You know you go to a prestigious university when..
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Topic: You know you go to a prestigious university when..
Posted By: GroupB
Subject: You know you go to a prestigious university when..
Date Posted: 03 November 2010 at 10:29am
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Replies:
Posted By: The Reaper
Date Posted: 03 November 2010 at 10:50am
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lol! ------------- 
Try being informed instead of just opinionated. How long before you admit that Obama was a mistake? |
Posted By: RoboCop
Date Posted: 03 November 2010 at 10:56am
| That's how my English class is like. I have so many check pluses. The other classes are actual grades though. |
Posted By: agentwhale007
Date Posted: 03 November 2010 at 11:24am
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Oh, the coveted check plus. The pride of middle school math tests and English comp classes everywhere. |
Posted By: DaveEllis
Date Posted: 03 November 2010 at 11:26am
I had a college english prof tell me in 2007 that she had never heard of Blackwater or contractors in Iraq and was taking some points off....WAT.
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agentwhale007 wrote:Posted By: ParielIsBack
Date Posted: 03 November 2010 at 1:02pm
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I laugh at your liberal arts educations. Seriously, I would already have graduated if I'd just decided to study history. ------------- BU Engineering 2012 |
Posted By: oldsoldier
Date Posted: 03 November 2010 at 1:13pm
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You have to be kidding, Universities that do not 'grade' only OK he/she threw something together last minute 'check+'. Watching the faces of my recent classmates when a 6 page double spaced paper was required, you would think that the instructor actually wanted some individual thought brought to the paper. The whines and what if I's were classic. ------------- 
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Posted By: procarbinefreak
Date Posted: 03 November 2010 at 1:20pm
| I used to have a prof that would give out stickers on exams. I loved it. |
Posted By: Gatyr
Date Posted: 03 November 2010 at 2:16pm
Aaaaaaaaaaaaaand you're suddenly like every engineer major I've talked to. Way to be a pretentious douche. ------------- 
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Posted By: SSOK
Date Posted: 03 November 2010 at 2:18pm
Abstract algebra will kill you. ------------- 
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Posted By: agentwhale007
Date Posted: 03 November 2010 at 3:37pm
Pretty much. It's usually engineering folks who use that line. The hard sciences usually don't although chemistry people can get that way sometimes. |
Posted By: ParielIsBack
Date Posted: 03 November 2010 at 4:09pm
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My apologies for understanding abstract concepts. Also, I can has job pleez? ------------- BU Engineering 2012 |
Posted By: Gatyr
Date Posted: 03 November 2010 at 4:19pm
I got a 98 in Cal 2. That class obviously wasn't an attrition class like freshman physics for engineering majors, and I don't pretend that I would do that well in every class, but I'm fairly confident it's indicative that I can do well if I have the drive.
I only know three people in the school of natural sciences here, and only the math major acts like a snob toward liberal arts majors, and I'm pretty sure that's just because he gets straight C's in all of his LA gen-ed classes. But if I'm going to make a general observation about majors/schools, business students are the worst. To them, higher education is all about getting a good job at the end. Since they are usually best situated for that, I'm usually able to see their foreheads while standing behind them because they have their noses so high in the air, looking down their nose at liberal arts students. ...I'm currently making a list of people who I need to sue, quite frivolously, but at high cost to them, once I get my J.D.. That display of sophistry show them how useless my philosophy degree is. -------------
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Posted By: ParielIsBack
Date Posted: 03 November 2010 at 7:54pm
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My issue is not with LA majors in general, to be honest. It's with LA majors here, who can essentially skate by and get a 3.5 while engineers have to complete 50% more credits and don't have the ridiculously low standards for work that I've encountered in my writing and history classes. Four credits in engineering is 6-8 hours a week of class, with a similar number of hours outside, but four credits in history is 3-4 hours of class and an hour or two of reading (which is just so hard) a week. I can't really speak for anything outside the history department, because that's the only one I've taken 300 level classes in, but it seems to me that the reason people are struggling to find jobs with their LA degrees is because they failed to apply themselves and actually learn something. ------------- BU Engineering 2012 |
Posted By: stratoaxe
Date Posted: 03 November 2010 at 8:09pm
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My major will be business, but I don't have any illusions of big money in it. My hope is to go for a JD when I finish my bachelor's, but even then, there aren't any get rich quick solutions in school anymore. I think, depending on how the economy moves, we can all plan on doing at least a small amount of struggling to find a good job, regardless of degree.
My friends range anywhere from nursing, to pre med, law, several business majors, and a couple of photography students.
The only people who really annoy me on their way through schools are the nursing students. For whatever reason, two months in to school, they diagnose you on everything, insist on using long medical terms instead of saying "fever" like the rest of us, and correct you on anything you say remotely regarding the human anatomy.
Otherwise, I never talk school with my friends, unless it's something interesting that I've learned.
Gatyr-I wanted to do philosphy as a major for my pre law education, but just couldn't get into it like I thought I was going to. It's alot of fun to study though, certainly makes you look at conversation differently.
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Posted By: GroupB
Date Posted: 03 November 2010 at 8:27pm
And it will pay off when you get a decent job out of school and they have to go to grad school in order to do anything. Quit whining.
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Posted By: ParielIsBack
Date Posted: 03 November 2010 at 9:11pm
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If you think I'm whining, well, that's fine. Maybe I am, and just can't recognize it. This is what's wrong with the education system in this country. Too many idiots, too much money, not enough actual thought. ------------- BU Engineering 2012 |
Posted By: Gatyr
Date Posted: 03 November 2010 at 9:22pm
First, I never realized you were so arrogant. This is slightly disconcerting. You're smart, for sure, but apparently not smart enough to realize that getting into and doing well in a competitive major/school doesn't entitle you to be so condescending. Second, you jest, but the last line in your first post pretty accurately reflects the grasp engineering students around me have on the English language. That doesn't really mean anything, it's just an aside that annoys the hell out of me given how they treat me when they learn my major. The problem, though, isn't the degree or course material itself (I guarantee you a course on the British Empiricists could be made to be just as hard as any heat transfer or ---dynamics class), it's the fact that so many people fall back on liberal arts majors. This happens for two reasons: 1) more people want to enroll in in the school of engineering and business, so the schools put in place measures to weed out the weak/non-committed by making everything much harder than it needs to be, which causes 2) the kids who don't want to face going into the real world to fall back onto a major that isn't as competitive. These students wind up being noncommittal and don't apply themselves. However, these students would have been the same way if universities didn't make entry into engineering programs so hard. Their study habits aren't indicative of anything except their will or desire to apply themselves, and don't reflect anything about those of us who work hard. The jobs thing doesn't have to do with learning anything, though. Engineering students are taught to DO something, and it's a something that always needs to be done; liberal arts courses typically just teach something (though that would be different if schools needed to decrease enrollment in a program), and it's a something that can be found in a book (some majors within LA schools actually teach how to think critically/reason, but that's not usually conducive to doing well in a bureaucracy unless you are at the top...something you won't be with just a BA in Philosophy). -------------
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Posted By: agentwhale007
Date Posted: 03 November 2010 at 9:27pm
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I was a major nobody liked and I'm now doing research nobody cares about. I respect and understand my lowly position at the bottom of the academic food chain.
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Posted By: bravecoward
Date Posted: 03 November 2010 at 9:38pm
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All my friends are photography majors and i'm a publication design major
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Posted By: GI JOES SON
Date Posted: 03 November 2010 at 9:54pm
Thought i'd add some food for thought into the mix... After 4 years of obtaining a Liberal Arts degree, I have been assessed to be an Engineering officer for the Army. So i still have the title of an Engineer, or possibly even a Combat Engineer depending on availability, but i didn't have to waste more of my time getting a degree in engineering. |
Posted By: mbro
Date Posted: 03 November 2010 at 11:01pm
Business students and the profs were the reason I switched from finance to legal studies. Pompous asses all around. I had profs teaching business presentation where they discussed business dress requirements while wearing a bolo tie and a tan corduroy jacket with olive green corduroy pants, to a prof teaching business communication by using powerpoint slides with paragraphs of text on them. Then of course they wouldn't require attendance, they would post the powerpoints on the online school site, and then they would give a study guide to the test. So nobody would show up, they'd occasionally turn in the retarded fake email assignments and then they would curve the grade so everyone got an A. That's a business environment? That made me so made I went to an actual major that was interesting, not curved and required original thought and the ability to defend your opinion. I enjoyed every minute of my 300 and 400 level law classes. ------------- 
Don't blame me, I voted for Kodos. |
Posted By: Enos Shenk
Date Posted: 04 November 2010 at 1:33am
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Snerk. One of the worst classes I had to take was basic electronics. It was amazingly boring, taught by a professor that used every stereotypical bad powerpoint trick in the book. Every single class session was this guy going through a 4 hour powerpoint presentation and reading the text on the screen word for word... Anyway, the homework for this class was just as lazy. The only requirement was X amount of homework assignments from the text had to be done by the last day of class. The teacher apparently didn't notice this was a shocking amount of stuff, something like 50 questions per chapter, and not just "find the answer" questions, more like "Calculate the resistance voltage and amperage for 20 points on this schematic" questions. I was way behind, so I spent about 3 days solid busting my hump to finish these things, finally on the last day we turn in our homework notebooks...And the guy just flips through them. I mean literally does the finger-flip thing with the pages to see how much "stuff" is in there before just checking them off. Either you did enough "stuff" or you didn't do any "stuff". Edit: Oh and I forgot to mention, two weeks after I got out of that class, the professor keeled over of a heart attack. Which made me feel really bad for trashing his teaching style beforehand.... ------------- 
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Posted By: Darur
Date Posted: 04 November 2010 at 2:19am
I don't think I've ever mocked or thought less of a student for their major. The only time I make any voice about "ooh how hard engineers have it" is when my friends make the mistake of complaining about how hard THEY have it. But I can't deny, in our little engineering covens, most non-hard science majors are roundly bashed whenever we hear them complaining about how hard their courses are. It's not because we feel like we're better then them, its out of the sheer resentment bred by weekly all-nighters, and studying all the time, while seeing well-rested students who seem to be able to goof off and get good grades. Heck, last week, walking back to my dorm at 6 in the morning after a week averaging 3 hours of sleep a night, I felt like punching anyone in the face who was smiling. Are we in the wrong? Without question, but we do it to feel a little better. But yeah, engineering students who make like they are better then everyone else annoy the hell out of me. ------------- Real Men play Tuba [IMG]http://img89.imageshack.us/img89/1859/newsmall6xz.jpg"> PH33R TEH 1337 Dwarf! http://www.tippmann.com/forum/wwf77a/log_off_user.asp" rel="nofollow - DONT CLICK ME!!1 |
Posted By: SSOK
Date Posted: 04 November 2010 at 1:06pm
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I aggree with Darur.
I go to an engineering school, where most people are either archies, engineers, and a few IT's and stuff. Most of the kids on the sports teams are either foreign, or wayy out of state, going on full rides for Business Majors.
Regardless, I didnt hate on anyone for being of 'a lesser major' than me. Part of it is im going for low level engineering/teaching whereas many of my friends are ME's and archies. The only time where I was like "eff your classes, im taking xyzabc" was when the IT majors would complain that their 098 math classes, astronomy, and humanities 101 classes were too hard. Perhaps it was because they partied until three on a nightly basis.
I would love to take some 'fun' classes I might enjoy. -------------
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Posted By: ParielIsBack
Date Posted: 04 November 2010 at 1:07pm
I'm not in a competitive school. Given my experience, engineering isn't particularly competitive either. If telling people they need to apply themselves is condescending, you need to toughen up a little. Also, don't pretend like you know me. This is the internet. I guarantee if you saw my GPA you would take back what you said. And if you met me, you'd probably think that you were right the first time. ------------- BU Engineering 2012 |
Posted By: Gatyr
Date Posted: 04 November 2010 at 2:55pm
That isn't what bothered me, because people do need to apply themselves if they are going to spend so much money on an education. What bothered me is you said, without qualification, liberal arts educations make you laugh. So you either find the concept of a liberal arts degree genuinely funny, as people find comedians funny, or you were expressing your disdain for a liberal arts education by mentioning how laughably easy/shorter the degree plan is. What does condescension have to do with toughening up, though? You didn't threaten, scare, intimidate, or do anything signifying my weakness, nor did I respond in such a way that would warrant a necessity for toughening up, so why the comment? And I didn't pretend to know you, I said I had never realized one of your traits; observation/realization != knowing, so how can me NOT realizing something about you indicate that I DO know you? Apparently semantics isn't one of the abstract concepts you need to be apologetic for knowing about. -------------
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Posted By: Bolt3
Date Posted: 04 November 2010 at 3:16pm
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BA/BS's are srs bizness ------------- <Removed sig for violation of Clause 4 of the New Sig Rules> |
Posted By: usafpilot07
Date Posted: 04 November 2010 at 3:20pm
Gatyr, like I said in chat a while back: Told you so. 
------------- Buffalo buffalo Buffalo buffalo buffalo buffalo Buffalo buffalo |
Posted By: choopie911
Date Posted: 04 November 2010 at 3:23pm
| The idea of a check plus just makes me think of some design schools that are just pass or fail, no percentages of failure/ passing. Great system for that, awful for nearly anything else |
Posted By: GroupB
Date Posted: 04 November 2010 at 10:00pm
Abstract concepts? Like Laws and equations?
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Posted By: brihard
Date Posted: 04 November 2010 at 10:57pm
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Generally speaking, your education will not get you a job.
What gets you a job is the whole package; what you bring to the table, how you articulate it, and how you can sell yourself as appropriate to the demands of the position. Education is just part of what you bring in there. If you have four years of school but no real life experiences a lot of things will be closed glyph. An education on top of other qualities, however, is a great asset. I have several friends who trapped themselves into believing that a piece of paper with BA or BS on it would mean a job, only to be disappointed. Do not let your learning be limited to your education. You wouldn't go to the gym and only work on a single muscle group, or only ever play the same song, or practice the same play. Being well rounded will take you farther than a higher education with nothing else. I hav ------------- "Abortion is not "choice" in America. It is forced and the democrats are behind it, with the goal of eugenics at its foundation." -FreeEnterprise, 21 April 2011. Yup, he actually said that. |
Posted By: ParielIsBack
Date Posted: 05 November 2010 at 9:46am
Implication that you had "realized" something about me, at some point. Note: synonyms for realized include "know". Apparently your semantics are wrong. Perhaps because you made them up. I don't generally include the sciences or math in what I think of as the liberal arts (oh God I've changed the definition! What a terrible shame!), because I generally find students in both have developed actual useful skills. When the standard for "difficult" in a course is having to write a five or ten page paper, I don't hesitate to say that I disdain that "education". It's just a sign that not applying oneself and wasting (at least at my school) a couple hundred thousand dollars doesn't help anyone, except the profit that this university makes.
Getting a job in the aerospace field without an engineering degree, or having worked for a decade or so as a military aviator, is virtually impossible. Unless it's a job unrelated to design, like business. Then again, my sister got a degree in Islamic Art, and she's doing just fine in the business world.
I agree with that 100%. I would honestly say I learn more outside of school than in it, even at this level. It may be related to the fact that since I was little, I haven't watched TV and instead read voraciously. ------------- BU Engineering 2012 |
Posted By: brihard
Date Posted: 05 November 2010 at 10:02am
Oh, absolutely. But someone with a degree in aerospace engineering who is still a complete mouth breather probably will still be less competitive in finding a job. A specific education - or a certain level of education in general - might absolutely be a prerequisite for a given job, but it's generally not sufficient in and of itself. ------------- "Abortion is not "choice" in America. It is forced and the democrats are behind it, with the goal of eugenics at its foundation." -FreeEnterprise, 21 April 2011. Yup, he actually said that. |
Posted By: agentwhale007
Date Posted: 05 November 2010 at 10:07am
Useful to whom?
Wouldn't that depend some on how the paper is graded? And further points here, how do you think society would be changed if everyone who went to higher education did only an engineering course of studies? I know you don't seem to like the other areas, and think they are a waste (It's always funny to me when people enrolled in a university hop on the anti-intellectualism train), but do they at least not contribute something to society?
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Posted By: agentwhale007
Date Posted: 05 November 2010 at 10:22am
Nearly any major can be skirted through without application. Nearly any major can be done in a way where classes are picked to get through easy. If you're naturally good at math, as a few people I've known are, engineering school is a breeze. The kid I lived with freshman year quit engineering - at a school known for its program - because it wasn't challenging him. However, nearly any major can have people who fight hard to learn as much as they can, to take it all in, and pick classes that they know will challenge them and make them better educated. There is no magical "harder" major at the undergraduate level. And if you're going to speak on application, I've also got a friend who was an art history major. Sounds useless, but she worked hard in her courses, did a ton of local internships, did study-abroad trips, and now works at a museum in Barcelona as a restoration analysts. Application has everything to do with the person, nothing to do with the area of study. |
Posted By: usafpilot07
Date Posted: 05 November 2010 at 10:52am
EFFING DAWT. ------------- Buffalo buffalo Buffalo buffalo buffalo buffalo Buffalo buffalo |
Posted By: ParielIsBack
Date Posted: 05 November 2010 at 11:31am
The ability to write an analytical paper is not a skill that anyone should be without. Pretending it's the only skill someone would need is just as silly.
Sure. But I've taken more than my share of liberal arts classes given that I'm an engineer, and when I can write a B+ paper in the four hours before it's due in one of the hardest courses in our history department, it doesn't exactly push the point that it's difficult. As I said, I have no experience at other schools. But I have a pretty wide viewpoint of my own given the variety of majors I interact with on a regular basis.
And here you've put words in my mouth. Liberal arts does not cover the entire arena of education, and the single skill it teaches is "thinking analytically". Hint: everyone else has to figure out how to think analytically too.
Sure, passing college is pretty easy. The difference is that liberal arts is by definition easy, so that people can "find out what they want to do in life". Last time I checked, drinking, smoking pot and chasing women is not a recognized profession. Are there engineers who do the same? Absolutely. But the amount of work in engineering is significant enough that most people do not. I don't care how good you are at math, the actual work load for engineering is higher than for liberal arts. It's not a question of how smart one is (although that can come in handy), it's a question of how hard one is willing to work. I wouldn't hesitate to say I know some of the most naturally mathematically skilled college students in the country, and for some reason MIT is still hard for them. Meanwhile, my friends studying at Harvard say that the place is a breeze. Coincidence? Perhaps. But given that I come from a town with a very high degree of education, and spend a lot of time with people who are internationally recognized as having some of the best education this country has to offer, I'd say that I have a pretty good grasp of the situation.
Perhaps not. But there is certainly a set of majors which are easier to skate through than others. Most of these tend to be in the liberal arts.
As I said, my sister has been very successful with her liberal arts degree. I don't doubt that it's possible. But what I have seen is a whole lot of people wasting a lot of money and time so that they can drink four days a week.
I absolutely agree. The distinct correlation between liberal arts and the students who do the least certainly exists at my school, though, if not at others. Given my knowledge of other institutions of higher education in this country, I'd be surprised if it wasn't true in general. ------------- BU Engineering 2012 |
Posted By: agentwhale007
Date Posted: 05 November 2010 at 6:35pm
Which major exists where that is the only skill? It's like saying that an engineering student can only do equations. Do you only do equations? Because a computer can do equations.
I'll go ahead and call shenanigans on that. Either that, or you don't have a very good history department. It's reflective more of the program than of the area of study.
That is very clear.
At your one school and limited scope of study, yes. That's comparative to me saying that I have a pretty wide view of French cuisine because I had a croissant once.
One, you're incorrect in thinking that "thinking critically" is all liberal arts education is good for. It would be like me saying, again, that all you are good for is crunching numbers. Engineering is just being a human calculator, easily replaceable. Two, how do you think, over time, the level of "analytical thinking" got involved in your education? Three, the level of "analytical thinking" needed for engineering is nothing close to that needed for something like law. You can pretend it does. And that is pretty cute, that you said you are good at abstract thought, when you are a major which involves some of the least amount of it.
If one wishes to make it easy, yes.
It's downright adorable that you think that is correct.
And that has what to do with anything?
This is not the case in almost every university I've had experience with. Again, you are falling victim to a limited scope.
If you make it that way, yes. If you want to put in the work, it is there to be done.
Anecdote? Yes.
I'd say not so much. There is a reason that universities mandate that students take classes outside of their required track. It involves near-centuries of established educational theory, none of which you seem familiar with.
No doubt. But is that the fault of the area of study, and enough to degrade those who choose to study an area and not skirt by?
I've seen the same thing with engineers at an engineering heavy school. And the opposite at a mostly liberal arts institution. Go figure. Again I'll also: Useful to whom? Are you saying that liberal arts are not useful to society? Should we be a society of only engineers?
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Posted By: GroupB
Date Posted: 05 November 2010 at 7:16pm
I have a class at an engineering school that has been rated #1 in the country for something like 11 years in a row. Many of my close friends go to that school. I have seen first hand that all of those activities you listed above are just as prevalent at the engineering school as they are at the state school that I spend the other half of my time at. There are some days I get the feeling that those activities are even more prevalent at the engineering school. To say that most engineers don't drink or chase women because they are too busy screwing around with Maple and MATLAB is absurd. Just because you and your friends are boring doesn't mean everyone else studying engineering is. To be honest, you are the first engineering student from which I have heard such arrogant, better than you, opinions regarding other fields of study, and I know a ton of engineering students.
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Posted By: jmac3
Date Posted: 05 November 2010 at 7:20pm
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Some people at the place I work seem to be very arrogant and holier than thou, but maybe it is just me. They were engineering students and are fresh out of college with their Biomedical engineer degrees. Just the way they talk to me is like "serve me my food you lowly peon" ------------- Que pasa? 
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Posted By: Gatyr
Date Posted: 05 November 2010 at 11:03pm
Implied (not very strongly, but meh), but not firmly supported by logic or semantics. I said "I never realized you were so arrogant;" the only thing you can logically take from that statement is that I had not yet made an observation of your arrogance. There is a huge gap in between realizing and having realized something before that you can't seem to appreciate. However, I'll concede that I have realized things about you before. I do it every time you post, if only because I realize that you posted something on the forum. The problem remains, though, that there is no necessary connection between realization and prior knowledge (as you have indicated you believe). This is apparent when you are, let's pretend, standing in line at a grocery store and you realize that the person working the cash register, who you have never met, seen, or come into contact with before, is physically handicapped. If there was some a priori connection between realization and prior knowledge, then you would have known something about that person who you have never seen, met, or come into contact with before. Let's pretend further that you frequent that store and have seen that cashier plenty of times before, but never noticed his physical handicap because his left shin was blown off by a Japanese machine gun in WW2, and his legs were always behind some counter, hidden away from view. One day you see him walking down and aisle and realize he is using a prosthetic limb beneath his left knee. Later, you tell your friend about it. Is a proper response "DON'T PRETEND YOU KNOW HIM," or is it silly for your friend to think that you believed you knew some guy simply because you had looked at him a few times? The burden of proof is on you to show the connection between (and not the implication of) "I never realized..." and (to) "I know you." You've failed thus far.
Says the guy who used a thesaurus to show that realizing something means knowing beforehand. Oh you.
So you recognize that you can't actually judge other schools/majors, but you still defend your arrogant statements because you have anecdotal evidence of something.
...what? Is that really what you believe liberal arts to mean? -------------
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Posted By: *Stealth*
Date Posted: 05 November 2010 at 11:17pm
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It is extremely upsetting to me how many students miss the primary point of higher academics. Pariel is one of them... /Radiology-Pre-Med student ------------- |
Posted By: DaveEllis
Date Posted: 05 November 2010 at 11:25pm
The point was to say I have a Bachelors.
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Posted By: SSOK
Date Posted: 06 November 2010 at 12:28am
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On a side note, I was always excellent in writing and language arts my entire life. From first grade spelling, to 12th grade brit lit I was always above average in writing. I could write an awesome essay in highschool, something that paid off with a few scholarships (worth about $1500 combined, but im not complaining).
Since I have gotten to my fancypants engineering school, my writing skills rotted away somewhere. I took two humanities courses last year, and one history class this year. Its like I completely forgot how to write. The citation errors were horrible, and my papers overall were bad. Myself in 12th grade could easily make a laughingstock of my current abilities. The lowest grade I got so far on a paper was a B+. Yay for engineers not needing proper grammar. -------------
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Posted By: MeanMan
Date Posted: 06 November 2010 at 12:35am
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I go to a private, small liberal arts college..... for a double major in Economics and Marketing with a minor in Spanish. Honestly, college is as hard as you want it to be. I know people at all types of schools that get by with easy classes. They specifically form schedules around specific professors, not what is best. One thing that I notice people say is that liberal arts colleges produce more rounded students. Comparing my first year with my friend at Ohio State University, it is vastly different. He was able to jump right into some engineering classes by his second quarter (OSU is still on quarters, but theyre switching and totally scewing people over probably). He wont get many of the diverse classes that we have that are mandatory. Also, with the whole certain majors being harder thing, lies. It is as hard as you make it, like previously said. Im taking Intermediate Micro 301 at the moment and expected to struggle exceptionally since i skipped 101/102 because of AP. It is regarded as one of the toughest classes at BW because of the professor. But, i consider my Hispanic Lit 275 class as my hardest, but its making me more rounded as well. I was always able to do good in english classes and classes involving poetry/short stories/etc. But, imagine that all in spanish... its rough. None of our grades besides one essay are known. All I know is im doing "good", which I have no idea what means since the dra. hasn't shown us much. But, writing multiple critiques and analysis on poems, plays, short stories and novels IN spanish definitely improves my spanish abilities, but also my understanding of writing/literary elements. Another friend is taking some spanish classes at another college and it doesn't even offer a class like this. Its definitely pro/con situations a lot of times. If you choose the easier route, you may get a higher GPA. Choose the harder route, you can challenge and better yourself. Its up to the person.
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hybrid-sniper~"To be honest, if I see a player still using an Impulse I'm going to question their motives." |
Posted By: __sneaky__
Date Posted: 06 November 2010 at 12:55am
Pariells, this is what I do everyday. Pick up a camera, find yourself a model and see how well you do. I completely agree with you that engineering is a tough field; if you aren't inclined to do it. I was a physics major up until this semester, the concepts and ideas in physics was easy for me, the math is what got me. So I changed to a double major in business and fine arts. I figured out physics wasn't the field for me because I wan't enjoying what I was doing at all. I'm not mathematically inclined enough to be a great physicist. I have a feeling if you picked up a camera, I could come up with a better photo series than you. We each are inclined for different things. Until you match me in photos, and whale in journalism, or jmac in cooking, don't be condescending. I also admit that you will probably have an easier time finding work as an engineer than I will as a portraiture and fashion photographer. I'm not really bothered by that. I also admit that there are plenty of people who go into Art, English, etc, because they think it will be easy. More often than not, they don't make it very far. If they do, all that proves is that there are some crappy writers and artists in the world. Edit: I do respect the fact that you can do the math and various other things to be an engineer. I was not able to do it, it was too hard for me, because I'm not as mathematically inclined as you are, evidently.
------------- "I AM a crossdresser." -Reb Cpl Forum Vice President RIP T&O Forum |
Posted By: mbro
Date Posted: 06 November 2010 at 6:04am
I wish I was taught a second language at a young age. When I have kids they will learn spanish by the time they are five. It's a great investment. -------------
Don't blame me, I voted for Kodos. |
Posted By: usafpilot07
Date Posted: 06 November 2010 at 1:41pm
Sneaky, can I meet her? 
------------- Buffalo buffalo Buffalo buffalo buffalo buffalo Buffalo buffalo |
Posted By: __sneaky__
Date Posted: 06 November 2010 at 3:27pm
------------- "I AM a crossdresser." -Reb Cpl Forum Vice President RIP T&O Forum |
Posted By: pntbl freak
Date Posted: 06 November 2010 at 4:12pm
This is from someone who knows very little about professional photography but two things... Why is the top of her head cut off and why can you see the flash off her forehead and shoulder? -------------  |
Posted By: __sneaky__
Date Posted: 06 November 2010 at 7:22pm
Edit: sidenote, that flash highlight also helps add a three dimensional feel to the photo, having a good sense of the highlight and lowlights adds depth to the photo, so it doesn't look flat and boring. Her face needs a bit more editing to smooth out the gradient, I'll give you that.
------------- "I AM a crossdresser." -Reb Cpl Forum Vice President RIP T&O Forum |
Posted By: agentwhale007
Date Posted: 06 November 2010 at 8:16pm
| You look like you've got some impressive talent with portrait work, Sneaky. Just so you know. |
Posted By: mbro
Date Posted: 07 November 2010 at 1:23am
*edit* ha, daylight savings caused me to post before mack even though I posted after. -------------
Don't blame me, I voted for Kodos. |
Posted By: Mack
Date Posted: 07 November 2010 at 1:45am
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Business majors are supposed to be arrogant? I've been doin' it wrong. The only people in school I was arrogant about were the ones that didn't show up for class (or came in hung over/drunk/high), never turned in homework, were always "sick" on test days and then whined about their grades. Granted, once I moved beyond the basic core classes I didn't have to deal with them any more. ------------- 
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Posted By: __sneaky__
Date Posted: 07 November 2010 at 6:12am
------------- "I AM a crossdresser." -Reb Cpl Forum Vice President RIP T&O Forum |
Posted By: brihard
Date Posted: 07 November 2010 at 12:26pm
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That Daylight Savings Time glitch is phenomenal. We must remember that, and figure out a way to abuse it by this time next year. ------------- "Abortion is not "choice" in America. It is forced and the democrats are behind it, with the goal of eugenics at its foundation." -FreeEnterprise, 21 April 2011. Yup, he actually said that. |
Posted By: Mack
Date Posted: 07 November 2010 at 1:10pm
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Why wait till next year when we can abuse it much sooner on the switch back?
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Posted By: You Wont See Me
Date Posted: 07 November 2010 at 6:06pm
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It's spring forward so I don't think it would work.
------------- A-5 E-Grip JCS Dual Trigger DOP X-CORE 8 stage x-chamber Lapco Bigshot 14" Beadblasted Optional setup: R/T Dead on Blade trigger |
Posted By: brihard
Date Posted: 07 November 2010 at 9:18pm
Fail. ------------- "Abortion is not "choice" in America. It is forced and the democrats are behind it, with the goal of eugenics at its foundation." -FreeEnterprise, 21 April 2011. Yup, he actually said that. |
Posted By: ParielIsBack
Date Posted: 08 November 2010 at 8:33am
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Is anyone in here a liberal arts major? Chef. Nope. Photographer. Nope. Pre-med. Nope (OK, I guess we can stretch this one because people in general seem to include sciences in liberal arts.) Journalist. Nope. Engineer. Nope. Economics/Marketing. Yes/no. How many people actually have a degree in a liberal arts field? For the record that would mean: philosophy, history, language, or literature (although as I've said you could include yourself if you study math or science). The people on this forum have shown "important" liberal arts are by the simple fact that they haven't chosen to pursue them, because all of the areas of study come up in every other field. Furthermore, most of the people studying liberal arts will be sitting in an office doing paperwork some day, applying exactly nothing they learned to earn their degree. Society as a whole would be a lot better off training those people to do a job, instead of wasting hundreds of millions or billions of dollars every year to have over-trained, underachieving middle class workers.
I can tell you that MIT students party hard. But they work hard first. Partying four days a week pretty much excludes that possibility. If I'm boring for not smoking pot and getting drunk every weekend, and having a steady girlfriend for four years who will be far more successful than me, well I'm not exactly going to apologize for being happy and having what most college students are going to go looking for in a decade. That part I really am serious about. The rest of the argument, well, meh. Most of my friends are not engineers, and frankly I could care less about majors. I love studying history. Perhaps like Whale's ex-engineering friend I didn't pursue it because it was too easy for me, but it would be incredibly stupid to remove it as a component of education. ------------- BU Engineering 2012 |
Posted By: agentwhale007
Date Posted: 08 November 2010 at 8:45am
Does this matter? Unlike you, the calculated engineer, I can enjoy the outcomes of research and effort in a field of study without actually being in it. I don't see academics as a measuring contest.
As opposed to the engineer, sitting in a cubicle doing paperwork, but with a calculator?
This is one of the most silly things posted on the forum right now. And that is impressive, because FEaper is still around. Listen to what you are saying: Society would be better if people who had a job doing something had a job doing something else. So take the people doing job A, send them to engineering school, and have them in job B. Really? In this, you're schlepping off the contributions to society by all the liberal arts folks that you don't care for. Not to mention that the majority of engineers end up at desk/cubicle jobs as well. I'm just confused, overall, as to what you said has to do with anything involving anything. Please tell me exactly how society would be better off if everyone was "trained to do a job?" What would these "jobs" be? And what would the training be? And where would they work? Would you be OK with the spiral of anti-intellectualism that it would cause? |
Posted By: jmac3
Date Posted: 08 November 2010 at 8:14pm
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Wawawa I am an engineer and think lesser degrees are useless.
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Posted By: Darur
Date Posted: 08 November 2010 at 9:00pm
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I think what Pariell is awkwardly getting at is the perceived sense of entitlement that some liberal arts students have. Student gets into a respected school, student majors in East-Asian Philosophy, student goofs off for 4 years, student collects $100k + in debt, student can't find a job with their skills, student is unhappy "ITS NOT FAIR!". These people do exist, and they are dumb. But they aren't limited to Liberal Arts students. Plenty of Engineering students rush through school, never do any projects or internships or find a job, and they can't figure out why their classmates a semester behind are getting picked up by Northrop Grumen or Cisco right out of school. Is it harder to find a lucrative, enjoyable career as a Liberal Arts major? You bet. If a person with one of those majors can't find work, will I feel sorry for them? Not really. If an Engineering student who rushed through without a plan can't find work will I feel sorry for them? Yes, but only a little more then a Liberal Arts major. And Whale, I resent the insinuation that Engineers only work in Cubicles with Calculators . . . We usually have whiteboards too ;) ------------- Real Men play Tuba [IMG]http://img89.imageshack.us/img89/1859/newsmall6xz.jpg"> PH33R TEH 1337 Dwarf! http://www.tippmann.com/forum/wwf77a/log_off_user.asp" rel="nofollow - DONT CLICK ME!!1 |
Posted By: usafpilot07
Date Posted: 08 November 2010 at 9:04pm
And, ironically, decided to do so by exuding a sense of entitlement? Bold strategy. And as a Poli-Sci major, I laugh at some of his generalities and uninformed beliefs about post undergrad opportunities for LA majors. ------------- Buffalo buffalo Buffalo buffalo buffalo buffalo Buffalo buffalo |
Posted By: agentwhale007
Date Posted: 08 November 2010 at 9:08pm
On that note, you should have seen the look on my classmates this morning when the professor said we needed to bring a calculator to our Mass Comm Methods final. It's for basic things like figuring out basic variable correlation proofs (Spearman's Rho, etc.) but still, math strikes fear in the hearts of all of us, including me.
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Posted By: procarbinefreak
Date Posted: 09 November 2010 at 12:41am
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I started at a 30k a year engineering school... dropped out because I hated engineering and the people involved with it. I graduated, got a job the week before graduation, and am making either basically the same amount, or more, than the engineer friends I kept up with. I think engineering students get their attitudes from the engineering professors. |
Posted By: brihard
Date Posted: 09 November 2010 at 10:05am
Just about there. Four year honours degree in criminology and criminal justice with a concentration in sociology and a minor in political science (emphasizing conflict and IR). I've taken electives in moral philosophy and history, as well. You seem to assume that nothing we learn will relate, in time, to our jobs. On the contrary, the pure subject matter knowledge we gain contributes greatly to our understanding of 'the bigger picture' in what we're working in. If I get into the police I can be a 'cog in the machine' of the cirminal justice system, or I can understand where I fit in the larger role of things, and grasp the potentially larger significance of individual cases, of pre-and-post charge diversion on recidivism, of specific sentencing decisions. As a soldier, I can understand where a given conflict I may serve in actually matters- why I fight, not just because someone told me to. 'Don't shoot civilians; it's against the law' turns into 'don't shoot civilians, our entire strategy requires good relations with the locals, and the potential long term effects of a serious mistake could compromise our efforts'. I also understand how fragile our system is, and how critical it is to protect it, even at cost to myself. Then there's our ability to *grasp* the bigger picture outside of us, to see trends emerging, and to understand their significance. When I go to the polls to vote for the government, I'm not voting based on what I see on TV ads, but with a critical look at the actual stances on the issues that matter to me, informed by what I've learned. My moral philosophy course was instrumental in teaching me how formulate, defend, and critique and argument. Every essay I've written in any class has drawn from what I learned there. My history classes have contributed to my general knowledge of the world, and have helped to situate modern events in proper historical context that *does* affect how things play out. The dozens of essays I've written have translated directly into writing better cover letters, or even in some cases better formal correspondence at work that has helped to communicate issues to my chain of command that need to be resolved. My confidence in my field of subject knowledge gives me more confidence in advocating my informed positions on things that are important to me, and have helped me so far in at least one job interview in my field (more to follow on that sometime this week, I hope). My 'liberal arts education' got me an eight month work placement at a youth jail that has added invaluable experience and breadth to my resume. Have I done a lot of stuff that doesn't very much directly bear on things as they stand? Yes, absolutely. Is any of it useless? No, absolutely not. Every thing I've learned and done is a small part of the sum total of what and who I am. My thoughts on this were best described to me by an engineer I randomly met in a pub; an older guy. He described how, having not gotten work at all related to his field, he ended up doing economics work in a building downtown. Looking out his office window, there are two historical bridges, one built somewhat earlier, the other somewhat later. He described being able to understand what he was looking at, noting that different construction methods took into account different technologies, masses, shear strengths, etc etc, and he saw how those small technological differences had contributed to two entirely different bridges filling the same function. Then what he told me me was, "I never really directly used what I learned, but when I look out my window I can see a small part of the world in a way that nobody else I work with can". Speaking for myself, I'd like to learn to see the world as completely as I'm able. My education is a means to that end, and the rest will come as it will. There's not a bit of it that I'd rather have missed out on. ------------- "Abortion is not "choice" in America. It is forced and the democrats are behind it, with the goal of eugenics at its foundation." -FreeEnterprise, 21 April 2011. Yup, he actually said that. |
Posted By: usafpilot07
Date Posted: 09 November 2010 at 10:27am
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But, but, BRIHARD, memorizing formulas and how to use them IS COMPLETELY DIFFERENT AND SUPERIOR.
------------- Buffalo buffalo Buffalo buffalo buffalo buffalo Buffalo buffalo |
Posted By: The Reaper
Date Posted: 09 November 2010 at 10:47am
When I was in college, you had to type papers... Period.
Only a few kids had computers with printers.
Handwritten with chicken scratch like that would yield a F.
Course we had to wear a tie (for guys, skirt for girls) to every class, and even to eat... So it was different than most liberal universities. -------------
Try being informed instead of just opinionated. How long before you admit that Obama was a mistake? |
Posted By: Gatyr
Date Posted: 09 November 2010 at 11:15am
Philosophy/history major here. I don't have my degree yet, but I'll check back aft the end of summer '11.
On the contrary, sir. The instruction I've received in writing and argument composition/analysis will have been (and already is) greatly beneficial to me. The near-constant critiques I've received have greatly increased my capability to reason on any subject presented to me, and the my ability to articulate said reasoning has increased to a similar degree. Even if I don't get a job that requires me to use Kant's metaphysics, I'll have benefited from reading and understanding his works.
Similarly, how much better off are you getting a B.S. than you would be getting an internship/clerkship/whatever in an engineering firm and getting paid to learn while working at your job? Is there anything necessitating that you have a college degree, or is it just that you are doing this because the norm today is to get a degree? Nearly all of your complaints/observations can be made about non-liberal arts majors as well, but for some reason you don't see it. And again, lol at you thinking the point of higher learning is to get a job. Universities != trade schools. It's become standard practice to use a degree to get a job, yes, but seeing universities as a means to a job is perverting the idea on which nearly every one of those institutions was formed on.
And yet you could have it anyway, without spending hundreds of thousands of dollars, if you applied yourself to the job the way you apply yourself to the education.
You're such a troll. -------------
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Posted By: GroupB
Date Posted: 09 November 2010 at 1:12pm
It was an in-class assignment. You can step off your horse now.
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Posted By: scotchyscotch
Date Posted: 09 November 2010 at 1:16pm
| Out of pure curiosity with no point intended I'm studying Law and Philosophy. What does that make me? |
Posted By: agentwhale007
Date Posted: 09 November 2010 at 1:24pm
You went to Bob Jones, yeah? Or am I mistaken?
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Posted By: agentwhale007
Date Posted: 01 February 2011 at 8:40am
| This seems legit guys. |
Posted By: Skillet42565
Date Posted: 01 February 2011 at 8:59am
Pretty much this. ------------- 
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Posted By: ParielIsBack
Date Posted: 01 February 2011 at 12:18pm
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So how those liberal arts majors going for you guys? Oh wait, I forgot no one has a liberal arts degree. My bad. ------------- BU Engineering 2012 |
Posted By: brihard
Date Posted: 01 February 2011 at 12:28pm
Wanna hammer out your definition of 'liberal arts' then? My program is Criminology and Criminal Justice with a concentration in sociology and a minor in political science- my degree will be a mix of psychology, sociology, and law, with electives in history and philosophy, and a minor in political science. Would you consider my program to be a 'liberal arts' degree? I would. ------------- "Abortion is not "choice" in America. It is forced and the democrats are behind it, with the goal of eugenics at its foundation." -FreeEnterprise, 21 April 2011. Yup, he actually said that. |
Posted By: agentwhale007
Date Posted: 01 February 2011 at 12:34pm
| It's also worth pointing out that it doesn't matter if I'm involved in liberal arts or not, I still don't think it's a lesser study. |
Posted By: choopie911
Date Posted: 01 February 2011 at 2:21pm
I'm in Interactive Arts and Technology, focussing on Media Arts and Design...so..... |
Posted By: SSOK
Date Posted: 01 February 2011 at 4:29pm
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So from what I gathered from this thread... I am more elite, more intelligent, and more successful than all of you rapscallions because I go to an engineering school.
Okay, cool beans. The rest of you should continue your careers at McDonalds and Imagination Land while I earn $250,000. Stop wasting my air. -------------
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Posted By: ParielIsBack
Date Posted: 01 February 2011 at 4:54pm
Fine arts don't exist in Canada?
Regardless of your opinion, the reality on this forum strongly supports the fact that a liberal arts degree is not a useful tool in the modern world. Unless you want to guarantee that you have to move onto higher education to get a job, which people certainly do.
No, it's a professional degree (criminology/criminal justice), with liberal arts classes. That's what I expect of every student. My point is not that liberal arts are useless, it's that studying them alone is useless.
Excellent work sir! You have cut to the core of my argument concisely. ------------- BU Engineering 2012 |
Posted By: evillepaintball
Date Posted: 01 February 2011 at 5:17pm
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Posted By: bravecoward
Date Posted: 01 February 2011 at 6:05pm
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Posted By: brihard
Date Posted: 02 February 2011 at 12:04am
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Sorry, a 'professional degree'? What profession does a degree in criminology and criminal justice prepare me for? To be a 'criminologist', you generally need a doctorate in criminology or in specific subsets of closely related fields. I've learned nothing practical about how to be a police officer, judge, lawyer, psychologist, parole officer, social worker, case manager, correctional officer, or what have you. What I DO have is a rather broad based education that provides a sound academic foundation for specific training I might receive at a later date that would qualify me for specific jobs. Any one of those jobs I mentioned are fairly well suited to someone with my degree, but I consider a 'professional degree' to be one that comes with a substantial portion of the requirements to enter into a regulated profession such as law, medicine, engineering, or what have you. To do just about anything meaningful with my education I'll require substantial further training. I think my education will make that training easier and will make it stick more, and possibly give me a leg up in career progression, but if you consider what I'm taking to be a 'professional degree', you're very mistaken about the nature of my program. ------------- "Abortion is not "choice" in America. It is forced and the democrats are behind it, with the goal of eugenics at its foundation." -FreeEnterprise, 21 April 2011. Yup, he actually said that. |
Posted By: ParielIsBack
Date Posted: 02 February 2011 at 8:13am
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If you want to call it liberal arts, more power to you. But there's a whole field designed for people with criminal justice degrees, so I don't see how that's the case. For that matter, you wouldn't be any more wrong than the people in here who can't tell the difference between the fine arts and liberal arts. At least you have a legitimate argument that your degree is a liberal arts degree. Also, in the interest of full disclosure I'm an aerospace engineering major with a double minor in American History and Political Science. My point has never been that people should ignore the liberal arts. ------------- BU Engineering 2012 |
Posted By: agentwhale007
Date Posted: 02 February 2011 at 8:25am
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You certainly backed down from your original levels of smug once people started calling you out on it. And again, I don't understand the fascination with making sure people know they don't have a liberal arts degree. It doesn't matter.
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Posted By: ParielIsBack
Date Posted: 02 February 2011 at 7:00pm
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I don't have a fascination with it, I'm simply amazed by the number of people in this thread who think they have a liberal arts degree, yet clearly do not. If I remember correctly, we're at borderline two (which were Bri, and MeanMan.) Both of whom have significant professional aspects (marketing and criminology) in their degrees. If you're going to argue with me, don't base it on the fact that you think you have a liberal arts degree, when even the the broadest definitions of the term don't include our major. I still think liberal arts are easier. Maybe that's just for me, I don't know. But as I said, if I'd gone with a history or political science degree, I would have graduated a full year earlier. I think that says a lot about the relative work involved. ------------- BU Engineering 2012 |
Posted By: evillepaintball
Date Posted: 03 February 2011 at 1:44am
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You have more homework. Big deal. No one cares, move along. -------------
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