Compressed Air?
Printed From: Tippmann Paintball
Category: Paintball Equipment
Forum Name: Upgrades and Customizing
Forum Description: Trick it out!
URL: http://www.tippmannsports.com/forum/wwf77a/forum_posts.asp?TID=170462
Printed Date: 21 December 2025 at 12:09pm
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 12.04 - http://www.webwizforums.com
Topic: Compressed Air?
Posted By: blankx
Subject: Compressed Air?
Date Posted: 28 September 2007 at 11:24pm
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On my Tippmann A5 can you use Compressed Air with a expansion chamber? cause i want to buy a expansion chamber for my CO2, and i am also looking to buy a Compressed Air tank. Also what is the difference btw 45/4500psi, 68/4500psi, 70/4500psi, 48/3000, 72/3000 and ect..? |
Replies:
Posted By: Zippo25
Date Posted: 28 September 2007 at 11:33pm
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x chamber will work with hpa but its useless lol even with co2 its kindof a waste of money less ur playing in the winter. buy a regulator, i know its more expensive but it will work with both co2 and hpa (palmers is best for co2)
with the numbers, the first number is the size of the tank.. the second is the max psi rating..... |
Posted By: Blasterboy
Date Posted: 28 September 2007 at 11:46pm
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The higher the first number means the more shots per tank. You should also use the search button at the top of the screen. |
Posted By: jerseypaint
Date Posted: 29 September 2007 at 12:22am
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The more psi, the more air the tank holds. ------------- 
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Posted By: tallen702
Date Posted: 29 September 2007 at 11:09am
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Oh boy. Okay, here's the deal. Yes, you CAN use an X-chamber with HPA, but some chambers (such as the ACI series) tend to have several "stages" which are basically filters that slow down the flow of CO2 allowing it to fully expand before reaching your marker. Now, sometimes these stages will actually reduce the flow-rate of HPA to a point where it can be problematic for your marker. It's rare, but it can happen. So, if you are going to use an X-Chamber for a while and then eventually switch to HPA, I would suggest gutting the x-chamber to make it a gas-thru grip so you don't have to worry about flow restrictions.
Now, for the tank sizes, anymore it's pretty pointless to go with anything that holds less than 4500psi of pressure. The PSI is the second number in the series. The first number is the volume of the tank. For example, a 68/4500 tank is 68 cubic inches in volume at 4500psi of pressure. So, if you were to compare a 68/3000 vs a 68/4500, you would get 50% more shots out of the 68/4500 than the 68/3000. So, if you get around 500 shots out of a 68/3000 you'd get 750 shots out of a 68/4500. PSI has far more bearing on how many shots you get than the volume of the tank. Just make sure to buy a tank that meets your needs. If you're using a standard A-5 without the LPK, then get a high-pressure-output tank. If you aren't using an LPK, a reg isn't really necessary since the marker is designed to operate at around 800-850psi and the output from an HPA tank is constant, meaning no pressure spikes/drops like you get with CO2. ------------- <Removed overly wide sig. Tsk, you know better.> |
Posted By: blankx
Date Posted: 30 September 2007 at 8:13pm
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Ok so i can use a HPA tank on my A5. but does it have to be a High Pressure or a Low Pressure if i dont have the LPK? |
Posted By: tallen702
Date Posted: 30 September 2007 at 10:07pm
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High Pressure Output. All HPA tanks are inherently "High Pressure" it's the output pressure of the preset reg that concerns you. ------------- <Removed overly wide sig. Tsk, you know better.> |
Posted By: blankx
Date Posted: 01 October 2007 at 11:06pm
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Posted By: blankx
Date Posted: 01 October 2007 at 11:08pm
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How do i find the right preset reg for my gun? |
Posted By: tallen702
Date Posted: 02 October 2007 at 12:38am
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Well, most places that sell HPA tanks will tell you if it's a high-output or low-output tank. Also, you can ask what the output pressure is. Anything lower than 800psi isn't going to work well with a stock valve set-up on a tippmann. ------------- <Removed overly wide sig. Tsk, you know better.> |
Posted By: blankx
Date Posted: 02 October 2007 at 10:51pm
| ok thx. so ill ask the local paintball dealer to know what is best for me. |
Posted By: StormyKnight
Date Posted: 04 October 2007 at 5:27pm
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I don't see how the stages in an expansion chamber would inhibit compressed air entering the gun. Those stages are meant to stop liquid C02 from getting into the gun. It allows the liquid to expand into gas before it reaches the gun. I have the 8-Stage X-Core on my A-5 still even now that I use HPA. I have never had an issue of starving the gun for air. I've emptied my hopper on full auto on several occasions without a drop in pressure or consistency.
This isn't necessarily true. He should check to see if his paintball shop can actually fill to 4500psi before $pending the money on size tank. I've been to several shops that can only fill up to 3000psi. What would be the point in getting a more expen$ive tank if it can't be fully utilized? 3000psi tanks are fine, especially if you play on a field that offers all-day air for a minimal charge. This is why I only use 3000psi tanks in my area. The highest anyone can fill in my area is 3500psi.
Good rule of thumb to find out how much paint you can throw is this: With a 3000psi tank, multiply the first number by 10. If you have a 4500psi tank, multiply the first number by 15. So with a 68/3000 tank, you should get around 680 shots. With a 68/4500, you'd get around 1020 shots. This is an approximation. It depends on how efficient your marker is with gas.
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tallen702 wrote:Posted By: tallen702
Date Posted: 04 October 2007 at 10:33pm
Depending on how tight-fitting the stages are to the walls of the chamber, they can indeed restrict flow of HPA, especially if you have a marker that has an operating pressure in a close range to the output pressure of the pre-set reg. I'm not saying it happens often, but it has been known to. We had 2 cases of an ACI 6-stage restricting flow at my old pro-shop. Mind you, this tended to happen with older markers that tended to need a higher operating pressure. Since the advent of the 2nd gen CVX valve in the '98 and newer models, this hasn't been as much of an issue, however, flow restriction can still happen given the right conditions. Just remember, your own personal experience with your own personal marker don't necessarily reflect the experiences of others and sometimes the guy who put himself through college airsmithing actually knows what he's talking about  ------------- <Removed overly wide sig. Tsk, you know better.> |
Posted By: StormyKnight
Date Posted: 08 October 2007 at 6:34pm
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I also have an 8-stage X-Core on my 68Automag and it works flawlessly with C02 or HPA. It is never starved for air. -------------
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Posted By: blankx
Date Posted: 11 October 2007 at 4:09pm
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So first of all. I need to go see my airsmith and ask if he can fill up a tank to 4500psi. if so i should get the 68/4500HP tank? Also, is CO2 more expansive then Compressed air? |
Posted By: blankx
Date Posted: 11 October 2007 at 4:23pm
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oh and i forgot. is a 70/4500psi tank to much? or is a 68/4500psi much better? |
Posted By: jerseypaint
Date Posted: 11 October 2007 at 5:42pm
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CO2 is cheaper to buy but might be more expensive to fill, depending on the field. And a 68/45 should be good enough. 72/45 is a bit excessive for my taste. -------------
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Posted By: netramakin
Date Posted: 11 October 2007 at 7:33pm
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There is usually little to no difference in cost for getting CO2 or HPA filled at a field. You can get tanks well over 100cu so 70 - 72 isn't that big but it's not going to give you too many more shots than a 68. Just don't get one of those fatties whichever you go with. ------------- 
"I'm a riddle so strong, you can't break me." |
Posted By: blankx
Date Posted: 11 October 2007 at 10:01pm
| ya a 70/4500 tank seems really big compared to the others. anw i think that ill go with the 68/4500psi. also i informed myself in my town if the CO2 is more expansive the compressed air, and i got told that Compressed is way less. i could pay 12$ to fill up my 20oz CO2 tank. and for a 68/4500 tank it would cost my 7-9$. so ya after a while i am gonna save more. and also compressed air wont freeze and break my bolt in my gun |
Posted By: netramakin
Date Posted: 11 October 2007 at 10:06pm
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Wow! Yeah, I guess you would save some $. I normally pay $2-3 for fills all day at the fields I go to (or it's free with admission). The Walmart near me charges less than $5 for a tank switch "fill" but I don't know what you have near you in Canada. -------------
"I'm a riddle so strong, you can't break me." |
Posted By: blankx
Date Posted: 11 October 2007 at 11:12pm
wow!  .. that sucks.. we pay like twice the price as you.. lol. anw, i also know that guys that work in the hockey arena in my town. and they wont charge that much.. but damn now i really want a Compressed Air Tank :(... do you guys also know what would be good for my tippmann a5? like a High pressure or a Low Pressure Compressed air tank?
------------- Tippmann A-5 Lapco Big Shot Barrel g36 stock red dot sight |
Posted By: TeHpWNaG3
Date Posted: 12 October 2007 at 9:03am
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High Pressure, unless you have the Low Pressure Kit installed. Then you would need a LOW PRESSURE tank. Got it, this time? Personally, I would go with a 4500psi tank. It's a little more costly, but you won't have to buy another tank if your field upgrades their fill station. Actually, you won't have to buy another tank if that happens, but you'll want to.
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Posted By: tallen702
Date Posted: 12 October 2007 at 10:00am
Wrong!!!!! You can use an LP output tank on the LPK Tippmanns, but you don't NEED one. A high-output tank will work just fine as you must use an inline regulator with the LPK to bring the operating pressure down to a usable level even with a low-pressure-output tank.
Leave speculation to the stock market. While I agree that if you have the capability to fill a 4500psi tank, you should go for it, I don't think you should go spending more money on a tank because you think the field might possibly upgrade their compressors in the future. That said, the resale value on hpa tanks is pretty darn good so even if you were to want to upgrade in the future, you could easily sell your old hpa tank to offset the cost of a new one. ------------- <Removed overly wide sig. Tsk, you know better.> |
Posted By: blankx
Date Posted: 12 October 2007 at 11:31am
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so i should use a low pressure tank on my a5? but if i want a high pressure i should get a LPK? also i was thinking about buying a Smart Parts Epiphany marker. do you guys know what tank should i use for this one? ------------- Tippmann A-5 Lapco Big Shot Barrel g36 stock red dot sight |
Posted By: tallen702
Date Posted: 12 October 2007 at 11:44am
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Alright, I'm going to put this in layman's terms.
Unless you own one of the newer WDP Angel series marker, you will never need to own a low-pressure-output tank. Never. Plain and simple. Unless you buy one of those markers who's regs can't scale down the input pressure from 800psi, you don't need one. ------------- <Removed overly wide sig. Tsk, you know better.> |
Posted By: TeHpWNaG3
Date Posted: 12 October 2007 at 12:09pm
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Yes, of course the regulator will work, but then that would be contrary to your point that buying a 4500psi tank would be wasting money (and if he knew that already, the post wouldn't exist). Why buy something you don't need? If the OP does not have a LPK, then there is no need. From the scant information to go on, I had to assume the OP was using a "plain jane" Tippmann, which customarily uses HPA. If I didn't know what you were talking about, I would be a confused OP at this point. I bought a 4500 hoping that my field would convert. Which they did. I bought it because they hinted at buying a new compressor. I did not run in willy-nilly on that purchase, but then again, no one should. My paintball buddies bit-the-bullet on their 3000's which is exactly why I wrote what I did. Until then, my 4500 worked just fine and I didn't have to go through the ordeal of off-loading my obsolete tank once the 4500 became truly relevant. They also felt speculation wasn't the best thing to go on, but that didn't stop them from kicking themselves when the dawn of 4500psi fell upon our humble field. No need to kick me in the balls over such a moot point. Peace, bro. |
Posted By: tallen702
Date Posted: 12 October 2007 at 12:51pm
Okay, it becomes apparent that you don't actually know what you are talking about here. All High-Pressure-Air tanks contain High-Pressure air. There is no such thing as a "Low pressure tank" All HPA tanks are "High pressure tanks". The confusion sets in when people start talking about the difference between "High-Pressure-Output" and "Low-Pressure-Output" which is a reference to the output pressure of said tank. Ergo, 3 68/3000 tank isn't "Low pressure" as it seems you are referring to. It has a lower total compressed volume of air due to the fact that there are only 3000 pounds of force per-square-inch exerted on the total volume of the tank versus 4500 pounds of force per-square-inch with a 68/4500. Where the low-pressure-output and high-pressure-output come into play is at the regulator seated in the neck of the tank. The regulator uses a spring-mounted piston to control the output pressure of the tank through flow restriction. Most screw-in style tanks that are available these days use a pre-set regulator that puts out a constant pressure. Most tanks come in one of two varieties. A High-Pressure-Output tank uses a preset-reg that keeps the pressure of the air flowing from the regulator at approximately 800-850psi. A Low-Pressure-Output tank uses a preset-reg that keeps the pressure of the air flowing from the regulator at approximately 400-500psi. Now, given that a low-pressure kit on a tippmann series marker usually operates at around 300psi, a low-pressure output tank wouldn't unless you had a inline regulator to bring the pressure down even more. In which case, it wouldn't matter which tank (high-pressure-out-put or low-pressure-output) he purchased to operate the marker as the after-market inline reg would be capable of bringing the pressure from the bottle's reg down to the operating pressure of the marker. Now, I was just pointing out the fallacy of your argument that you would need a low-pressure-output tank to run the LPK. This had nothing to do with the actual question posed by the author of the thread.
The fact of the matter is that the author needs to find out what kind of situation his local pro-shop/field is in to offer the service of a 4500psi fill. If they aren't going to be offering 4500psi fills for over 3 years, then the cost of buying a 4500psi tank vs the cost of buying a 3000psi tank becomes prohibitive due to the continued falling prices on HPA tanks due to the demand of the current market. It's a cost vs benefit analysis that the author needs to weigh carefully on before making said purchase. I wasn't "kicking you in the balls" as you so eloquently put it, but rather was pointing out the fallacy of the first part of your post about needing a LPO-HPA tank for a LPK and then offering my personal take on cost vs benefit. ------------- <Removed overly wide sig. Tsk, you know better.> |
Posted By: TeHpWNaG3
Date Posted: 12 October 2007 at 1:35pm
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I can see how my oversimplification may have led you to believe that I have no clue. Fair enough. However, let's consider that the OP may be new to the sport and was looking to upgrade from Co2 to compressed air. I figured this was the case since he mentioned "expansion chamber"--the magic words of a Co2 user! He appeared to be fishing for a simple answer regarding that point. I doubt that he cares who can piss farther. The explanation you gave was fantastic. Again, though, if I didn't know what you were talking about, I would be lost. Until you take apart a regulator, it's like explaining electricity to kindergarteners. Thankfully, I've been paintballing for over 23 years. In that time, I have found it necessary to cater to the lowest common denominator when it comes to "tech talk". New guys have no clue what you and I are talking about until they start putting the pieces together for themselves. Until then, generalities are paramount in getting the message across. These forums help, but only if you are helpful. By your post count I can tell you eat, sleep, and breathe, paintball. To your credit, I would most likely go to you if I was stuck on something. I would understand what you were explaining to me because I have the background to support it. Reading over the entire thread, you gave the guy EVERYTHING he needed to know, yet he was still asking which way to go. Can I get an amen? |
Posted By: blankx
Date Posted: 12 October 2007 at 4:43pm
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lol. so in other words. your all telling me. Get the High Pressure HPA?
------------- Tippmann A-5 Lapco Big Shot Barrel g36 stock red dot sight |
Posted By: tallen702
Date Posted: 12 October 2007 at 5:59pm
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Ding ding ding! Give the man a cookie!
You've got it bud!
High-output HPA is indeed what you want. ------------- <Removed overly wide sig. Tsk, you know better.> |
Posted By: blankx
Date Posted: 14 October 2007 at 3:22pm
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haha. about time i got it. anw thx guys. now i am gonna buy a Crossfire HP tank!
------------- Tippmann A-5 Lapco Big Shot Barrel g36 stock red dot sight |