Why the fear?
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Topic: Why the fear?
Posted By: oldsoldier
Subject: Why the fear?
Date Posted: 13 April 2010 at 10:17pm
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I am atternding a 'Tea Party' event April 15, and we have recieved word that left wing 'radicals' are intending to infiltrate the event and carry signs and make comments to local media in order to 'confirm' in the minds of America who we Tea Party Members are. Our local 'Rolling Thunder' group has been asked to 'escort' any found infiltrators from the site, and to cover from view any infiltrator groups using American Flags and the noise of the Bikes. NO VIOLENCE...cameras will be covering all of our actions per our legal advisor, lets see how peacefull and non-radical our leftist friends really are.
There are signs stating 'INFILTRAITOR' with arrows pointing to them so the media can not miss them in thier coverage, and we will be close enough so the close in shot used before to isolate only the 'Racist' Tea Party Member will not be possible. and our 'INFITRATOR' sign carried are to stand next to any inflamitory signage carriers, as they are 'escorted' or contained. We are aware of the website, and the locals who are involved with the 'infiltration' attempt. Nationally simular preparations are being made. Good luck to the infiltraitors, as you try and continue your belief system with 'radical' actions, simular to actions you condemn the Tea Party for. And we are prepared with cameras, video cameras, flip phone cameras, will not be easy to get your version of what you think we are and perpetuate the rumor mills and media mania. To quote Hillary Clinton: "This vast rig..Left Wing conspiriacy will not go un-noticed by the American People." ------------- 
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Replies:
Posted By: jmac3
Date Posted: 13 April 2010 at 10:22pm
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I am also attending a Tea Party. I will be one of these left wing radicals
------------- Que pasa? 
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Posted By: oldsoldier
Date Posted: 13 April 2010 at 10:28pm
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Imagine that. A left wing 'radical' and you actually feel justified in your actions (as descibed in the counter website) to falsify the reputation of another 'radical' movement. Talk about hypocracy.
I guess as a 'Torry" supporting your King and Court you find a group of 'Patriots' as an illegal organization, and we all know how well that all worked out as a small minority of 'Patriots' changed the status quo in 1776. -------------
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Posted By: Eville
Date Posted: 13 April 2010 at 10:42pm
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So you are saying George W. Bush is Obama's father? ------------- 
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Posted By: NiQ-Toto
Date Posted: 13 April 2010 at 10:44pm
Anyway, just make the event open-carry and the left wing radical hippies will be too scared to show up. ------------- ///AMG What? |
oldsoldier wrote:Posted By: choopie911
Date Posted: 13 April 2010 at 10:46pm
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Tea Parties are just pathetically stupid. So is any attempt to "infiltrate" them in an attempt to pose as them/ make them look stupid, etc.
They do that extremely well on their own, they don't need more extremists from the other side helping out. |
Posted By: oldsoldier
Date Posted: 13 April 2010 at 10:55pm
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See that is the medias version, have you been to one Choopie911, or do you relie on the media slant. Have you actually seen any of the video footage of the Left radicals of the 60's and 70's or the Code Pink types, now there is a group of intelligent individuals. Listen to Billy Joe Armstrong's view on Organized religion, another social genius, and the media thinks he is soooo wonderfull. 47 'you know' dah's in the first 3 minutes. -------------
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Posted By: jmac3
Date Posted: 13 April 2010 at 10:58pm
You know everything you say trying to discount the left is drowned out by your use of Code Pink. Anyone rational hates them ------------- Que pasa?
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Posted By: oldsoldier
Date Posted: 13 April 2010 at 11:11pm
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They were the media darlings there for awhile during the Bush administration. Give me an example of a left wing political group that is not in one means, manner or form a 'radical' movement. Listen to Left Wing talk SAT radio and the four letter words alone usually outnumber the actual talking point words. Then listen to right wing SAT radio and try and find one four letter word used in an hour.
Now there alone shows a true cultural differance. -------------
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Posted By: Gatyr
Date Posted: 13 April 2010 at 11:25pm
So you plan on responding to them though an infringement of their right to peacefully assemble and and an infringement on their right to free speech? Why do you hate the constitution? And, to be clear, you are part of the TEA Party now, but supported President Bush almost unwaveringly, and have championed Reagan many times, yes? You were okay with a massive increase in spending for a war while tax cuts were put in place, but now that someone is trying to deal with that mess, you are claiming that you are TAXED ENOUGH ALREADY. This despite tax cuts for an overwhelmingly huge portion of our citizenship. Just clarifying. ------------- 
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Posted By: mbro
Date Posted: 13 April 2010 at 11:31pm
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So the use of "four letter words" is what sets the left and the right apart?
Also, code pink has been a laughing stock for years. I'm sure you've seen the video that Rambs posted off of Rob Riggle, from The Daily Show infiltrating them in San Fransico when they were protesting a marine recruiting office. Code pink is fringe left like tea is fringe right. Everyone in the middle is entertained though. So keep it up. ------------- 
Don't blame me, I voted for Kodos. |
Posted By: High Voltage
Date Posted: 13 April 2010 at 11:34pm
Yeah, that you're old enough to still listen to talk radio. ------------- 
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Posted By: Gatyr
Date Posted: 13 April 2010 at 11:39pm
Um, search youtube for "Bill O'Reilly Flips Out," -------------
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Posted By: oldsoldier
Date Posted: 13 April 2010 at 11:43pm
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Here is a question based on my beliefs. If I went to a bank and deposited $5000 in my safe deposit box, and 20 years later I want to withdraw the $5000. The bank responds they can only give me $3500 and they opened my safe deposit box and spent most of the money. Now is that legal.
Your answer should be NO, but. Now explain to me the Social Security System and the lockbox promised with my number on it. I will get back only a small percentage of what I payed in, the government spent the rest and gave it to others more deserving? And I bet you will see that as legal. And now you trust them now to manage healthcare in the same ponsey scheme manner. Can't wait till you are over 60 and needing advanced healthcare, wanna bet on the governments response to your need. Redistribution of income, and with an extablished 50% not paying any income tax, and getting 'refunds' or credits. My eyes are more wide open to this social utopia called NY, as the 'survivors' of leftist tax policies are moving out as soon as they can, and the response from Albany is not to lower taxes and make it more appealing to stay, but to increase the taxes on the new group of survivors, and repeat the process as needed. Can't punish the tax reciepiant, must punish the tax payer. -------------
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Posted By: choopie911
Date Posted: 13 April 2010 at 11:52pm
Those truly intelligent wouldn't associate with a whack job fringe group. |
Posted By: High Voltage
Date Posted: 14 April 2010 at 12:05am
For the record, OS, at my current job I didn't make enough last year for the federal government to tax my income. Funny enough my W-2 seems to show that I still paid into social security and medicare, just not regular old income tax. Also funny, I'm being given $400 by the IRS. How much did you pay the government in income taxes this past year? If it was more than $400 I thank you for the free money. I bet they gave me some of FE's tax money too. -------------
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Posted By: brihard
Date Posted: 14 April 2010 at 12:16am
Free money, or a return of your witholding tax? ------------- "Abortion is not "choice" in America. It is forced and the democrats are behind it, with the goal of eugenics at its foundation." -FreeEnterprise, 21 April 2011. Yup, he actually said that. |
Posted By: High Voltage
Date Posted: 14 April 2010 at 12:26am
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It's a tax credit available to many Americans. And box 2 on my W-2, the one titled "Federal income tax withheld," is blank. I didn't make enough for them to hold anything. -------------
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Posted By: SSOK
Date Posted: 14 April 2010 at 12:31am
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Without jumping in on this, what is the official goal of the tea party anyway? Impeach Obamunisum? ------------- 
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Posted By: carl_the_sniper
Date Posted: 14 April 2010 at 12:57am
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Wait what are you protesting this week?
------------- <just say no to unnecessarily sexualized sigs> |
Posted By: choopie911
Date Posted: 14 April 2010 at 1:25am
| The fact that Obama is a non-american socialist nazi |
Posted By: __sneaky__
Date Posted: 14 April 2010 at 2:21am
------------- "I AM a crossdresser." -Reb Cpl Forum Vice President RIP T&O Forum |
Posted By: stratoaxe
Date Posted: 14 April 2010 at 3:39am
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I don't keep up with these things, I just don't have time any more. But if you people (Tea Party) actually send up a presidential candidate, you've just guaranteed Obama a re-election and destroyed your cause. So I hope these are just little town hall meetings, and not turning into another Ross Perot incident. Also, I'm not sure labeling all Tea Party elements as being fringe is completely accurate. Since there's no technical structure to the party, and no real spokesperson (Nailin' Palin aside), there's no way to determine any kind of belief system, other than conservative spending.
That being said, it's like my opinion of homeschooling. Rather than jump ship, why not attempt to repair it? The Republican party has been disorganized for years now, and the term conservative is just as vague and misunderstood as liberal. So instead of fixing blanket terminology, you create another blanket that's a complete and total mystery to everyone that hears it? Anyway, I'm assuming (read: hoping) that's not the case.
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Posted By: choopie911
Date Posted: 14 April 2010 at 4:11am
You're saying we need a political snuggie? |
Posted By: stratoaxe
Date Posted: 14 April 2010 at 4:24am
Since the two party system isn't going anywhere anytime soon, we need to work on aligning both parties closer to the views they're supposed to represent.
But I like that term, Snuggie...I think I'll use it in government this morning when the inevitable Tea Party mention is thrown out there
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Posted By: FreeEnterprise
Date Posted: 14 April 2010 at 8:21am
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I wonder if this story will get national press...
Naa...
http://www.ksla.com/Global/story.asp?S=12297759 - http://www.ksla.com/Global/story.asp?S=12297759
"spitting" is much more newsworthy.
http://biggovernment.com/jhoft/2010/04/13/big-easy-beatdown-gop-official-and-boyfriend-savagely-beaten-leaving-srlc-dinner/#more-105794 - http://biggovernment.com/jhoft/2010/04/13/big-easy-beatdown-gop-official-and-boyfriend-savagely-beaten-leaving-srlc-dinner/#more-105794 ------------- They tremble at my name... 
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Posted By: mbro
Date Posted: 14 April 2010 at 9:54am
Redistribution of income, and with an extablished 50% not paying any income tax, and getting 'refunds' or credits. [/quote]Yeah, it is kind of sad that 50% of Americans need every penny they have in order to sustain our consumer driven economy. It's also really sad the great disparity between the rich and the poor that has only been growing since the 1980s. It's also sad that wages have pretty much stopped going up over the past 15 years so the real value is going down.
-------------
Don't blame me, I voted for Kodos. |
Posted By: oldsoldier
Date Posted: 14 April 2010 at 10:05am
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The misconceptions of the Tea Party Movement is more than self evidant here. Most of the rhetoric is based on the alphabet medias representation not the actual movement. The original name 'Taxed Enough Already' did not set well with the tax, tax, tax agenda of the Federal Government. Political drift from both parties began, and as the movement got larger more issues were included. But the media's need for controversey and 'infotainment' began to paint the movement with a wide brush as one of a bunch of racist bigots, because yes the movement directly confronted Obama policies. I have attended 8 Tea Party events and have yet to see these 'nutjobs' that the media portrays the movement to be. Yes I have been involved with the 'self policing' of the more radical and 'infiltrators' who for thier own aganda stray from the message. And this Leftist conspiracy scheduled for Apr 15 to dilibertly continue to 'further' the myth that the media has set for the Tea Party Movement, and the idiots have a website dedicated to that agenda. That alone should lead to credability issues on any media story showing a 'negative' action during Thursday's events. The Republican Party has drifted towards the Democrats to where there is almost no differance. The NY 23rd fiasco was a case in point. Conservatism is a very distinct political agenda, the almost total opposite of the 'Liberal' Government' Plantation agenda. Keep the people on the 'Plantation' and make them dependant on the current owner(s), so there will be no contest when the 'owners' of the Plantation is threatened in the next election. The recent 50% do not pay taxes, or are totally 'tax consumers' stories show the differance. The 'tax provider' is required to pay more, as the roles of the 'tax consumer' expand under this administration. The 'Liberal' Message is "If you are a tax payer you do not pay enough, If you are a tax consumer you do not get enough." has finally overwhelmed the system. Social Security is a prime example of governments mismanagement of taxes.
I pay taxes on my SS recieved, so I am taxed on a tax I already paid, government logic there. Reality and age means that I do recieve SS disability along with a VA disability, and most of you will someday also reach the age and or conditions requiring Social Security. I am taxed almost 50% still in all taxes combined, and there are those that say even though disabled retired I do not pay enough in taxes, as I stand behind a young lady with three kids pulling out food stamps, and then paying more in cash for her cigarettes, alcohol, I-Pods, highend cell phone plan, etc. There is a distinct differance in 'priorities' and the Government only assists in this lack of personal priorities, by handing out more benifits. As for being one of the 'self policing', I will support your right to dissent to the movement, but you need to do it over there. Totally legal under the law. You do not have the right to incite potential violence by 'infiltrating' (as planned) the event with the sole purpose of disrupting. We are to use NO Violence, we lock arms and walk foward to 'herd' the disruptive element to assigned areas, again totally legal. Each action will be video taped for thier and our protection from media misrepresentation of the event. And descretion is the better part of valor, lets see who throughs the first punch, 30 plus bikers vs some college students dressed in black hooded sweat tops, and or masked(the prescribed uniform of the 'active' agitators according to thier website) real nice, the Left movement is not brave enough to be identified. -------------
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Posted By: oldsoldier
Date Posted: 14 April 2010 at 10:15am
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MBRO. Do you actually think that tax policies and government economic policies have seriously created and fosters this disparity of income. Excessive taxes do force bussiness out of areas, creating unemployment, and more government dependancy, hense a need for more taxes to support.
Mbro you do understand that you grandchildren are now tax liable for the stimulus, that promised to keep unemployment below 8% *we are now at 9.7% and climbing. And you find no fault with that government logic. -------------
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Posted By: High Voltage
Date Posted: 14 April 2010 at 10:28am
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You say republicans are drifting toward democrats, http://www.thedailyshow.com/watch/wed-august-19-2009/fox-news--the-new-liberals - do you mean the 180 your party pulled since Obama's election? Yes, I'm aware of the difference between a tv news network and a political party. Your constituents, however, do not. -------------
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Posted By: __sneaky__
Date Posted: 14 April 2010 at 10:42am
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I love John Stewart ------------- "I AM a crossdresser." -Reb Cpl Forum Vice President RIP T&O Forum |
Posted By: High Voltage
Date Posted: 14 April 2010 at 11:03am
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By the way CNN is streaming Sarah Palin's speech in Boston, and I just can't stop facepalming. All she's doing is shouting buzz words. -------------
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Posted By: jmac3
Date Posted: 14 April 2010 at 11:08am
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------------- Que pasa?
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Posted By: ParielIsBack
Date Posted: 14 April 2010 at 11:28am
Get that woman outta my city. ------------- BU Engineering 2012 |
Posted By: oldsoldier
Date Posted: 14 April 2010 at 11:31am
Is that not the way of a polititian on either side of the aisle. And because you do not agree with her form of 'buzzwords' she is no differant in campaign mode than some 'community organizer' was in modifying each speach to the intended reciepiant. And you bought his 'buzzwords' hook line and sinker, and the differance is? -------------
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Posted By: JohnnyHopper
Date Posted: 14 April 2010 at 11:39am
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OS, stop fighting it. You know as soon as you die, that you'll start voting democrat anyways. ------------- My shoes of peace have steel toes. |
Posted By: High Voltage
Date Posted: 14 April 2010 at 12:01pm
There is no difference, other than you seem to be getting way too upset when someone on your side is criticized. I don't care for partisan politics. I've maintained my point that this two party system is ruining the country and all these people really care about is how many votes they can keep and how long they can hold their seat. Stop trying to put words in others' mouths. You want to know why I chose Palin to laugh at? Because she happened to be speaking at the moment. Not sure I did. See, I didn't vote. -------------
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Posted By: choopie911
Date Posted: 14 April 2010 at 12:26pm
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I also loved this last night. Glenn Beck is of the opinion that if you don't pay taxes, you should be the ones to fight in the military. John Stewart then destroys his pathetic idea:
http://tv.gawker.com/5516642/jon-stewart-exposes-the-medias-laughably-dishonest-tax+related-reporting - Video And for the record, this is a shot at Glenn Beck specifically, because the man is crazy. |
Posted By: Mack
Date Posted: 14 April 2010 at 1:09pm
Amazingly invalid point. The anti-Tea Party (for lack of a better term) are not peacefully assembling to express and support their views. They are assembling for the specific purpose of disrupting/interfering with/damaging the reputation of a different group with an opposing view. (They are in fact, meeting to do exactly what you are accusing OS and his group of doing.) ------------- 
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Posted By: FreeEnterprise
Date Posted: 14 April 2010 at 1:20pm
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bigjournalism.com has an article on the "ideals" of the guy who thought this anti tea party thing up...
Not forum safe, but enlightening to say the least... ------------- They tremble at my name...
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Posted By: High Voltage
Date Posted: 14 April 2010 at 1:21pm
So in other words, they're protesting. All this speculation over what hasn't even happened yet, shall we wait and see if they do become violent or deny them the right to oppose the tea party's protest before they have the chance to slaughter innocent civilians? Will this protest happen on public or private property? -------------
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Posted By: FreeEnterprise
Date Posted: 14 April 2010 at 1:32pm
actually, there have been protests against the tea party members (these people were attacked for wearing Sarah Palin buttons)... where people were injured. But, if the media doesn't make a big deal, then it didn't happen...
amirite!
------------- They tremble at my name...
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Posted By: High Voltage
Date Posted: 14 April 2010 at 1:46pm
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Funny, FE, I thought the topic was the tea party event OS will attend tomorrow. Who got injured at OS' tea party protest? Any news links to the aftermath of the protest that has not happened yet? Nobody here is condoning violence btw. Anyone becoming violent at a protest is doing it wrong. -------------
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Posted By: choopie911
Date Posted: 14 April 2010 at 2:32pm
And we all agree on that, but FE insists that we don't. |
Posted By: oldsoldier
Date Posted: 14 April 2010 at 2:42pm
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I am not going to be the violent one, but I am pretty sure our black hooded anachist friends are not thinking the same. In a co-ordination meeting with Oneonta Police and the State Police we 'Rolling Thunder' members will ensure the 'security' of the podium from 'infiltrators' by maintaining a buffer perimeter. The Police will maintain a outer perimeter. We are missioned to video tape any confrontation and present said tape to the Police immediately so they can apprehend the 'infiltrator'. I am confidant that we will not be the instigators, it is as per thier website thier mission to instigate violance to discredit the movement, and disrupt the event.
I am a Road Captian for the event, and will use my 'command voice' to make it clear our intent to any who feel it is thier 'right' to underestimate us. -------------
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Posted By: Mack
Date Posted: 14 April 2010 at 2:52pm
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OS, you mentioned a website related to the perpetrators . . . do you have a link?
-------------
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Posted By: choopie911
Date Posted: 14 April 2010 at 2:54pm
lol, underestimating the tea party movement. |
Posted By: ParielIsBack
Date Posted: 14 April 2010 at 3:07pm
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What, exactly, has the Tea Party movement accomplished so far? Now, I agree with some of the ideas they have, but first and foremost, they're going about it all wrong. Playing to the right wing will not gain you political clout. ------------- BU Engineering 2012 |
Posted By: Mack
Date Posted: 14 April 2010 at 3:12pm
The intentional liberal density is quite thick today. Let's recap with selected information from earlier in the thread.
Summation (and opinion) the anti-Tea Party folks got caught out on the unsubstantiated charges of racism and other hate crimes they levied against earlier Tea Partys and have decided to go provide some of this on their own while disguised as Tea Party members so the media will have something to show in support of their claims. The Tea Party folks became aware of it and are taking steps to prevent such action. The more liberal members of the forum see nothing wrong with the protest infiltrators planning to/implementing their plan to commit hateful action (possibly hate crimes) as long it is for the lofty and noble purpose of making the Tea-Party look bad but also believe that any action taken to prevent such infiltration is a violation of the "Anti's" right to freedom of speech. A few explanatory notes/thoughts:
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Posted By: oldsoldier
Date Posted: 14 April 2010 at 3:27pm
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Link.
http://www.crashtheteaparty.org/ - http://www.crashtheteaparty.org/ -------------
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Posted By: Gatyr
Date Posted: 14 April 2010 at 3:50pm
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Mack, fair enough; my charge of infringement is misplaced for various reasons. I chose the wrong words to do so, but my point was that it's strange for a self-proclaimed champion of the constitution and who usually considers himself to be on the moral high ground on most matters to resort to actions that prevent people exercising what can be considered the hallmark of a free democracy, and then justify it with "they're doing it too." But:
Give me the line of logic that ends with the conclusion that we see nothing wrong with what the Anti-Tea Party (ATP I guess) is doing, please. As I see it, there is a discontinuity between what we are noting about the actions of the Tea Party and supporting acts that incite violence, but I'm open to criticism. -------------
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Posted By: Mack
Date Posted: 14 April 2010 at 3:56pm
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Apparently, they don't like people copying stuff from their site. However, a couple of screen shots put back together in MSPaint (and reduced 50%) shows what they're up too quite well. Note the part circled in green, that seems more like interfering with someone else's exercise of free speech as opposed to actually exercising it themselves. The fact that they feel the need to infiltrate and sabotage does support OS's point about fearing the Tea Party. (If it was such a joke, why bother messing it up?) The spamming of the associated forum by opponents (anti-anti-Tea Party people?) is really mature as well. However, it does support another point made by both OS and fe; the language used by the spammers on the half-dozen or so posts I checked out is definitely much less foul/hate filled than that used by those responding to them. (Not that it justifies the spamming . . . but it may be indicative of a difference in maturity level.)  -------------
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Posted By: choopie911
Date Posted: 14 April 2010 at 4:02pm
| I think the Tea Party is laughably stupid, but I also think infiltrating them HUGELY devalues the opposing movement. I'm not sure why this forum is consistantly stuck on a "with us or against us" mentality. Just because I think the tea party is wrong does not mean I think the anti-tea party infiltration is right. Pretty simple really. |
Posted By: NiQ-Toto
Date Posted: 14 April 2010 at 4:07pm
------------- ///AMG What? |
Posted By: FreeEnterprise
Date Posted: 14 April 2010 at 4:08pm
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looks like a dozen tea party members showed up in boston... Maybe a few more than a dozen...
Naa.
It will be amusing to see the "crowd count" by the media...
http://www.boston.com/news/local/breaking_news/2010/04/sarah_palin_to_1.html - http://www.boston.com/news/local/breaking_news/2010/04/sarah_palin_to_1.html ------------- They tremble at my name...
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Posted By: Mack
Date Posted: 14 April 2010 at 4:11pm
ATP is much easier to type, I'll stick with that as well. As for why I made my statement regarding forum opinion, the logic was based on posts like this.
Or this; which seems to indicate the ATP actions are okay while the TP taking action to prevent such disruption wouldn't be. The additional question regarding the constitution would also seem to show a failure to understand that the constitution applies to everyone; not just the side one agrees with.
On an unrelated point MBro and OS got to discussing Social Security on the previous page and MBro made a comment about how it works. I feel the need to point out that Social Security doesn't work. The original intent for the program was for the funds to be invested and grow through the magic of compound interest. The problem was this was done at a time of government surpluses so no thought was given to developing any special protection for these funds and they just went into the general fund. The result is that the government (under administrations from both sides of the political spectrum) have found it easier to spend these monies than push for tax increases or (god forbid) actually limit spending. The problem is that while the basic funds can be replaced, the interest can't. The eventual end result will be too many people drawing and not enough paying which will lead to failure of the system. Okay, lets get back on topic. Choop, while I haven't decided if the Tea Party is stupid yet, I do agree with the rest of your statement about devaluing the opposition. (Potentially even opposition that is not associated with the infiltration.) -------------
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Posted By: choopie911
Date Posted: 14 April 2010 at 4:12pm
| I always find it weird how much crowd counts vary from source to source, its silly |
Posted By: Mack
Date Posted: 14 April 2010 at 4:12pm
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^^^ They're activists . . . not mathematicians.
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Posted By: Ben Grimm
Date Posted: 14 April 2010 at 4:41pm
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I guess my real question here is: how can you tell the infiltrators from the real teabaggers?
As far as I can tell, the entire "tea party" is a walking demonstration of Poe's Law. ------------- It's Clobberin' Time! |
Posted By: jmac3
Date Posted: 14 April 2010 at 4:46pm
You extracted that out of my post? May I ask how? ------------- Que pasa?
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Posted By: Mack
Date Posted: 14 April 2010 at 5:36pm
If you are going to challenge my conclusions at least wait until my post is on the prior page before misquoting me. I.e. if you would actually read/attempt to understand other people's opinions you would have noted that the statement you are referring to actually applies to the quote below it while the statement regarding your quote is above it. -------------
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Posted By: jmac3
Date Posted: 14 April 2010 at 6:10pm
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I didn't misquote you. I misread what you said. I do read/attempt to understand opinions. I read all your writing pertaining to the post above it, because that makes sense. ------------- Que pasa?
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Posted By: Gatyr
Date Posted: 14 April 2010 at 8:11pm
They might indicate that if I was arguing along side of ATP personnel, but the fact that I was only responding to a Tea Party member would mean that nobody except for me can know who I feel about the ATP people. I feel like most people here (Jmac and FE notwithstanding) act respectably enough that such huge jumps aren't warranted. And I don't think the constitution remark demonstrates any lack of understanding on who it applies to. On the contrary, I feel like it shows it should be applied to everyone because (if you assume my comments about infringement were accurate) I'm criticizing OS and a movement (that so often uses the US Constitution as a means of supporting their ideals) for not respecting the ATP's right to voice disagreement during the protest, simply because they disagree with the Tea Party movement. -------------
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Posted By: jmac3
Date Posted: 14 April 2010 at 8:13pm
So Gatyr, why say I'm not respectable? ------------- Que pasa?
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Posted By: oldsoldier
Date Posted: 14 April 2010 at 8:25pm
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Exercising free speach is protected, and a right, disrupting an event with the sole purpose of promoting possibly a violent confrontation is not a 'right'. If the ATP movement used accepted techniques of dissent not a problem, 'infiltrating' the event to feed a percieved view is not acceptable in any form, like the KKK infiltrating the Civil Rights Movement comment. -------------
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Posted By: jmac3
Date Posted: 14 April 2010 at 8:27pm
I am pretty sure Westboro Baptist Church is still covered when they do this... ------------- Que pasa?
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Posted By: oldsoldier
Date Posted: 14 April 2010 at 8:36pm
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No actually they are not, and laws have been enacted by many states to limit thier effect. They can not be within 500ft of the gravesite or religious service of a servicemember. Arrests have been made of members, as well as civil suits filed against the church by the families, several resulting in substantial awards to the family of the servicemember.
Normally there is a line of motorcycles and on occasions 18 wheel tractor trailers between them and the site and within the 500ft exclusion zone. The noisiest piped bikes are placed opposite them, and engines are rev'ed everytime they start. -------------
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Posted By: Ben Grimm
Date Posted: 14 April 2010 at 8:40pm
... and you don't see the irony here? ------------- It's Clobberin' Time! |
Posted By: Ben Grimm
Date Posted: 14 April 2010 at 8:41pm
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Just because OS showed up:
------------- It's Clobberin' Time! |
Posted By: jmac3
Date Posted: 14 April 2010 at 8:44pm
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" http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/wireStory?id=10041283 - So he sued .
But he lost on appeal. And in one of the strangest twists in this story, Snyder has been ordered to pay court costs totaling more than $16,000 to the very people who disrupted his son's funeral." ------------- Que pasa?
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Posted By: AK Andrew
Date Posted: 14 April 2010 at 9:23pm
That just aint right in anyway.
Also old soldiers I have to say I think you needed to get held more as a child. ------------- wHY ARE YOU READING THIS! |
Posted By: choopie911
Date Posted: 14 April 2010 at 9:58pm
Again with the "promoting violence", which they are openly against as well.... |
Posted By: oldsoldier
Date Posted: 14 April 2010 at 10:22pm
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Wanna bet who 'instigates' a violent confrontation to further thier causes goals, the true Tea Party Member of the 'Infiltrator' furthering the myth of the Tea Part Movement in ther media and the minds of the Left.
The local 'nuthjobs' in the ATP movement planning on disrupting tomorrows event has already stated they are willing to go to any extreme to further thier goal of eliminating the Tea Party. Now what idiot would make a statement like that unless he was a little off and capable of going through with said acts. -------------
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Posted By: choopie911
Date Posted: 14 April 2010 at 10:29pm
| The same kind of idiots in the tea party, with the opposite political bias |
Posted By: mbro
Date Posted: 15 April 2010 at 12:27am
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This whole "taxed enough already" thing is totaly bubkiss. The first protest happened on April 15, 2009. What tax increase happened between Jan 20, 2009 and April 15, 2009?
NONE. Hell you could go back several months further and there would be no federal tax increases. So what happened during that time? Oh, Obama became president, and Glenn Beck switched networks and went from neocon bailout supporter to anti bailout libertarian. This should just be called the sore loser glenn beck follower artificial movement. -------------
Don't blame me, I voted for Kodos. |
Posted By: choopie911
Date Posted: 15 April 2010 at 1:27am
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http://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2010/04/47-of-tea-partiers-pay-no-federal-income-taxes/38924/ - This made me laugh
Not sure how accurate, but hilarious nonetheless. And this sums up MBro's point well: 
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Posted By: oldsoldier
Date Posted: 15 April 2010 at 7:09am
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yes it is funny, exact same stance taken by the Dems 4 years ago on Bush's nominees. Strange how it is OK with a Republican in Office, yet 'comical' when a Dem is in office for the other party to dissent.
I don't believe the Republicans ever 'Borked' a nominee. History is a strange bedfellow and will usually come back to haunt you. And yes political entities have a tendancy to follow the waves of time, not a real issue there mbro. And have you listened to Ed Shultz's or Rachael Maddows violent stance swings since 2009, probably not, so the Glenn Beck thing is no surprise. You really should read Beck's book 'Argueing with Idiots' some incitefull stuff in there. The quotations from the left, and now there position as of late, interesting reading. Again depends whi sits in the 'hoit seat' in DC what the positions of the day are on both sides of the aisle. -------------
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Posted By: ParielIsBack
Date Posted: 15 April 2010 at 11:27am
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The difference between what we're saying, and what Beck says, is that he's busy arguing with the far left, while the far right attempts to put him forward as some sort of mainstream conservative. Which he's not. The Tea Parties may be vocal, but again, they haven't accomplished anything. I would think that might be linked to the fact that most of what they say and do is not based on logic or facts.
------------- BU Engineering 2012 |
Posted By: choopie911
Date Posted: 15 April 2010 at 1:40pm
| Ah, the old fall back: "You did it when bush was in office" for literally everything. |
Posted By: oldsoldier
Date Posted: 15 April 2010 at 2:24pm
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Is it not still "Bush's" fault blame game used when a Democrat policy does not pan out as advertised, the same old Democrat 'Old Fall Back' position for thier failure, but that excuse is OK. Please Choopie Think goose and gander when you respond. -------------
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Posted By: oldsoldier
Date Posted: 15 April 2010 at 2:27pm
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Clutch out 1630 for event, will be interesting in any case, no doubt. Main street is filling the coffee houses with all sorts from the two mansions on the hill (the colleges). Stopped for pizza for lunch, more than usual amount of bodies for a mid-day lunch crowd. And most do not appear as your 'typical' Tea Party Member from the current media representation, interesting. Most Tea Party Members must still be at thier 'JOB', why the 1900 start. -------------
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Posted By: ParielIsBack
Date Posted: 15 April 2010 at 2:46pm
I think you've made his point. Pointing fingers and saying "They were doing it" gets us all right back to where we started. ------------- BU Engineering 2012 |
Posted By: choopie911
Date Posted: 15 April 2010 at 2:51pm
"We can't solve problems by using the same kind of thinking we used when we created them." |
Posted By: FreeEnterprise
Date Posted: 15 April 2010 at 4:06pm
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So the leader of the ATP is actually a union member... And a teacher at a middle school... Who would have thunk.
indoctrination...
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2010/04/15/oregon-probes-teacher-determined-demolish-tea-party/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+foxnews%2Fpolitics+%28Text+-+Politics%29&utm_content=My+Yahoo - http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2010/04/15/oregon-probes-teacher-determined-demolish-tea-party/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+foxnews%2Fpolitics+%28Text+-+Politics%29&utm_content=My+Yahoo ------------- They tremble at my name...
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Posted By: FreeEnterprise
Date Posted: 15 April 2010 at 4:08pm
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I wonder what the school would have thought if he were a leader of the tea party...
hahahhahaha. ------------- They tremble at my name...
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Posted By: ParielIsBack
Date Posted: 15 April 2010 at 4:39pm
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Probably, they would have though of the "edit" button. Also, he's a media teacher. That rates either just above, or just below gym teacher, depending if that gym teacher ever competed in a professional sport. As I've said before, stop taking the far left seriously. The rest of us certainly don't. ------------- BU Engineering 2012 |
Posted By: agentwhale007
Date Posted: 15 April 2010 at 8:21pm
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AMERICANS ARE TAXED ENOUGH ALREADY! OH WAIT:  Now what to put on the signs... |
Posted By: Bolt3
Date Posted: 15 April 2010 at 8:34pm
I was running around Boston and happened to stumble upon one in the boston commons. I got attracted to it because I heard sarah palins voice. It was incredibly stupid. ------------- <Removed sig for violation of Clause 4 of the New Sig Rules> |
Posted By: Bolt3
Date Posted: 15 April 2010 at 8:35pm
You're not at all similar to those 'patriots'. ------------- <Removed sig for violation of Clause 4 of the New Sig Rules> |
Posted By: oldsoldier
Date Posted: 15 April 2010 at 11:12pm
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Exercise went well, our organizer in a page right out of SunTzu moved the event to the park, with only notices going to group leaders to disperse to the real Teas Party Members. We the 'podium' security' maintained the illusion of the event downtown. And low and behold the 'nutjob' infiltrators came out with thier signs to 'downtown' to be laughed at by us as we fired up and moved away to the real event area.
And I bet they thought they won, for by the time they realized they beed had, they could not organize to get to the park. 'Chickens with thier Heads cut off' And it was raining a little so thier motivation kinda went away anyway. Didn't get to hear much of the event, maintain our non-violent security perimeter just in case. Our local TP leader a retired USMC LtColonel had his act together in this misdirection operation, I was impressed for even I did not know of the deception till I got to the briefing. The press was escorted to the real site by prominant members of the event to again ensure they saw the 'real Tea Party, not the phoney trouble makers. Small but we made the point, will we be in the news tomorrow, doubt it, for the media was disappointed that there was 'no news' in thier definition to report, just a peacefull group, a few speaches and everyone went home, and we did not leave a mess to clean up, contrary to most 'leftist' events. Still laughing at how well this went off. -------------
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Posted By: Gatyr
Date Posted: 15 April 2010 at 11:21pm
AND THE WAY OBAMA IS TREATING BIG BUSINESS IN THIS COUNTRY IS SO HORRENDOUS! Wait.... "Last week, Forbes magazine published what the top U.S. corporations paid in taxes last year. “Most egregious,” Forbes notes, is General Electric, which “generated $10.3 billion in pretax income, but ended up owing nothing to Uncle Sam. In fact, it recorded a tax benefit of $1.1 billion.” Big Oil giant Exxon Mobil, which last year reported a record $45.2 billion profit, paid the most taxes of any corporation, but none of it went to the IRS: Exxon tries to limit the tax pain with the help of 20 wholly owned subsidiaries domiciled in the Bahamas, Bermuda and the Cayman Islands that (legally) shelter the cash flow from operations in the likes of Angola, Azerbaijan and Abu Dhabi. No wonder that of $15 billion in income taxes last year, Exxon paid none of it to Uncle Sam, and has tens of billions in earnings permanently reinvested overseas. Mother Jones’ Adam Weinstein notes that, despite benefiting from corporate welfare in the U.S., Exxon complains about paying high taxes, claiming that it threatens energy innovation research. Pat Garofalo at the Wonk Room notes that big corporations’ tax shelter practices similar to Exxon’s shift a $100 billion annual tax burden onto U.S. taxpayers. In fact, in 2008, the Government Accountability Office found that “two out of every three United States corporations paid no federal income taxes from 1998 through 2005.”" http://thinkprogress.org/2010/04/06/exxon-tax/ -------------
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Posted By: oldsoldier
Date Posted: 15 April 2010 at 11:27pm
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Lets see highest during Carter, and the line is again heading up with Obama, interesting. Now add all your taxes combined and see how close you come to 5%, right now in NY with State, County, Property, School, Sales, and fuel, I am nearer to 50% of total income than 5% in taxes.
And "Available" seems to still own the majority of the factories and industries in the area according to the signage out front, and an awefull high amount of store fronts have the same signs in the window, but they dont seem to be hiring? Wonder why that is, they seem to be a big bussiness. -------------
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Posted By: mbro
Date Posted: 15 April 2010 at 11:45pm
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Don't blame me, I voted for Kodos. |
Posted By: oldsoldier
Date Posted: 15 April 2010 at 11:50pm
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Understood it quite well, and having lived through the entire charted period have more of an understanding than you can appreciate. Had the 'family of four' from 1973 onwards. Remember a little bit of Dad's gritchin on taxes in 55 too, as he struggled to provide for his family of four. So again I operated within the 'average income taxes' instead of just read about them in a college course. -------------
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Posted By: agentwhale007
Date Posted: 15 April 2010 at 11:51pm
Did you ask them? |
Posted By: oldsoldier
Date Posted: 15 April 2010 at 11:57pm
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Yes, actually did, made a point of it, and they seemed bored and uninterested at the park, with the 'story' still downtown. I had on my full leathers, beard, dark glasses and a big Harley, and I did not warrent even a photo as a Tea Party Thug. -------------
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Posted By: agentwhale007
Date Posted: 15 April 2010 at 11:59pm
| What was their response when you asked? What precisely did you ask? |
Posted By: oldsoldier
Date Posted: 16 April 2010 at 12:04am
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I asked them if thier questions on the Tea Party Movement were answered with this event, and the people present. I am a pretty engaging guy, and quite well mannered when required. And if they needed any assistance or escort to the leaders and/or the press representative of the group. Neither the female reporter or the photographer were 'interested'. They kept looking at the park enterance, my guess hoping for the arrival of the ATP folks. And yes from my one entry level journalism class background was pretty disappointed in thier actions. -------------
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Posted By: agentwhale007
Date Posted: 16 April 2010 at 12:25am
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Not trying to be too much of an apologist, but sometimes in situations
like that you just want to free roam for a bit and talk to people
without a PIO guiding you. Not that they were hoping for agitators, but
rather they wanted to find sources on their own, or at that point may
have had enough sources for the article already. As an example: When I was covering a protest against budget cuts causing slashes to academic programs here, the groups that were putting on the rally kept trying to shuffle me to talk to the leaders of the groups once they found out I was media. Sometimes, though, it is better to get the prospective of the average attendee and not the person who is going to talk in canned response. It doesn't mean that I am inherently anti or pro any side in the story. See what I mean? Then again, I wasn't there. It could just as easily have been shoddy reporting. Which paper were they representing? I'll look for the article and see how it was written. |
Posted By: oldsoldier
Date Posted: 16 April 2010 at 12:30am
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Oneonta Daily Star, The Freemans's Journal (Cooperstown) or Press Sun Bulletin (Binghamton), did not get a good look at the press tags on thier necks. But betting on Binghamton since they were not familiar with area. -------------
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