in lieu of recent events, msn has on their website an article on whether or not teachers should carry guns or not. on their live poll the majority said no, but personally i think they should, especially in schools with no metal detectors....we've all seen that kid with the wild look in his eyes walking down the hall

discuss

TEHGANGSTER wrote: whaaaaaa? heck no, whos to say they wont go ape nuts and kill people too........

even if they a few teachers go nuts, theres still a whole school of other teachers with guns to take them out or something

^^^i dont think theres really a price on lives....

mabye if they use undercover cops as substitute teachers, they dont have to be able to do anything besides hand out dittos anyway

Tolgak wrote: 2) The eligible teachers are trained properly in the usage of guns and some basic combat (perhaps give them some situational training sessions with police departments or with Opsgear or something)

I pretty much agree with all of Tolga's post.  This point (#2) is the main reason I am against teachers with guns.  To acquire the type of competence with guns and their use that makes a person a suitable armed guardian of children is quite high.  This takes time, which means less time spent learning how to be a good teacher.

Frankly, our teachers are bad enough already.  The last thing we need is to add another set of duties and training to their requirements.  If we need more security in schools, lets hire professional security types - turning mediocre teachers into bad teachers and amateur security guards is a lose-lose proposition.

Clark and Tolga are on the right track, it would require a lot of training and proven competance with a firearm. As for putting more of a burden on teachers, well, it shouldn't be mandatory that a teacher be proficient with a firearm, it just should be legal for one to carry a concealed firearm on school grounds if they have proper training. Right now schools are a gun free zone. Meaning even if your state allows concealed carry you can't carry on school grounds. It's federally off limits. I just think teachers(or any other school staff) should be allowed to carry concealed on school grounds if they've been properly trained and the superintendant agrees on it. There are quite a few institutions that currently provide training for concealed carry, I'm sure they could work up a course and certification program that would fit the needs.

I have enough firearms training to qualify for a concealed carry permit in my state, but I wouldn't dream of actually doing it without better, specialized training, otherwise I'd be a liability to myself and others.

Also, if some maniac comes into the school pumping buckshot into students, he needs an immediate double tap to center mass, not a tranqilizer dart or load of rocksalt.

stun guns at most

this will never happen though

good thing

rednekk98 wrote: There are quite a few institutions that currently provide training for concealed carry, I'm sure they could work up a course and certification program that would fit the needs.

I guess I am looking for a higher standard.  In most states the amount of training required for concealed carry is minimal ("don't look down the barrel").  I'd want significantly more training before letting a teacher tote a gun to class.  I'm thinking police-level training, which is where my concern about the time involved comes in.

Obviously, if you don't feel that level of training is necessary, then my particular point goes away.

By institutions that provide training for concealed carry, I'm refering to places like thunder ranch, gunsite academy, SIG arms and I believe smith and Wesson all offer courses detailed for concealed carry. These are not beginner level courses and require a "don't look down the barrel" course beforehand. these courses get into things like choosing clothing and holster riggings that fit your needs, learning to draw a weapon from concealment, protect it from take-away, and work up to putting controlled pairs into the kill zone, tactical reloads, firing from cover ect. These institutions often also provide law enforcement training. They also focus a lot on shoot/no shoot situations, and really try to put students under stress and teach them to maintain control. A school of this sort with some research, could put together a training program geared towards stopping school shootings.

Having someone in the school trained in the use of firearms has already proven useful. The school resource officer at columbine traded shots with the gunmen(several high cap mags worth)and may have kept them busy long enough to save lives. I see no problem with allowing properly trained teachers to carry in addition to school resource officers.

Ideally, you could ammend federal law to allow for special exeptions to the no-gun zone(whatever they call it)to qualified faculty members with approval from the school administration and local police. The only people who need to know who carries are the superintendant/principal school resource officer and local police. If the training requirements were strict enough, I think this is reasonable.

I can try to dig up info on more advance training courses offered by private companies if you want.

EDIT: for example http://www.sigarms.com/EducationTraining/Courses/ShowCourses.aspx?ccid=10 - http://www.sigarms.com/EducationTraining/Courses/ShowCourses .aspx?ccid=10

Part of me wants to say yes.

If the individuals are fully trained by state law enforcement officials, carry concealed, issued pieces, the idea could have its merits.

But reality says no freakin way. Theres too much at risk, and it would only further the image of schools being unsafe.

Can you imagine firearms training being part of the standard education training in college? Necessary requirements for certification: familiarization and aptitude with standard sidearms in .9mm and .45 cal.

As a teacher and a firearms owner, I say yes....as a rational human being, I say no....security officials, would be cheaper in the long run.

Now, I am not nearly as opposed to the idea of teachers having access to some forms of less than lethal means...Theres less legislation involved.

rednekk98 wrote: Having someone in the school trained in the use of firearms has already proven useful. The school resource officer at columbine traded shots with the gunmen(several high cap mags worth)and may have kept them busy long enough to save lives. I see no problem with allowing properly trained teachers to carry in addition to school resource officers.

I certainly agree with this, at least in theory.  And the type of course you describe would go a long way towards making me comfortable with this.  But I also have a big chunk of the uneasiness that Reb describes.

But in any event I would NOT support making this a mandatory part of a teacher's job - I would at most support this for teachers with the additional training and additional background checks.  As Reb says, there is just too much at stake here.

Personally though I think some of the equipment in the metal shop and drafting rooms could be used harmfully. Imagine a compass through an eye and....

But seriously teachers with guns won't solve anything. By the time someone pulls a gun on you your dead. If you think that you can pull some Clint Eastwood <Swing and a miss....strike1> and whip out your pistol, slam the reciever back and pump three rounds in his forehead before the assailent with the loaded gun pointed at your head blows your brains out the back of your skull then by all means go for it so we can rid the world of one more stupid person. You in general of course this isn't directed at any one here.

For after all what's man in nature? A central point in between nothing & all, infinitely far from understanding either.