Your opinions on "mil-sim"?
Printed From: Tippmann Paintball
Category: Tippmann Paintball
Forum Name: New Player Forum
Forum Description: New to the sport? Get Professional Advice Here!
URL: http://www.tippmannsports.com/forum/wwf77a/forum_posts.asp?TID=164817
Printed Date: 30 December 2025 at 8:52am
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Topic: Your opinions on "mil-sim"?
Posted By: FlashGordon
Subject: Your opinions on "mil-sim"?
Date Posted: 28 February 2007 at 7:43pm
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What is the deal with milsim guns?
From the standpoint of either a woodsball or speedball player they are completely impractical. The scopes and sights have little to no utility and many are clumsy to hold. So what is the draw towards milsim? and why has milsim become synonymous with woods ball? What is the milsim demographic? Many of the players I have encountered are middle-aged men with no military service record. What do you think? Should we (as players) be concerned with these people who go to great lengths to replicate armed combat in what is nothing more than a game? What are your opinions? |
Replies:
Posted By: ANARCHY_SCOUT
Date Posted: 28 February 2007 at 7:43pm
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new players section....
------------- Gamertag: Kataklysm999 
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Posted By: Tolgak
Date Posted: 28 February 2007 at 7:45pm
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Your mother is impractical.
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Posted By: FlashGordon
Date Posted: 28 February 2007 at 7:46pm
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"New to the sport? Get opinions here!"
Sorry. This post doesn't fit there. I'm giving my thoughts, and asking for opinions. I think i'm in the right place. Thanks for the concern. |
Posted By: procarbinefreak
Date Posted: 28 February 2007 at 7:46pm
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they look cool... the parts cost an arm and a leg... and they're ridiculously heavy that's about it. |
Posted By: kickinwing2010
Date Posted: 28 February 2007 at 7:46pm
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What is this "woods ball" and "Speed ball" you speak of?
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Posted By: FlashGordon
Date Posted: 28 February 2007 at 7:47pm
Go back to PBNation |
kickinwing2010 wrote:Posted By: usafpilot07
Date Posted: 28 February 2007 at 7:49pm
Go back to wherever you've been the last two years. ------------- Buffalo buffalo Buffalo buffalo buffalo buffalo Buffalo buffalo |
Posted By: FlashGordon
Date Posted: 28 February 2007 at 7:50pm
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No, you.
Pssst, quit following me. |
Posted By: *Stealth*
Date Posted: 28 February 2007 at 7:50pm
Well, good on ya for proveing you know nothing about this forum. |
Posted By: Hella Cool
Date Posted: 28 February 2007 at 7:51pm
T&O is not for paintball. This post does belong in New Players. |
Posted By: jerseypaint
Date Posted: 28 February 2007 at 7:51pm
They really should change that. |
Posted By: FlashGordon
Date Posted: 28 February 2007 at 7:51pm
Yeah, sorry for the mistake. This place is worse than PBN |
Posted By: Yomillio
Date Posted: 28 February 2007 at 7:52pm
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you could at least be nice to the new people who dont know yet not to post this stuff here. He does technically have it in the correct place, just he dosent yet understand that our twisted minds have made T&O something complely different. Your post imparticular bothers me because you do post in the other parts of the forum, unlike most of the others who have said something along the same lines. ------------- 
http://www.tippmann.com/forum/wwf77a/forum_posts.asp?TID=172327 - Forum XBL Gamertag Collection |
Posted By: Tae Kwon Do
Date Posted: 28 February 2007 at 7:55pm
We were trying to help you. A lot of the people who post in Thoughts and Opinions section do not play paintball any more. ------------- 
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Posted By: FlashGordon
Date Posted: 28 February 2007 at 7:56pm
Hey, an intelligent post! Thanks Yom. |
Posted By: *Stealth*
Date Posted: 28 February 2007 at 7:57pm
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Posted By: ANARCHY_SCOUT
Date Posted: 28 February 2007 at 7:57pm
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Pretty much What TKD said, we need to change some of these titles.
------------- Gamertag: Kataklysm999
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Posted By: FlashGordon
Date Posted: 28 February 2007 at 7:57pm
Most of the posts in this topic have not been intended to help. But thanks Tae.
Doesn't mean I can't attempt to start an intelligent discussion about paintball in the proper section of a paintball forum. |
Posted By: FlashGordon
Date Posted: 28 February 2007 at 7:59pm
This forum just needs an Off-Topic or General Discussion area.. the proper divisions and explanations of the already existing forums are in place |
Posted By: Tae Kwon Do
Date Posted: 28 February 2007 at 8:00pm
1) I suppose yours are also included. 2) You can attempt all you want, but it should end up being moved to the proper section by a moderator. Not only that, but title does not dictate the "proper section." We here in T and O do not like the paintball topics. -------------
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Posted By: *Stealth*
Date Posted: 28 February 2007 at 8:01pm
Yes, yes it does. We DO NOT talk about paintball here, DO not... In no way, ever. Your logic "Just because I'm supposed to drive the speed limit doesn't mean I can't floor it to see how fast I can go" |
Posted By: Jack Carver
Date Posted: 28 February 2007 at 8:02pm
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I guess it just depends on what you're going for. Personally, I just want something that puts paint down the field and is easy to use. If other people want to go for realism and make paintball more of a war-game, that's also fine with me. The milsim crowd mostly does just back-yard ball and scenarios though, which are large markets, so I think it gets a lot of attention, even if it doesn't really represent what a lot of us think paintball is. |
Posted By: FlashGordon
Date Posted: 28 February 2007 at 8:02pm
1) Well yeah, that would make sense wouldn't it? I suppose it would look a little insane if I started talking to MYSELF in my thread.. 2) So don't post, let this topic die. |
Posted By: jerseypaint
Date Posted: 28 February 2007 at 8:03pm
| Not exactly true. I see a paintball thread come up once in a while. But its usually from a platty and has to do with "way back when". |
Posted By: Tae Kwon Do
Date Posted: 28 February 2007 at 8:09pm
I was not attempting to be hostile. I am simply saying, if you want intelligent, informed answers, Thoughts and Opinions is not the place. If you post this in New Players, you will get much better responses. Titles be damned. -------------
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Posted By: tecumseh
Date Posted: 28 February 2007 at 8:45pm
FlashGordon, it's absolutely no use to argue with TKD. He's one of the T&O gods , so please save us the flaming from here and put it into New Players.
------------- what? |
Posted By: Evil Elvis
Date Posted: 28 February 2007 at 10:48pm
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I am not Middle Aged, I have an Outstanding Service record and am a Decorated Marine. If your just going to try to flame MILSIM to try to gain some Internet Credz then by all means but Im moving this to an apropiate section. So that you may find what ever sort of discusion you wanted. ------------- 
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Posted By: procarbinefreak
Date Posted: 28 February 2007 at 11:11pm
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but elvis... you look so bad ass with your guns... so it's ok |
Posted By: FlashGordon
Date Posted: 28 February 2007 at 11:14pm
Save yourself the flaming.. you are the one posting in this thread. 
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Posted By: brihard
Date Posted: 28 February 2007 at 11:39pm
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It's another way to have fun with the game. Anyone who complains about marker weight is just weak. Some other stuff, such as stocks, are simply practical for those of us who shoot that way. ------------- "Abortion is not "choice" in America. It is forced and the democrats are behind it, with the goal of eugenics at its foundation." -FreeEnterprise, 21 April 2011. Yup, he actually said that. |
Posted By: FlimFlam
Date Posted: 01 March 2007 at 9:24am
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He's a Cuban Viking Pirate.... They all look badass... ------------- 
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Posted By: Bulldog
Date Posted: 01 March 2007 at 9:39am
Other then that no comment.
As to the thread, to each there own. When I was in the Army reserve I thought it was a down grade. When they took our M60's away and gave us Saw's. It was a big let down. So bigger, heaver and faster is the way to go in Mil-Sim. |
Posted By: Justice
Date Posted: 01 March 2007 at 9:48am
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Army wanna-bees?
I see regs post paintball topics all the time in T&O and you reply to them with the upmost respect, then lower post count forum members post paintball topics in T&O and ya chastise (sp) them. Shame on you. ------------- 
-JUSTICE http://www.myspace.com/outkastpaintball - Outkast Myspace |
Posted By: ShortyBP
Date Posted: 01 March 2007 at 10:06am
Thoughts and Opinions is NOT LIMITED TO NON-PAINTBALL TOPICS. If it were, it would state as such. Truth be told, it was the REGULARS section that was meant for non-paintball discussion. It only shifted to T&O due to the limited access. Heaven forbid someone post something Paintball related in a Paintball Forum! Y'all need to lighten up with the "Wrong Forum" garbage. |
Posted By: Linus
Date Posted: 01 March 2007 at 11:37am
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My opinion on it? Too expensive and impractical.
BUT... others enjoy it, especially at big scenerio games, and if they are willing to dish out the $$$, so be it. |
Posted By: tallen702
Date Posted: 01 March 2007 at 12:41pm
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Honestly, I don't see much of a practical use for the mil-sim add ons that so many people go for these days. There was just a 5 page thread on Spec Ops' video "Woodsball Revolution" which tries to explain away all of the extraneous crap that most people throw on their markers to go in the mil-sim direction. I guess what it truly comes down to is this; purely visual mil-simmers (mind you I said PURELY VISUAL) fall into the same category as ricers in my book. They are people who want the real thing but can't have it for whatever reason, so they go for the look and feel of a real fire-arm. Some of the guys like E.E. probably go mil-sim because they know how to use the equipment rather well due to their military service. The vast majority of it, however, is what paintball started out as, simulated warfare without the consequences. There was a huge push from the late 80's until recently to make paintball as non war-like as possible to keep from offending the PC sensibilities of zealots the nation over. The sport/game has since gained enough main-stream support that the mil-sim guys can come out of hiding and do what they do. The ONLY mil-sim guys I take offense to are the ones who try to bash speeball/tournaments by saying how "impractical" or "ineffective" the gear is when put into a different situation. Again, there's a reason most GOOD scenario teams keep speedballers on the roster. We can punch a hole in a line faster and more effectively than just about anyone else out there. ------------- <Removed overly wide sig. Tsk, you know better.> |
Posted By: killerhalo
Date Posted: 01 March 2007 at 1:36pm
| mislim is for use in scenarios and tactical tranning like paintball adventures http://www.fantasyspycamp.com - advanced tactical systems there that is true mislim and popo training |
Posted By: Gatyr
Date Posted: 01 March 2007 at 2:26pm
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If you are worried about "practical", why play paintball in the first place? Spend your time helping the needy, or making your car run batter, or something practical.
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Posted By: TippmannBro
Date Posted: 01 March 2007 at 2:40pm
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As far as practicality, some milsim stuff doesn't do anything for the player. Some of it does, however, and some companies are getting good at combining milsim looks with paintball practicality. Examples: The Apex with the M-16 shroud. I have this on my gun, and it looks good while giving the capabilities of the Apex. SpecOps Commando Stocks have a groove cut out for a players mask to fit in behind the gun, making it easier to aim. These stocks also have air-through capabilities for those that want it. Furthermore, SpecOps created the dogleg stocks that allow you to shoulder the gun and make it super easy to aim at the same time. There are numerous magazines that have regulators built into them, like the Trinity AK-47 mag that has a Palmer Stabilizer built into it. Some scenario players like to have milsim stuff just because it looks cool. Some like to have it because they want to simulate the feel of an actual firearm. Some have milsim stuff because it allows one marker to have several different capabilities, such as the addition of electronic sights, grenade/rocket launchers, flashlights, ect... I don't know what the milsim demographics are, but it would be interesting to know. I have a milsim marker for one reason: I wanted to have the feel of an actual firearm, just for kicks. I guess it was just a phase, but now I would like to make a few changes to make the marker more practical and easier to use. Speedball players are just as good in the woods. The skill sets for speedball and woodsball are incredibly similar once you break it down. Markers designed for speedball can just as easily be used in the woods the same way milsim markers can be used on speedball fields (although, there are some things about milsim markers that would make them difficult to use on speedball fields, such as stocks, extra weight, ect...) There has been a recent trend for players to take up woodsball over speedball. I will leave the reasons for that to another thread, but the bottom line is that woodsball/milsim stuff is getting very popular. And where there is an interest, paintball companies will accommodate that market. I don't think that there is a problem with milsim players and people getting concerned with people trying to replicate actual combat. It is still a sport, not real combat, and as long as players are mature enough to realize this, then there will not be a problem. Some companies and organizations (US military) replicate combat with milsim stuff for training purposes, but these people realize the implications of what they are doing and take it very seriously. ------------- WAR EAGLE!!! |
Posted By: Tae Kwon Do
Date Posted: 01 March 2007 at 2:40pm
Most delicious car ever. -------------
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Posted By: tallen702
Date Posted: 01 March 2007 at 3:24pm
Where are you going to find a fryer big enough? ------------- <Removed overly wide sig. Tsk, you know better.> |
Posted By: brihard
Date Posted: 01 March 2007 at 3:33pm
Army surplus? ------------- "Abortion is not "choice" in America. It is forced and the democrats are behind it, with the goal of eugenics at its foundation." -FreeEnterprise, 21 April 2011. Yup, he actually said that. |
Posted By: killerhalo
Date Posted: 01 March 2007 at 4:43pm
| ^^^^^ hahhah true |
Posted By: brihard
Date Posted: 01 March 2007 at 4:46pm
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Speaking for myself, pretending to be in the army makes me feel like a man.
------------- "Abortion is not "choice" in America. It is forced and the democrats are behind it, with the goal of eugenics at its foundation." -FreeEnterprise, 21 April 2011. Yup, he actually said that. |
Posted By: VBHARDCORE
Date Posted: 01 March 2007 at 5:33pm
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I like "milsim". It is what I got into when I started playing. Being that I am not middle aged and I did sink a lot into my a5 to make it look like I wanted it to I felt like saying something. I am 29, I have a full time job, I own my own house and have a wife and a beautiful little girl. I would not consider my self aggro and I have not ever been in the military. The reason that I like "milsim" so much is because it takes me back to when I was a kid playing G.I. Joes in the woods. It is my way I have fun for myself for a few hours every couple weeks and get away from life's pressures. I am not concerned with speedball or tournyball. They are cool and I think my a5 probably cost about as much as a ego or a high end marker. I do have all the performance upgrades done that I could do. I really don't see where someone would be so concerned with me and some of my buddies playing in the woods next to my house. Our guns maybe heavy and impractical but I get just as excited playing as someone going out to the x ball field. I hope that I did not offend anyone with my answer and I hope we can just all play in peace. Who knows, I might head out to the speed ball field at my local spot and get lit up by your ion, timmy, ego or what ever you shoot. Hopefully you can come out to the woods and get the same with a a5 that weighs a ton! ------------- 
The one you love to hate |
Posted By: Evil Elvis
Date Posted: 01 March 2007 at 5:40pm
At work some of the Hippies that work in IT drive those "Grease Cars" cars that run off Bio Diesel. Those who use recycled Frylator grease always leave that scent of deep fried food. Always makes me hungry when they drive by. -------------
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Posted By: netramakin
Date Posted: 01 March 2007 at 8:16pm
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Completely? I think you're overstating it, though I do think some people go overboard. I normally like my A-5 smallish (see my sig) but I sometimes beef it up. In a nighttime scenario, for example, I mount a tac light and laser on a Flatline, which makes it quite a bit longer, but only a pound or so heavier. And for scenarios, those grenade launchers really do come in handy.
A red dot can be used effectively; the others probably not, but I don't have any experience with them. My A-5 doesn't feel any clumsier than my son's Ion, though. A bit heavier, maybe, but not clumsier. In fact, I think the balance of my gun is a lot better than my son's, with that big honkin' hopper on there (DXS Pulse).
When you were 6 or 7 years old, playing cops & robbers or whatever, did you picture yourself with a gun or a marker? That's what paintball is all about: losing yourself for a few hours and why not do it in an environment that kind of feels like warfare, if that's what you enjoy? Maybe you prefer the more "sporty" feel of speedball, but it doesn't mean everyone does. I do enjoy speedball; I just prefer woods. Well, actually I prefer urban, but if you're lumping them all together...
Milsim markers emulate real guns, woods emulate a battle field; well, at least a lot more than a woodsball field.
I can only speak for myself and my friends, but we're all late 20's to late 30's, male, some with military experience, some not.
To you it may be a game like a sport. To others, the game is pretending to be in combat. As long as everyone knows it's a game, who cares? BTW, you do know you're on the Tippmann forum, right? ------------- 
"I'm a riddle so strong, you can't break me." |
Posted By: SSOK
Date Posted: 01 March 2007 at 8:29pm
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I usually only put stuff on my gun if it serves a purpose. Milsim is an art if its something different, but I wouldnt want one. I have nothing against it, but I hate Spec Ops little crowd of snipers and milsim freaks, and the generic M16 98 Custom. Anything that truely is Custom I do have alot of respect for though. ------------- 
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Posted By: a5Tpp789
Date Posted: 01 March 2007 at 8:57pm
milsim -------------  if you put 500 dollars into an A5 it is still an A5
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Posted By: jimmy_needles
Date Posted: 01 March 2007 at 11:39pm
yeah the milsim like an armotech or ariakon is pretty unreasonable. i like the look of the guns because i am a proud member of the military and am a medic for the marines so i like the military aspect. as for middle aged guys using them its probably because about 95% of young boys playe with toy soldiers and never joined so now they act like they are in. thank god i dont have to worry about that lol ------------- "a marine will give up his rations but will never give up his corpsman" |
Posted By: Black_Shadow
Date Posted: 02 March 2007 at 11:39am
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personally, i dont like the look of alot of milsim markers, i dont mind the looks of the sporty speedball guns, but a well built milsim gives does give me a bit of appreciation for them... im not a scenario player through, more of a rec-ball/woodsball player... ------------- 98CP ACT R/T J&J Ceramic 14" Egg II w Z-Board GTA Inline X-Chamber NCStar Red-Dot Pen Spring Mod Trigger Stops Polished Internals Dye Sticky Grip 20oz Co2 w On/Off Next Up: Spimmy |
Posted By: Cuthbert
Date Posted: 02 March 2007 at 11:52am
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Not everyone that enjoys paintball is eleven years old.
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Posted By: netramakin
Date Posted: 02 March 2007 at 1:45pm
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So what kind of markers do you like? -------------
"I'm a riddle so strong, you can't break me." |
Posted By: Justice
Date Posted: 02 March 2007 at 1:52pm
Well he does not like Milsims so that leaves most likely only one other "catagory" left.... -------------
-JUSTICE http://www.myspace.com/outkastpaintball - Outkast Myspace |
Posted By: netramakin
Date Posted: 02 March 2007 at 1:56pm
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I know but he says he doesn't mind speedball guns. If you don't really like at least one type, why is he on a paintball forum? Not trying to be a jerk; just curious. -------------
"I'm a riddle so strong, you can't break me." |
Posted By: Justice
Date Posted: 02 March 2007 at 2:09pm
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Right, Maybe he likes pee shooters. -------------
-JUSTICE http://www.myspace.com/outkastpaintball - Outkast Myspace |
Posted By: Duechy
Date Posted: 03 March 2007 at 8:16pm
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I hope thats not a typo. I just spit pop all over my monitor. Thanks. ------------- One shot, One kill.... Oh, wait. What fun is that? TEN shots, one kill, and a bunch of welts on your back. |
Posted By: Ken Majors
Date Posted: 03 March 2007 at 9:41pm
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I started out with a mil-sim 98.
Since then I have moved on to a PM5, A-5, Ion, Tac-One, and now an EMag. The 98 was reliable, with an extremely quick rate of fire. Pointed nicely with a mask, and was easy to carry with a one point sling thing. I truly miss that 98. The A-5 was just as reliable, a bit heavier, and did not point as well. The best marker I have ever shot, is my EMag. An ETac conversion really. Bought the EMag, swapped out my Tac-One body and rail, and it is a nice marker. Heavy by todays standards, but very reliable, mech or electric with the flick of a switch. It's like a sore penis...you just can't beat it. 
I was big into mil-sim when I started. I have always played scenario paintball/woodsball. It is a question of function vs. form. I would not have a problem going back to my old 98 mil-sim. It ain't the arrow, it is the Indian....in my opinion. I do love the Etac...I will always own this marker. Notice that I did not mention that PM5 anywhere? That was the biggest piece of crap I ever owned. It could shoot 20bps, and it would at the chrono. Once it hit the field, it never worked...NOT even ONE time. Speedball or woodsball...it let me down Every single time. Traded it for the Emag...and man did I get the best trade in the history of paintball. The difference in Speedball and woodsball is in the player. If you can play well, it does not matter what you play. You will be successful with what ever marker you choose to master. However, you must choose to master it, and practice. Front sight focus, aim and squeeze. It's all the same, in any game you play. If you like Mil-sim...Tippmann markers are awesome. Tons of upgrades and military look a like stuff. Spec-ops has a ton of really expensive crap to hang off your marker. It's all furniture though, has no effect on performance. As they say...it's the "**edited**a behind the trigga" that makes a weapon effective. Spend your money on paint, play time, and air. If you play more than your opponent, you will be better than he is. Don't waste it on furniture. ------------- RLTW |
Posted By: Rock Slide
Date Posted: 06 March 2007 at 12:28am
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Does this mean I have to get rid of the cup holder? ------------- I bring annihilation and cheap red wine! |
Posted By: Ken Majors
Date Posted: 06 March 2007 at 1:05am
Thats not a cup holder....that is your cyclone feed. If you would shoot more than 1 ball a minute you might need that. 
But in your current condition....it probably works better as a cup holder.  ------------- RLTW |
Posted By: Kayback
Date Posted: 06 March 2007 at 5:39am
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Personall I prefer the more tactical aspect of woodsball over speedball.
I honestly don't see the point of dumping paint down range and running from little blow up cover to the next. I've sure it's all very intense and everything, but the one or two games I played struck me as very *bleh*. The first paintball games I played were out doors, in the bush. So that's pobably why I like it more. There is a lot to be said even for a simple, small area game like paintball, for fieldcraft. You can sneak trough the bushes, trying not to make a sound, or you can run helter skelter speed ball like through the open. I prefer mil sim styled gun, especially guns that are made with as close to exact copies because those guns work. Seriously, there is a reason why the AK, the M16 and to a lesser degree the G36 are popular weapons and popular mods. They have damn nice ergonomics. There is a small disadvantage of having a paintball mask on when you playing, but the M16/M4 and the G36 were designed to be shot with gas masks on, so they aren't affected too badly. Now for add ons? Well those can either add or detract to the gun. Personally I like my rifles in real life to be clean. A combat optic of some sort is the most I would want on my rifle, but I'm only a cop. So I don't need grenade launchers, laser designators, or thermal scopes. If putting something like this on makes you enjoy your game more, then I'm all for it. It's like someone asking you why you've got a rocker triger, a double trigger, an E-trigger, a motorised hopper, a remote tank....All these things are improvements in YOUR opinion. The guys who want to stick Mil Surp on their guns think that helps them. Should we be worried about it? Hell no. It's just guys playing the game how they thing the game should be played. You'll find this sort of devision in any hobby sport. Look at RC's. The debate between pertrol .vs Battery? Same sort of arguments. When people actually start taking over woods ball to train their militia, ranting anti goverment speach and white supremecy? Then yes lets get worried. KBK |
Posted By: Black_Shadow
Date Posted: 06 March 2007 at 8:27am
well personally i like the look of the 98C, Automags, and Ions. what do they all have in common? Nothing, i just like how they feel to hold. and their on the smaller size so they fit me nicely. I'm on the smaller side of the human race at 5'10 and 140 pounds. The huge bulk of milsims just doesnt suit me or my playing style. so i dont like em, but i dont mind seeing a well built milsim, sometimes they look pretty cool. ------------- 98CP ACT R/T J&J Ceramic 14" Egg II w Z-Board GTA Inline X-Chamber NCStar Red-Dot Pen Spring Mod Trigger Stops Polished Internals Dye Sticky Grip 20oz Co2 w On/Off Next Up: Spimmy |
Posted By: netramakin
Date Posted: 06 March 2007 at 1:26pm
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So you're not from Detroit, then? Oh right, Antarctica; I forgot. -------------
"I'm a riddle so strong, you can't break me." |
Posted By: IronHorseSniper
Date Posted: 06 March 2007 at 3:34pm
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I love mil-sim mainly for one reason- it inflicts a reasonable amount of intimidation on the opposing team. I happen to have a BT4 Ironhorse, and the thing pretty much scares the crap out of the speedballers who have those rinky-dink little pocket size guns when they see me marching down the field, firing 13-15 balls a second (yes, I did get the e-trigger). People also tend to fight over me when choosing teams when they see my gun and when I demonstrate its firepower. It also helps intimidate the opposing team when I just walk down the field, releasing a solid stream of paint at them, which I have been tending to do recently. Everybody's like "is he just walking? he can't be serious". Then when I unleash unholy hell upon them (the drop ball feature of my apex barrel works wonders on the little buggers who refuse to move from their hiding spots), they don't want to be on the recieving end anymore. ------------- If my answers scare you, perhaps you should cease asking scary questions. |
Posted By: Commander_Cool
Date Posted: 06 March 2007 at 6:45pm
by speedball kids...I assume you mean new players who use spyders? by pocket size guns you mean faster shooting, small and lighter guns? Darn those qualities must be horrible where ROF, weight, and a small profile are all beneficial. 13-15bps = not that fast. Anyone that is impressed w/ the ROF of your BT gun is a newb, and you are an idiot. Your post has no merit. ------------- 2005 Freestyle Naughty Dawg Freestyle Angel LCD SP-8 Tippmann 98 Custom |
Posted By: Langside
Date Posted: 06 March 2007 at 6:48pm
| My shocker fires atleat 22bps. I could prolly get up to 13 in semi. |
Posted By: tallen702
Date Posted: 06 March 2007 at 8:58pm
See, to me, Speedball is far more tactical than woodsball, more strategically oriented as well. there is a clearly defined objective, and if you have the major benefit of playing on a team, then it's all about strategy and tactics. There is a reason guys like USAF, Gatyr, myself, and the other tourney/speedball guys on this forum practice on average about once-per-week, it's not to just go dump paint down a lane, we work on strategy, tactical maneuvers, how to cope with situations where you are outnumbered and out-gunned, and most importantly, how to get more points than the bastards across the way. In a game where their are points for first grab, eliminations, staying "alive" and capping, the strategical and tactical aspects go above and beyond anything in rec-ball games of woodsball where there is usually a singular way to win (eliminate the opposition, cap the flag, hold the fort, etc) and there is no grab for points. I highly suggest getting to know some speedball guys at your local field and watching what they do. Go play with them and have them give you some direction, I guarantee you'll see the gameplay in a whole new light. ------------- <Removed overly wide sig. Tsk, you know better.> |
Posted By: IronHorseSniper
Date Posted: 06 March 2007 at 10:01pm
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I've already played with speedballers in my area, and for some reason they're more cocky than the rec-ballers I play with, at least until they're out of their sugar high induced comas on the rec ball fields. I just don't like speedball for 2 main reasons- it wastes too much paint, and the matches don't last long enough. Maybe it's just me, but I prefer matches where you don't know where everyone is and there's plenty of cover for both sides, making it equally as hard to zero in on an opponent, let alone a group of them and effectively take them out. Maybe I just like it for the fact that rec-ball, woods ball, and scenario games are more at home for my mil-simming self where I have something in my hands that actually resembles a real gun for the most part. But I don't know, maybe it's the whole aspect of the war simulation that I like so much, because god knows there's some people I know who I'd like to shoot with a real gun but instead take my frustrations out on the paintball field instead of actually shooting someone on the street with a real gun. ------------- If my answers scare you, perhaps you should cease asking scary questions. |
Posted By: Kayback
Date Posted: 07 March 2007 at 7:59am
Thats pretty much how we play rec, woods and scenario at my local field. The exact same things happen in woods, yet there is less "cover by fire". As I said, it's probably all very entertaining when you get into it, but it doesn't attract me. I'd prefer to take one pod of paint onto a field and have a nice outdoors game. Like I said, basic fieldcraft can increase your kill ratio by over 100% in most woods/scenario games. How do you blend in with a 6ft tall bright orange, paint covered blow up bunker? I do understand there are more "points" to be played over in Speedball than the more or less binary system of rec/woods/scenario, but that sorta how it is isn't it? I don't get this "we won by one point" or whatever. "We totally killed your entire team and, to use 1337 parlance, Pwned you. " is a little more indicative of who's better than who. But that said we also play variations of speed ball scoring systems sometimes. Basically slow moving Speedball, in bushes. It's fun. We also play very basic "tag" rules sometimes. We also play elimination rules. Sometimes we play (when we are feeling masochistic) multi hit kills. This one works better with Laserquest packs, but works just as well in Paintball. True most of these ones are played for gits and shiggels, but we still play it. Aside from capture the flag, what do you play on a Speedball field? KBK |
Posted By: MeanMan
Date Posted: 07 March 2007 at 8:02pm
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Ok, first off, unless you are playing horrible new players, you shouldnt really know where every person on the other team is, and both sides have equal cover. Second, speedball is a faster game, some people cant take it because they are too weak to carry around their massive guns and slide/run into spaces. Third, if you are good, you dont have to waste a lot of paint. And finally, the fourth, in speedball, you dont zero in on a group and take them out, RARELY people group up in speedball, because an easy flank can take them out.
Sounds like you have some anger management problems, you shouldnt be thinking about that, im actually serious here. Problems can escalate on a field with people who think they are the greatest, and you have to handle them, and that doesnt mean imagine that you're really shooting them.
All the posts ive seen you make have been promoting BT, milsim, or defending milsim, and have been, for a lack of a better word, "bashing" speedball "pixies" as you like to call us. People are getting sick of it. ------------- 
hybrid-sniper~"To be honest, if I see a player still using an Impulse I'm going to question their motives." |
Posted By: tallen702
Date Posted: 07 March 2007 at 9:22pm
Hehehe, tell that to the guys at the local field who, when they see me with a DM and a full pack, automatically volunteer me as the "squad-LMG-gunner" I think I actually dump more paint in the woods than I do on a speedball field for all the cover I give.  But yes, if you like the stalking/lurking aspect of the game, woodsball beats the heck out of speedball.
I know what you mean, while it does attract me, I still like to go out with a very basic marker (my nelspot-007) and do some low-cost woods-balling. Like I said, basic fieldcraft can increase your kill ratio by over 100% in most woods/scenario games. How do you blend in with a 6ft tall bright orange, paint covered blow up bunker?
Certainly if you wind up wiping the field with the opposition in a tournament, it's pretty clear that they either had a bad game, or you're much more proficient at the sport than they are. But a lot of speedball teams are more evenly matched than the average pick-up/walkon game, so the points system gives you a clearly defined winner. Also, speedball tends to be on the "sport" end of the paintball spectrum while woods/rec/scenario tends to reside on the "game" end. Hockey matches, soccer, baseball, etc. can all come down to 1 point games, but you need a winner no matter how close the margin is. Hence the point system in speedball.
I think you'll find that a lot of speedball aspects make their way into your woodsball play. The same also happens the other way around, but less so. As for what games you can play on the speedball field other than CTF. Elimination, "gauntlet" style games (like protect the president, etc) you can play multiple hit games, etc. Just about anything you'd play on a woodsball field with the exception of the "hunt the sniper" type games or, if you're lucky enough to have structures, "house assaults". The fact of the matter is, speedball bunkers/hyperball tubes/pallet fields have just as much (if not more in some cases) cover as a wooded field does. It just happens to be more strategically placed.
Speedball clearly isn't your thing, and that's fine. Seriously, I'm not going to try and talk you into it. But for those of us who greatly enjoy competing in the "sport" end of paintball, there isn't anything out there that is truly like the mayhem you put yourself in the middle of every time break out of the starting box. ------------- <Removed overly wide sig. Tsk, you know better.> |
Posted By: mamasboi
Date Posted: 07 March 2007 at 11:58pm
| i my self like the look of mil-slims but just the time and money needed to put into one. is not my slice of pie. |
Posted By: johnson1456
Date Posted: 12 March 2007 at 6:29pm
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thats where working with a tippmann dealer pays off, msrp is expensive. (im learning to edit my own posts!) as for the topic...i have a mil-sim x7 because i prefer the look of a real gun, not because i am imagining it being one its just my personal opinion. i do not play sppedball cause i like the large area of woodsball and honestly, i think i would get completly wrecked in speedball with my x7. someday when i get my x7 the way i want, i would love to get a spiffy looking speedbal gun with all the performance ugrades. there shouldnt be an arguement about which type of gun is better because it all depends on the player. as for ironhorse thats just way to cocky for me and sounds like pretty bad strategy cause i know if i see someone walking down a field randomly spraying paint everywere, im lighting their ass up. ------------- Johnson 
x7: flatline, "T" dot scope, folding vertical handle...still in work |
Posted By: Kayback
Date Posted: 13 March 2007 at 2:56am
Wasn't trying to talk you out of speedball either. Just healthy active debate. KBK |
Posted By: tallen702
Date Posted: 13 March 2007 at 12:31pm
I realized that. I was just happy to have someone who could debate their side with eloquence and dignity! Normally you just get flamed when you try to explain your point of view on speedball to some of the younger crowd around here. Glad we've got people like you who take an intelligent stance on things.------------- <Removed overly wide sig. Tsk, you know better.> |
Posted By: Black_Shadow
Date Posted: 15 March 2007 at 9:39am
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i dont know why, but after seeing a sick mil-sim i am in debate over whether to build my own out of my 98cp. since i play mostly just rec-ball and woodsball i dont see any adavantage or disadvantage to either way. you guys might see me with a mil-sim soon... i never thought that would happen. ------------- 98CP ACT R/T J&J Ceramic 14" Egg II w Z-Board GTA Inline X-Chamber NCStar Red-Dot Pen Spring Mod Trigger Stops Polished Internals Dye Sticky Grip 20oz Co2 w On/Off Next Up: Spimmy |
Posted By: nauzerlvr
Date Posted: 15 March 2007 at 11:24am
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What's my opinion on MilSim?
It a game, just like Speedball is a game. There are those that like Speedball and those that enjoy the "scenario" or "woodsball" type of paintball. Each is different as each is the same. By that I mean in each game the object is to eliminate your opponents by sending paintballs downfield in an attempt to eliminate opposing players using cover. Each is differs in the way the game is played. Personally, I prefer MilSim because I don't dive and slide up behind bunkers primarily because my knees can't take it. Speedball is a fast moving game while woodsball or MilSim takes a more stealthy approach to attrition. As for not having military experience, I was an E5 Staff Sergeant in the USAF during the VietNam war. My specialty was small arms and automatic weapons. I taught airmen how to properly use the M16 Assault Rifle in a tactical role. I developed an interest in military weapons and for a while, collected them. That was then, this is now. The MilSim paintball marker allows a person to own a "replica" of a full- automatic" MP5 or M16 or any other assault or tactical weapon without the taxes and expense of the "real steel" and enjoy using them in an environment that promotes teamwork, health, companionship and just plain fun. Basically it's combat without the lethality. I fail to understand why some people can't understand that the two forms or paintball can't coexist peacefully and even compliment each other or why there is so much narrowmindedness from each side of the fence. Both forms of the sport involve shooting each other with projectiles shot from a marker thereby "marking" your opponent. I'm certainly not against Speedball. I watch it on television. I just don't play it. It's too fast for me but I'm not going to give up playing paintball bacause of that. The way I see it is that if MilSim markers aren't your forte', then don't buy or build one. But don't take it upon yourself to blast someone that does like them. The same is true of Speeedball markers. Just participate in the aspect of paintball that you personally enjoy and let's work together to make this sport a good, safe, fun sport we can all enjoy and recruit new players and teams to take part in. In closing let me say this...I would love to put together a "Dream Team for MilSim" with anyone I wanted because you can bet I'd sure have some speedballers on my team! The guys are animals! ------------- 
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Posted By: johnson1456
Date Posted: 15 March 2007 at 10:58pm
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well put nauz ------------- Johnson
x7: flatline, "T" dot scope, folding vertical handle...still in work |
Posted By: hybrid-sniper
Date Posted: 16 March 2007 at 12:51am
Sounds like you're playing against a bunch of scrubs. |
Posted By: Black_Shadow
Date Posted: 16 March 2007 at 7:58am
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Agreed.
------------- 98CP ACT R/T J&J Ceramic 14" Egg II w Z-Board GTA Inline X-Chamber NCStar Red-Dot Pen Spring Mod Trigger Stops Polished Internals Dye Sticky Grip 20oz Co2 w On/Off Next Up: Spimmy |
Posted By: Trogdor2
Date Posted: 17 March 2007 at 12:08am
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Honestly, woodsball blows. Speedball is where it's at if you want to play paintball. Milsim is just something military wannabes get into to fuel their desire to look manly and feel like they have some sort of power. All in all, the whole game is just a very elaborate and expensive version of "tag". Now, that's just my opinion. I'm open to whatever anyone has to say, if these "anyones" actually have anything to say. ------------- Something unknown is doing we don't know what. That is what our knowledge amounts to. - Sir Arthur Eddington |
Posted By: tallen702
Date Posted: 17 March 2007 at 11:00am
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Wow trog, trolling much?
Speedball's great, I try to play it as much as possible as it's my favorite type of game. But seriously, purposefully trying to re-kindle a flame war is just lame. ------------- <Removed overly wide sig. Tsk, you know better.> |
Posted By: c4cypher
Date Posted: 18 March 2007 at 12:37pm
Woodsball is just a wannabe compared to speedball?? Which came first? Granted, it's your opinion, and I'll respect that. I started playing and still prefer woodsball, but I've had fun when speedball was the only thing my field was playing. Both are fun, even if they appeal to different tastes. As far as milsim, meh, I wouldn't pay out to make my 98 look like a military issue assault rifle, but I do want it to 'feel' like one. What I'm saying is that, to me, a fake magazine or an AK or M4 barrel kit seem pointless, even if they look cool. But I do want a stock. There's nothing like having a good butt stock to stabilize your marker as a shooting platform. The downside? Yeah, it's going to be a little awkward if I'm doing a speedball bunker crouch. It's a price I'm willing to pay for the stability and the feel that I'm shooting a gun (as opposed to operating a piece of sports equipment). Style, feel, look and functionality have different values to different players. For me as a woodsball player to state that speedball is just a cheesy counter-strike experience is like having a PC user bashing on Mac, or PC gamer bashing on Console gamers. I may not prefer speedball, or enjoy it as much, but I can still respect it. Everybody has their own style and preferences. |
Posted By: Black_Shadow
Date Posted: 18 March 2007 at 3:55pm
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omfg... flame wars again... how many pages is it going to take this time... WHY CAN'T WE ALL JUST BE FRIENDS!!!! ------------- 98CP ACT R/T J&J Ceramic 14" Egg II w Z-Board GTA Inline X-Chamber NCStar Red-Dot Pen Spring Mod Trigger Stops Polished Internals Dye Sticky Grip 20oz Co2 w On/Off Next Up: Spimmy |
Posted By: SR_Crewchief
Date Posted: 20 March 2007 at 9:02pm
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Got to love it!!!
Come back after months and the same old arguements prevail. Mil-sim v new tech Woods v speed ...... Rockslide how is the knee doing? Keep the cupholder, nothing is more intimidating!!!!
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Posted By: Rock Slide
Date Posted: 21 March 2007 at 12:31am
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Back to doing Tae Kwon Do. Just enough to get the strength back. They gave me a scholarship too so I don't have to pay for the classes anymore! Have to teach now though... On Saturdays... ------------- I bring annihilation and cheap red wine! |
Posted By: TippmannBro
Date Posted: 21 March 2007 at 11:39am
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Why is this thread still going?
------------- WAR EAGLE!!! |
Posted By: Black_Shadow
Date Posted: 21 March 2007 at 2:35pm
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hopefully it will die soon... is getting annoying to keep hearing people whine about milsim vs sports and woods vs speed ------------- 98CP ACT R/T J&J Ceramic 14" Egg II w Z-Board GTA Inline X-Chamber NCStar Red-Dot Pen Spring Mod Trigger Stops Polished Internals Dye Sticky Grip 20oz Co2 w On/Off Next Up: Spimmy |
Posted By: Ghost-Rider
Date Posted: 21 March 2007 at 3:35pm
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I dont mind mil-sim, i mind the idiots who think they know the guns
when they dont know crap, we have AR-15's M1A's and that kind of stuff
and when i hear kids at school talking like they know the stuff so well
and what their saying is just stupid. i just about explode i find
mostly airsoft kids do this, i had one airsoft kid at school tell me
how good he was and how he can snipe people from 25 yards, talking as
if its hard to do, i can throw a rock atleast 75 yards easy. but if you
make your gun look mil-sim that fine just dont act like you know things
about the real gun. and some mil-sim stuff is useful, im lookin to get
a folding stock for my gun and a massive drop forward for my tank
because my prefence is woodsball/urban but i like speedball also, so id
like to have the stock for woods and be able to fold it up and make it
so i can hold close to me for speedball, just my opinion . Sorry for long post. ------------- 
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Posted By: c4cypher
Date Posted: 21 March 2007 at 4:27pm
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Heh, I know how you feel. I love guns, but I have very little experience. I've had a little range time with an M16A2, but to claim that I would be a good shot with a rifle would require a sociopathic ability to lie on my part. On the whole milsim/woods/speed subject, I just want to repeat, I didn't want to flame anyone; I just prefer woods to speed. Both can be fun. I'm currently puting a tacstock, drop forward and sight rail on my T98c, I can't wait to get that setup on the feild. |
Posted By: TheSnake
Date Posted: 21 March 2007 at 7:10pm
THAT pisses me off. It's like the kids who play CS 3-4 times and think they know everything about guns. I love MilSim I can't stand red/blue shiny guns, I NEED the matte black weapons and stuff. I don't need to have a marker that looks exactly like a real gun, but at least look like it could be a real world firearm. That being said I personnaly can't stand Speed Ball, though I have the upmost respect for them as I realise that It does require a good trigger finger and even better knees. I like more the slower paced MilSim and Scenario matches, gives me the time to think and make less misstakes (die less :P). |
Posted By: hybrid-sniper
Date Posted: 21 March 2007 at 7:43pm
| lel my deegle pwns nubs |
Posted By: kickinwing2010
Date Posted: 21 March 2007 at 8:35pm
Boom Headshot! I can dance all day I can dance all day! -------------
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