
I really have no valid comeback at that except: the punishment should fit the crime.. but an example needs to be made. If one must die to make sure another 200 copy-cats dont come along.. or even just 2 copy-cats.. so be it.
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Posted By: mbro
Date Posted: 03 May 2006 at 7:36pm
and that would go against our american system. You don't kill anyone and you don't get put to death, simple as that.
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Don't blame me, I voted for Kodos.
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Posted By: Linus
Date Posted: 03 May 2006 at 7:38pm
mbro wrote:
and that would go against our american system. You don't kill anyone and you don't get put to death, simple as that. | What makes you say that?
And would you not kill a terrorist if it meant saving an innocent persons life? (Not talking about mousaoui.. )
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Posted By: brihard
Date Posted: 03 May 2006 at 7:39pm
Linus wrote:
brihard wrote:
Ah, so a person should now be put to death for hostile intentions? A legal pre-emptive strike policy directed at a single individual? Where does that slippery slope end? Where do you draw the line? How do you prove such a fantastically intangible concept as intention, | Lets see.. he admitted to it, he had plans, Al Queda said he was an operative, we arrested him before he got on, but during the trial countless times he said he wanted to kill Americans.. and yet, you want me to prove his intentions? Heh....
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Again, you miss the point. His intentions were quite clear. But one of the fundamental tenets of American law is the rule of precedent. Every case sets a standard that may be used in future cases, and possibly expanded. If you put one person to death for INTENTIONS ALONE, that gives all the legal authority needed for another person to be put to death for the same thing- in this case, the crime of conspiracy. Yes, this particular man's crimes were fairly heinous, however he did not take the life of another person through his own actions.
Once one person is put to death for intentions, then another may, for something slightly less serious. Once you break the line of 'premeditated murder' for death, where's the next line going to be?
------------- "Abortion is not "choice" in America. It is forced and the democrats are behind it, with the goal of eugenics at its foundation."
-FreeEnterprise, 21 April 2011.
Yup, he actually said that.
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Posted By: mbro
Date Posted: 03 May 2006 at 7:41pm
Linus wrote:
mbro wrote:
and that would go against our american system. You don't kill anyone and you don't get put to death, simple as that. | What makes you say that?
And would you not kill a terrorist if it meant saving an innocent persons life? (Not talking about mousaoui.. just debunking his view) | Then that would be an imminant threat where a life is in danger, that has legal precident, this does not. Your examples suck.
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Don't blame me, I voted for Kodos.
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Posted By: Linus
Date Posted: 03 May 2006 at 7:53pm
mbro wrote:
Linus wrote:
mbro wrote:
and that would go against our american system. You don't kill anyone and you don't get put to death, simple as that. | What makes you say that?
And would you not kill a terrorist if it meant saving an innocent persons life? (Not talking about mousaoui.. just debunking his view) | Then that would be an imminant threat where a life is in danger, that has legal precident, this does not. Your examples suck. | EXACTLY, this has NO legal precedent... so now this shows terrorist that if caught, worst we will do is feed them and clothe them and take care of them for the rest of their miserable worthless lives!
And you never asnwered my first question.. mind elabortaing please?
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Posted By: brihard
Date Posted: 03 May 2006 at 7:54pm
The concept of 'liberty' is lost on you, Linus. Were it not so frightening I'd find the irony amusing.
------------- "Abortion is not "choice" in America. It is forced and the democrats are behind it, with the goal of eugenics at its foundation."
-FreeEnterprise, 21 April 2011.
Yup, he actually said that.
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Posted By: Linus
Date Posted: 03 May 2006 at 7:57pm
brihard wrote:
The concept of 'liberty' is lost on you, Linus. Were it not so frightening I'd find the irony amusing.
| Ok, you lost me.
Are you saying people should be free to plan killing innocent people?
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Posted By: Tae Kwon Do
Date Posted: 03 May 2006 at 7:57pm
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We did the right thing.
Now he is a prisioner of the US, the people he hates, for life.
I think he would rather be dead.
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Posted By: brihard
Date Posted: 03 May 2006 at 8:03pm
Linus wrote:
brihard wrote:
The concept of 'liberty' is lost on you, Linus. Were it not so frightening I'd find the irony amusing.
| Ok, you lost me.
Are you saying people should be free to plan killing innocent people? |
Make the effort to understand what I say before you pound out a reply. I'm talking lack of liberty in punishment- not liberty to kill innocent people.
Prison denies liberty, something most people consider very dear- or at least think they do, until the defense thereof requires any sacrifice whatsoever on their own part. But I digress. Life in prison is no cakewalk, and is not by any means enjoyable. The subject is alive, but that's really all that can be said for them. Certainly a terrorist is no further threat once subjected to the prison regime. There's certainly no justice in killing a person who ahs not themselves taken life.
Your legal thinking is all screwed up, Linus. Every legal decision must be universalizable- i.e., applicable in every similar situation. One must take a Kantian approach to jurisprudence. Special treatment or punishment for a person just because he or she is a cultural enemy doesn't fly.
------------- "Abortion is not "choice" in America. It is forced and the democrats are behind it, with the goal of eugenics at its foundation."
-FreeEnterprise, 21 April 2011.
Yup, he actually said that.
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Posted By: mbro
Date Posted: 03 May 2006 at 8:11pm
Linus wrote:
mbro wrote:
Linus wrote:
mbro wrote:
and that would go against our american system. You don't kill anyone and you don't get put to death, simple as that. | What makes you say that?
And would you not kill a terrorist if it meant saving an innocent persons life? (Not talking about mousaoui.. just debunking his view) | Then that would be an imminant threat where a life is in danger, that has legal precident, this does not. Your examples suck. | EXACTLY, this has NO legal precedent... so now this shows terrorist that if caught, worst we will do is feed them and clothe them and take care of them for the rest of their miserable worthless lives!
And you never asnwered my first question.. mind elabortaing please? | Excessive bail shall not be required, nor excessive fines imposed, nor cruel and unusual punishments inflicted.
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Don't blame me, I voted for Kodos.
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Posted By: Linus
Date Posted: 03 May 2006 at 8:15pm
mbro wrote:
Linus wrote:
mbro wrote:
Linus wrote:
mbro wrote:
and that would go against our american system. You don't kill anyone and you don't get put to death, simple as that. | What makes you say that?
And would you not kill a terrorist if it meant saving an innocent persons life? (Not talking about mousaoui.. just debunking his view) | Then that would be an imminant threat where a life is in danger, that has legal precident, this does not. Your examples suck. | EXACTLY, this has NO legal precedent... so now this shows terrorist that if caught, worst we will do is feed them and clothe them and take care of them for the rest of their miserable worthless lives!
And you never asnwered my first question.. mind elabortaing please? | Excessive bail shall not be required, nor excessive fines imposed, nor cruel and unusual punishments inflicted. | Not cruel or unusual to kill a terrorist...
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Posted By: brihard
Date Posted: 03 May 2006 at 8:16pm
Pfft. If that mattered, it would have been one of the first few amendments, not left until the eighth.
MBROWNED
Linus: So it's not cruel to take a person's life, despite them not having committed a crime legally determined to have been deserving of such?
------------- "Abortion is not "choice" in America. It is forced and the democrats are behind it, with the goal of eugenics at its foundation."
-FreeEnterprise, 21 April 2011.
Yup, he actually said that.
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Posted By: mbro
Date Posted: 03 May 2006 at 8:17pm
Linus wrote:
mbro wrote:
Linus wrote:
mbro wrote:
Linus wrote:
mbro wrote:
and that would go against our american system. You don't kill anyone and you don't get put to death, simple as that. | What makes you say that?
And would you not kill a terrorist if it meant saving an innocent persons life? (Not talking about mousaoui.. just debunking his view) | Then that would be an imminant threat where a life is in danger, that has legal precident, this does not. Your examples suck. | EXACTLY, this has NO legal precedent... so now this shows terrorist that if caught, worst we will do is feed them and clothe them and take care of them for the rest of their miserable worthless lives!
And you never asnwered my first question.. mind elabortaing please? | Excessive bail shall not be required, nor excessive fines imposed, nor cruel and unusual punishments inflicted. | Not cruel or unusual to kill a terrorist...  | A terrorist who didn't kill anyone yes.
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Don't blame me, I voted for Kodos.
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Posted By: Linus
Date Posted: 03 May 2006 at 8:19pm
mbro wrote:
Linus wrote:
mbro wrote:
Linus wrote:
mbro wrote:
Linus wrote:
mbro wrote:
and that would go against our american system. You don't kill anyone and you don't get put to death, simple as that. | What makes you say that?
And would you not kill a terrorist if it meant saving an innocent persons life? (Not talking about mousaoui.. just debunking his view) | Then that would be an imminant threat where a life is in danger, that has legal precident, this does not. Your examples suck. | EXACTLY, this has NO legal precedent... so now this shows terrorist that if caught, worst we will do is feed them and clothe them and take care of them for the rest of their miserable worthless lives!
And you never asnwered my first question.. mind elabortaing please? | Excessive bail shall not be required, nor excessive fines imposed, nor cruel and unusual punishments inflicted. | Not cruel or unusual to kill a terrorist...  | A terrorist who didn't kill anyone yes. | But if given the chance, would have. And that fact is not in dispute according to the jury, it was uninamous.
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Posted By: mbro
Date Posted: 03 May 2006 at 8:20pm
This isn't minority report, you can't charge someone for a crime they did not yet commit.
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Don't blame me, I voted for Kodos.
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Posted By: Linus
Date Posted: 03 May 2006 at 8:25pm
mbro wrote:
This isn't minority report, you can't charge someone for a crime they did not yet commit. | If they admit to wanting to do it, and Al Queda has said that they are a member.. I say yes you can.
If they are an ackowledged member of a terrorist organaztation.. thats all I need to know.
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Posted By: mbro
Date Posted: 03 May 2006 at 8:27pm
Linus wrote:
mbro wrote:
This isn't minority report, you can't charge someone for a crime they did not yet commit. | If they admit to wanting to do it, and Al Queda has said that they are a member.. I say yes you can.
If they are an ackowledged member of a terrorist organaztation.. thats all I need to know. | wow
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Don't blame me, I voted for Kodos.
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Posted By: Linus
Date Posted: 03 May 2006 at 8:28pm
mbro wrote:
Linus wrote:
mbro wrote:
This isn't minority report, you can't charge someone for a crime they did not yet commit. | If they admit to wanting to do it, and Al Queda has said that they are a member.. I say yes you can.
If they are an ackowledged member of a terrorist organaztation.. thats all I need to know. | wow | If you said you were part of the KKK, and the KKK said you were a member, would I be wrong to call you a KKK member? A racist?
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Posted By: brihard
Date Posted: 03 May 2006 at 8:30pm
Linus wrote:
mbro wrote:
Linus wrote:
mbro wrote:
This isn't minority report, you can't charge someone for a crime they did not yet commit. | If they admit to wanting to do it, and Al Queda has said that they are a member.. I say yes you can.
If they are an ackowledged member of a terrorist organaztation.. thats all I need to know. | wow | If you said you were part of the KKK, and the KKK said you were a member, would I be wrong to call you a KKK member? A racist? |
Of course you could. You couldn't kill him though.
Your analogies consistently suck.
------------- "Abortion is not "choice" in America. It is forced and the democrats are behind it, with the goal of eugenics at its foundation."
-FreeEnterprise, 21 April 2011.
Yup, he actually said that.
|
Posted By: mbro
Date Posted: 03 May 2006 at 8:30pm
Linus wrote:
mbro wrote:
Linus wrote:
mbro wrote:
This isn't minority report, you can't charge someone for a crime they did not yet commit. | If they admit to wanting to do it, and Al Queda has said that they are a member.. I say yes you can.
If they are an ackowledged member of a terrorist organaztation.. thats all I need to know. | wow | If you said you were part of the KKK, and the KKK said you were a member, would I be wrong to call you a KKK member? A racist? | If I was a KKK member and said I was planning on lynching 3 Mexicans, 4 black people and 2 catholics should I be put to death. Because i'm a member of a bad organization and said I was planning on commiting a crime but have not yet carried it out?
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Don't blame me, I voted for Kodos.
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Posted By: Linus
Date Posted: 03 May 2006 at 8:32pm
brihard wrote:
Linus wrote:
mbro wrote:
Linus wrote:
mbro wrote:
This isn't minority report, you can't charge someone for a crime they did not yet commit. | If they admit to wanting to do it, and Al Queda has said that they are a member.. I say yes you can.
If they are an ackowledged member of a terrorist organaztation.. thats all I need to know. | wow | If you said you were part of the KKK, and the KKK said you were a member, would I be wrong to call you a KKK member? A racist? | Of course you could. You couldn't kill him though.Your analogies consistently suck. | Show me in my analogy where I said I'd kill him for being a KKK member... NO where.
Your arguements against my analogies suck.
Now.. if he was a KKK member, and the KKK said he was.. and he planned on killing a lot of black people, but before he got to he was arrested... but the rest of the KKK still went through with the plan.. then yes, he should be.
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Posted By: mbro
Date Posted: 03 May 2006 at 8:33pm
You need to get more education.
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Don't blame me, I voted for Kodos.
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Posted By: brihard
Date Posted: 03 May 2006 at 8:35pm
You're honestly frightening now, Linus- you're in favour of EXECUTING a person merely on the basis of their intentions. Do you have any idea how tyrranical that idea is?
------------- "Abortion is not "choice" in America. It is forced and the democrats are behind it, with the goal of eugenics at its foundation."
-FreeEnterprise, 21 April 2011.
Yup, he actually said that.
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Posted By: Bango
Date Posted: 03 May 2006 at 8:36pm
Linus wrote:
brihard wrote:
Linus wrote:
mbro wrote:
Linus wrote:
mbro wrote:
This isn't minority report, you can't charge someone for a crime they did not yet commit. | If they admit to wanting to do it, and Al Queda has said that they are a member.. I say yes you can.
If they are an ackowledged member of a terrorist organaztation.. thats all I need to know. | wow | If you said you were part of the KKK, and the KKK said you were a member, would I be wrong to call you a KKK member? A racist? | Of course you could. You couldn't kill him though.Your analogies consistently suck. | Show me in my analogy where I said I'd kill him for being a KKK member... NO where.
Your arguements against my analogies suck.
Now.. if he was a KKK member, and the KKK said he was.. and he planned on killing a lot of black people, but before he got to he was arrested... but the rest of the KKK still went through with the plan.. then yes, he should be. |
You were implying it.
------------- http://imageshack.us">
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Posted By: Linus
Date Posted: 03 May 2006 at 8:37pm
mbro wrote:
You need to get more education. | Ditto.
There is no reason why he should not have been put to death if he:
admitted to wanting to do it
kept operational knowledge of it from authorities before it happened
AQ said he was a member
he would have done it if he wasnt arrested
he proclaimed he would do it today if he had the chance
He is going to have a better life by living in the US, and STILL pose a possible threat.
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Posted By: mbro
Date Posted: 03 May 2006 at 8:37pm
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Bill_of_Rights - Reading material for Captain America (aka linus)
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Don't blame me, I voted for Kodos.
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Posted By: Linus
Date Posted: 03 May 2006 at 8:38pm
Bango wrote:
Linus wrote:
brihard wrote:
Linus wrote:
mbro wrote:
Linus wrote:
mbro wrote:
This isn't minority report, <span style="font-weight: bold;">you can't charge someone for a crime they did not yet commit</span>. | If they admit to wanting to do it, and Al Queda has said that they are a member.. <span style="font-weight: bold;">I say yes you can</span>.
<span style="font-weight: bold;"> If they are an ackowledged member of a terrorist organaztation.. thats all I need to know</span>. | wow | If you said you were part of the KKK, and the KKK said you were a member, would I be wrong to call you a KKK member? A racist? | Of course you could. You couldn't kill him though.Your analogies consistently suck. | <span style="font-weight: bold;">Show me in my analogy where I said I'd kill him for being a KKK member... NO where.</span>
Your arguements against my analogies suck.
Now.. if he was a KKK member, and the KKK said he was.. and he planned on killing a lot of black people, but before he got to he was arrested... but the rest of the KKK still went through with the plan.. then yes, he should be. | You were implying it. | Mbro said charge.. not kill
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Posted By: mbro
Date Posted: 03 May 2006 at 8:38pm
Linus wrote:
[QUOTE=mbro]
He is going to have a better life by living in the US, and STILL pose a possible threat. | haha, what's he gonna do, pretend a spoon full of pees is an airplane in the cafateria and crash it into a support pillar?
Possible threat my ass.
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Don't blame me, I voted for Kodos.
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Posted By: brihard
Date Posted: 03 May 2006 at 8:40pm
Linus, you have proven yourself to be prejudiced, ignorant, immoral, and dangerously ideological. I've no further interest in discussing this or other matters with you, as I've no faith that I'm conversing with a conventionally rational person. I'd suggest you take a close look at yourself in the mirror, analyze your opinions from something other than a tyrranically patriotic mindset, and decide if you as a human being can genuinely condone so much of what you advocate. People like you endanger the entire concept of your country and the notion of freedom.
------------- "Abortion is not "choice" in America. It is forced and the democrats are behind it, with the goal of eugenics at its foundation."
-FreeEnterprise, 21 April 2011.
Yup, he actually said that.
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Posted By: Bango
Date Posted: 03 May 2006 at 8:41pm
Linus wrote:
Bango wrote:
Linus wrote:
brihard wrote:
Linus wrote:
mbro wrote:
Linus wrote:
mbro wrote:
This isn't minority report, <span style="font-weight: bold;">you can't charge someone for a crime they did not yet commit</span>. | If they admit to wanting to do it, and Al Queda has said that they are a member.. <span style="font-weight: bold;">I say yes you can</span>.
<span style="font-weight: bold;"> If they are an ackowledged member of a terrorist organaztation.. thats all I need to know</span>. | wow | If you said you were part of the KKK, and the KKK said you were a member, would I be wrong to call you a KKK member? A racist? | Of course you could. You couldn't kill him though.Your analogies consistently suck. | <span style="font-weight: bold;">Show me in my analogy where I said I'd kill him for being a KKK member... NO where.</span>
Your arguements against my analogies suck.
Now.. if he was a KKK member, and the KKK said he was.. and he planned on killing a lot of black people, but before he got to he was arrested... but the rest of the KKK still went through with the plan.. then yes, he should be. | You were implying it. | Mbro said charge.. not kill  |
But by charging, he meant your wanting for Moussoui to be killed.
And what happened to my bold letters?!?!
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Posted By: Dye Playa
Date Posted: 03 May 2006 at 8:41pm
this guy wants to die. he goes to paradise when he dies. if he dies, he has completed his job as a martyr and is now a hero. if we let him rot in a jail cell, he getds none of this glory.
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Posted By: mbro
Date Posted: 03 May 2006 at 8:48pm
Linus wrote:
Mbro said charge.. not kill  | So you favor taking life without any due process of law, how american of you.
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Don't blame me, I voted for Kodos.
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Posted By: Linus
Date Posted: 03 May 2006 at 8:49pm
mbro wrote:
Linus wrote:
[QUOTE=mbro]
He is going to have a better life by living in the US, and STILL pose a possible threat. | haha, what's he gonna do, pretend a spoon full of pees is an airplane in the cafateria and crash it into a support pillar?
Possible threat my ass. | I knew you were going to be ignorant to history so I did a pre-emptive search---
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,190807,00.html - 1
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,190231,00.html - Look.. AL QAIDA escapee...
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,186056,00.html - Another
http://www.libcom.org/history/articles/blake-prison-escape-1966/ - Here ya go
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prison_escape - Another
http://www.suburbanchicagonews.com/joliet/prisons/escape3.html - They just keep coming
http://www.jamaicaobserver.com/news/html/20050331t220000-0500_77857_obs_prison_escape_bid_turns_deadly.asp - Oh look.. people died
http://www.signonsandiego.com/uniontrib/20051204/news_1n4escape.html - Look.. more AQ escape
http://abcnews.go.com/US/LegalCenter/story?id=1621591 - HA
http://www.cnn.com/2003/US/Northeast/10/13/jail.escape.ap/ - HAHA
Yup, he poses absolutly NO threat for escaping and killing innocent people....
EDIT: And Mbro.. I NEVER said there be due process, you just read what you wanted. Due process is a core right, and I'm 100% for it.
Mousaoui should have had due process, like he did. BUT THE PUNISHMENT, should have been different.
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Posted By: procarbinefreak
Date Posted: 03 May 2006 at 8:59pm
jesus christ linus do i need to post my school shooting example again!?
did you forget?
you can't charge anyone with a crime they didn't commit... being part of an organization is not a crime.
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Posted By: Linus
Date Posted: 03 May 2006 at 9:02pm
procarbinefreak wrote:
you can't charge anyone with a crime they didn't commit...
| Cant charge anyone for a crime they didnt commit?
Ever hear of conspiracy?
I mean.. Mousaoui just got charged and convicted for a crime he didnt commit, did he not?
Re-think what you said.
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Posted By: Reb Cpl
Date Posted: 03 May 2006 at 9:04pm
rednekk98 wrote:
He wanted to die, we're denying him that chance. I think it's just.
Al-Queda didn't even want him to be part of it, they thought he was too obvious for an operative, and too dumb to learn to fly. They proved to be right. The man is a wannabe. Ley's not turn this loser into a martyr.
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After this post, the rest of them weren't necessary.
Red hit it square between the eyes. I'm actually quite happy with the sentence. He was rejected by Al-Queda because he was too much of a moron to follow 'procedure' properly.
He wanted to die, and he could claim he was being killed in the name of God, and in the name of Islam, since he didnt get a chance to do it on 9/11. That would entitle him to entrance into paradise. By depriving him of that wish, we're punishing him more than we could ever hope to by killing him. How exactly do you punish someone by giving them what they want?
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Posted By: Gatyr
Date Posted: 03 May 2006 at 9:04pm
Linus wrote:
procarbinefreak wrote:
you can't charge anyone with a crime they didn't commit...
| Cant charge anyone for a crime they didnt commit?
Ever hear of conspiracy?
I mean.. Mousaoui just got charged and convicted for a crime he didnt commit, did he not?
Re-think what you said. |
...
Conspiracy to commit a crime is a crime. Not one punishable by death, however.
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Posted By: American Hero
Date Posted: 03 May 2006 at 9:07pm
He wanted to die so I say we let him die. He planned to kill americans, he deserves it. He isn't even a citizen, he's an enemy combatant so he has no rights. He should be put to death.
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Posted By: Reb Cpl
Date Posted: 03 May 2006 at 9:09pm
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American Hero wrote:
He wanted to die so I say we let him die. He planned to kill americans, he deserves it. He isn't even a citizen, he's an enemy combatant so he has no rights. He should be put to death. |
He was NOT an enemy combatant. He was a wannabe. He had dreams of grandure and when they didnt play out, he ranted and raved and lied about his involvement in order to get what he thought he deserved....paradise.
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Posted By: PlentifulBalls
Date Posted: 03 May 2006 at 9:23pm
Because you touch yourself!
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sporx wrote:
well...ya i prolly will be a virgin till i'm at least 30.
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Posted By: procarbinefreak
Date Posted: 03 May 2006 at 9:29pm
linus... i'll give you that one... but you are running around in circles... i make the point clear... you say you can't argue with it... now you're back at it.
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Posted By: brihard
Date Posted: 03 May 2006 at 9:32pm
Heh. He was a Jihad groupie. Like that socially awkward kid everyone knows who attaches himself to a group of people and never quite fits in, but they get him to do beer runs because he's not self confident enough to ask for a commission.
------------- "Abortion is not "choice" in America. It is forced and the democrats are behind it, with the goal of eugenics at its foundation."
-FreeEnterprise, 21 April 2011.
Yup, he actually said that.
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Posted By: .Ryan
Date Posted: 03 May 2006 at 9:34pm
We did the right thing. Killing him would have given him what he wanted and turned a AQ loser wannabe into a martyr. Brihard, I love the new Avvy....very nice...
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Posted By: Reb Cpl
Date Posted: 03 May 2006 at 9:36pm
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.Ryan wrote:
We did the right thing. Killing him would have given him what he wanted and turned a AQ loser wannabe into a martyr. Brihard, I love the new Avvy....very nice... |
This is the second time in a year that I've agreed with you....I must be getting soft. 
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Posted By: brihard
Date Posted: 03 May 2006 at 9:37pm
.Ryan wrote:
Brihard, I love the new Avvy....very nice...
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I like it too. 
I'm kinda surprised it took so long for someone to comment. I imagine it's actually sailed over several heads.
------------- "Abortion is not "choice" in America. It is forced and the democrats are behind it, with the goal of eugenics at its foundation."
-FreeEnterprise, 21 April 2011.
Yup, he actually said that.
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Posted By: Hades
Date Posted: 03 May 2006 at 9:40pm
Clark Kent wrote:
I am surprised by how little I care. |
And the difference between dying 40 years from now as opposed to dying in 6 months or so is......?
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Posted By: brihard
Date Posted: 03 May 2006 at 9:41pm
Hades wrote:
Clark Kent wrote:
I am surprised by how little I care. |
And the difference between dying 40 years from now as opposed to dying in 6 months or so is......? |
Depends on his cellmate.
------------- "Abortion is not "choice" in America. It is forced and the democrats are behind it, with the goal of eugenics at its foundation."
-FreeEnterprise, 21 April 2011.
Yup, he actually said that.
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Posted By: .Ryan
Date Posted: 03 May 2006 at 9:42pm
Posted By: Hades
Date Posted: 03 May 2006 at 9:47pm
Posted By: Reb Cpl
Date Posted: 03 May 2006 at 9:48pm
.Ryan wrote:
Reb Cpl wrote:
.Ryan wrote:
We did the right thing. Killing him would have given him what he wanted and turned a AQ loser wannabe into a martyr. Brihard, I love the new Avvy....very nice... |
This is the second time in a year that I've agreed with you....I must be getting soft. 
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Also, the travesty of the day is that we had this jerkwad's sentencing today instead of that of ObL.
Still agree?
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Absolutely.....now what are you trying to trick me into?
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Posted By: brihard
Date Posted: 03 May 2006 at 9:49pm
He has a surprise for your pooper.
------------- "Abortion is not "choice" in America. It is forced and the democrats are behind it, with the goal of eugenics at its foundation."
-FreeEnterprise, 21 April 2011.
Yup, he actually said that.
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Posted By: cadet_sergeant
Date Posted: 04 May 2006 at 11:03am
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the sentence is what it is there is nothing i or anyone on this forum can do to change it. so he got life and will eather be beat to death (highly unlikely that it will be done by a fellow prisoner considering he'll be in solitery, and a prison guard would have to be pretty dairing to do it also) in prison or would sit for 40-60 years and die. even if he got the death penalty he'd sit their for 20 years and we would be paying for it. him wanting to be a martyr is really irrelevent to the American justice system, people who say that he should not be killed because of wanting to be a martyr 1. just disagree with the death penalty across the board (like brihard my opinion on the death penalty has changed during this year my change is mostly because of biblical teaching it is in matt. not for sure on the chapter and verse) 2. think him dieing is him getting what he wants 3. know that killing him would cost more then having him sit in prison for 50 years (still doesnt makes since why but non-the-less it is true) or maybe 4. hope he gets his rear kicked often and within inches of his life.
Now i've heard from radio and on the net, about the possability of Al Queda, capturing Americans or other non-military personel and holding them captive, and killing them unless Moussaoui is realeased. I highly doubt Al Queda is that stupid, they could care less about Moussaoui, and if he is realeased for some stupid reason i couldnt see Al Queda letting him come back. then Again im not an expert on Extremist muslims but thats my guess.
Now killing him, what would it do? nothing. Again i couldnt imagin Al Queda getting their turbans in a bunch because he is dead, hell he would have been dead if he crashed a plane so what is the diffrence? more American lifes, most likely but it wont effect the war in any way. again im not an expert on Extremest muslims, or terrorist, infact my closest resemblence to terrorist is that like like to watch things go BOOM! followed by fire and smoke, and be honest guys you know you agree.
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Posted By: Justice
Date Posted: 04 May 2006 at 2:32pm
I like the decission. Now the piece of crap can rott in jail for the
rest of his life and not get his wish to die as a marter in the chair.
Dont worry his lil brown ring will be nicely stretched out this time
next year and I hope they poor pig blood on him or make him drink it.
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-JUSTICE
http://www.myspace.com/outkastpaintball - Outkast Myspace
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