Who's got two thumbs and wants to get informed?
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Topic: Who's got two thumbs and wants to get informed?
Posted By: CHiKUN_PiMP
Subject: Who's got two thumbs and wants to get informed?
Date Posted: 24 February 2012 at 7:02pm
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<---- This guy! I've always been interested in seriously participating in politics and voting, but it seems like such a complex mess of issues I really don't know where to start. So, like many Americans- I say screw it and let my freedoms get taken away like a dolt, but it's becoming more and more obvious that my strategy of ignoring my right to participate in the voting process is going to seriously screw me (and those future kids I hope I'll never have, lol) over. Anyone got any good resources where I can inform myself as to what are current issues? Any college courses I can take or something? Yahoo just doesn't cut it for me these days. ------------- Ignorance is bliss, why aint you smilin? |
Replies:
Posted By: BARREL BREAK
Date Posted: 24 February 2012 at 9:15pm
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Start with http://www.amazon.com/Peoples-History-United-States-Present/dp/0060838655/" rel="nofollow - history , then consider ideology. Then remember that both major parties want nothing that's in your interest. |
Posted By: Mack
Date Posted: 25 February 2012 at 9:50am
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Watch Fox News; "Fair and balanced" is their motto.
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Posted By: GroupB
Date Posted: 25 February 2012 at 11:15am
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They couldn't put that as their motto if it weren't true. ------------- 
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Posted By: stratoaxe
Date Posted: 25 February 2012 at 11:23am
I'd agree with studying history. While I do believe there's a marked disconnect between the interest of the parties and your own interests, I think that it is possible to line up closer to one party than another. Here's sonething to remember about politics-to understand where a political party sits, you need to understand the climate of your own society. By that I mean parties pander to the lowest common denominator-they make big promises to simple people and often do so with no regard for consequences. So if you understand that militant conservatism is on the rise among those on the right, you see why Rick Santorum and Gingrich have prospered in this GOP run. Years ago when I was young I believed in straight up Republican voting. At that time there was an atomsphere of militant liberalism that I perceived and I generally felt more comfortable with what I perceived to be the more down to earth Republican philosophies. With this administration and the right wing hornets nest it has stirred up, I'm not sure I feel that way any more. I think with the pro gun movements after 9/11 that my hobbies are much safer, and I think reality has brought the global warning debate / militant environmentalism back down to the realm of common sense. I see less push from the left against conservative ideologies and I feel less threatened so I'm not as apt to vote straight right wing this time around. Basically, just formulate your own ideology and go with the party why infringes upon it the least. Like guns? That's a political issue. Like abortion? That's a political issue. Like government assistance? That's a political issue. Are you pro big military or pro social reform? That's a choice you'll end up having to make. Once you know where you line up personally you can begin to check out the talking heads and take everything they say with a grain of salt...there's nothing wrong with a serving of Fox News as long as you take a side of Google with it. Opinion based political programming is the junk food of the educational media. Most people watch them to shake their fists in agreement and feel their own values confirmed by a TV personality. I personally get most of my news from Drudge and News.Google . Though the way Drudge arranges his headlines can lend to his right wing bias, you can generally follow the links and sort through what's hype and what's legit. ------------- 
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BARREL BREAK wrote:Posted By: Mack
Date Posted: 25 February 2012 at 12:48pm
Yep.  -------------
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Posted By: impulse418
Date Posted: 25 February 2012 at 1:50pm
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Both major political parties are ran by the same banks. Your vote doesn't matter. Your mayor and governor will have more of a impact in your life, than the president. |
Posted By: CHiKUN_PiMP
Date Posted: 25 February 2012 at 3:26pm
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I agree with the fact that history will basically show you that none of these guys really want anything in your interest. I see myself voting mostly against laws than supporting any of these new crazy law. But, when the <not forum appropriate> in this country at least I can say I tried playing by the rules by voting.
------------- Ignorance is bliss, why aint you smilin? |
Posted By: Mack
Date Posted: 25 February 2012 at 4:17pm
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Public Service Announcement: Above post edited because an acronym for cursing is the same as cursing. Eventually the mods will decide that everyone has been warned enough for this and will just start handing out strikes. We now return you to your regularly scheduled thread. -------------
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Posted By: *Stealth*
Date Posted: 25 February 2012 at 4:19pm
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He must be stopped... ------------- |
Posted By: ammolord
Date Posted: 25 February 2012 at 4:45pm
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Holy crap, how long has mack been a mod???? ------------- PSN Tag: AmmoLord XBL: xXAmmoLordXx ~Minister of Tinkering With Things That Go "BOOM!"(AKA Minister of Munitions)~ |
Posted By: Mack
Date Posted: 25 February 2012 at 5:11pm
I can not be stopped. I am immune to everything . . . . . . except glass roses . . . . . . wait, uh . . . oh drat! -------------
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Posted By: impulse418
Date Posted: 25 February 2012 at 5:26pm
| The world really has gone crazy. |
Posted By: stratoaxe
Date Posted: 25 February 2012 at 6:54pm
More liberal power grabbing. Mack is secretly a censor for the left wing media...I saw the bumper sticker on the back of his Crown Vic, right next to his AARP support sticker. -------------
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Posted By: StormyKnight
Date Posted: 25 February 2012 at 8:01pm
At least CNN, MSNBC, Headline and a few others don't say that. Very obvious where they lay. ------------- 
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Posted By: StormyKnight
Date Posted: 25 February 2012 at 8:03pm
Congrats, Mack. 'bout time! And, it is cannot, not can not. ;) Now... Really back to our regularly scheduled program.
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Posted By: StormyKnight
Date Posted: 25 February 2012 at 8:22pm
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I became disenchanted with the Republicans when Bush went into Iraq. I was ready to change my mind if they did find WMD, but that didn't happen. I told myself I would never vote Republican again. Then Obama got into office and started running the national debt up like an unlimited credit card account. He's on his way to spending between one and two trillion dollars a year and not having much to show for it. I became a Libertarian and voted straight Libertarian in the last Presidential election. Now I'm in a quandry. I still want to vote Libertarian. Ron Paul is a Libertairan in Republican's clothing. I love his domestic idealogy, but his foreign policy and his conspiracy theories leave much to be desired. I'd be on a fence post if he miraculously got the nomination. I like Santorum, but the Democrats are clamoring for him to get the nomination because it is widely believed that Obama could easily beat him. I don't like Romney because he isn't a conservative as he wants everyone to believe (see Romney Care). So, now I'm stuck. Do I really want to stick to my ideals and vote Libertarian at the risk of Obama getting another term? I don't know. I have time to think this out as the year progresses. -------------
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Posted By: Lightningbolt
Date Posted: 25 February 2012 at 9:29pm
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Like they didn't have a month warning that the us military was coming and relocate wmds. I wonder how much stuff a few of us genius's here on the forum could move with a couple of cranes, excavators and semi trains over the course of a month |
Posted By: StormyKnight
Date Posted: 26 February 2012 at 12:13am
I think he's a member of aMAC. Association of Mature American Citizens. Somebody put that liberal AARP sticker on his bumper as a joke. -------------
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Posted By: BARREL BREAK
Date Posted: 26 February 2012 at 4:16pm
And I thought all the funny posters had left... |
Posted By: oldpbnoob
Date Posted: 27 February 2012 at 1:51pm
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WARNING! TIN FOIL HAT ZONE AHEAD.. ------------- "When I grow up I want to marry a rich man and live in a condor next to the beach" -- My 7yr old daughter. |
Posted By: Lightningbolt
Date Posted: 27 February 2012 at 1:57pm
I'm saying that it's possible that they could have moved items not that I know they did. Are you saying that you know that they didn't move anything? dude for the sake of argument sadam was an upstanding and honest guy ok I mean if they wrapped it in tin foil we wouldn't been able to zap it with laser beams and stuff |
Posted By: impulse418
Date Posted: 27 February 2012 at 2:03pm
Ya we entered iraq for wmds, for the same reason in iran........ 
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Posted By: agentwhale007
Date Posted: 27 February 2012 at 2:11pm
| For those of you saying that the "two parties don't care about the people they just care about themselves," who do you believe these parties are comprised of? Robots? |
Posted By: Lightningbolt
Date Posted: 27 February 2012 at 2:18pm
| Has Bill Gates figured out how to impart greed into robots? |
Posted By: agentwhale007
Date Posted: 27 February 2012 at 2:25pm
If I may be of some assistance: What exactly are you interested in? Keeping on top of the current issues right now, or learning more about the modern goings-on of government? If the former, read the news. Get a news-reader app for your phone. I recommend the AP Mobile Reader or USA Today. Or, if you want it in a funnier package, find an aggregation site like Fark or Newsy. If you read http://www.economist.com/" rel="nofollow - The Economist, and http://www.foreignaffairs.com/" rel="nofollow - Foreign Affairs , you're pretty much set for current important things both domestic and abroad. For more in-depth stuff, I can recommend some books and journals, but I'll need a topic. Political science is too broad of a topic alone.
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Posted By: agentwhale007
Date Posted: 27 February 2012 at 2:26pm
One does not get into politics to get rich. At least not someone with any other set of skills.
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Posted By: Lightningbolt
Date Posted: 27 February 2012 at 2:29pm
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I'm having difficulties understanding how you can speak for so many people. Tell this to Cheney mkay |
Posted By: agentwhale007
Date Posted: 27 February 2012 at 2:35pm
The majority of Cheney's income, at least the substantial part, has come from his time in the private sector, namely with Halliburton. Of his about $90 million net worth, $20 million came in the form of an exit package from Halliburton in 2000 when he was elected vice president. He made his money in the private sector. He made his power in politics. One could potentially argue that greed for power causes people to get into politics, or that politicians are greedy for power, but it's hard to argue they are greedy for money. |
Posted By: Lightningbolt
Date Posted: 27 February 2012 at 2:39pm
| Right. Halliburton with all of the U.S military contracts |
Posted By: agentwhale007
Date Posted: 27 February 2012 at 2:40pm
Yes. And?
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Posted By: Lightningbolt
Date Posted: 27 February 2012 at 2:53pm
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come on man. don't take this wrong because you're like a long lost nephew but can I have your ole ladies number so I can text her and ask her to shake you by the shoulders real firm to snap you out of it? you're hippmotized you honestly don't think that people don't go into politics to gain favor in the private sector? |
Posted By: agentwhale007
Date Posted: 27 February 2012 at 3:02pm
Favor? Perhaps. Goes along with the aspect of power. Money? No. You can make heaps more money by just sticking to the private sector. As long as you've got a skill set, be it business, law, etc., your ability to make billions quickly is in the private sector. CEO's have very high pay rates. For example, the highest-paid CEOs in the U.S. make around $120 million to $140 million per-year, best I can find. The president of the U.S. makes $400,000 per-year. Look at the list of top billionaires in the U.S. and see how many of them are politicians. I can think of one off-hand: Michael Bloomberg. He was, if I recall, a billionaire before he was elected. There is not a lot of money to be made in politics when compared to just staying in the private sector. Power? Sure. Money? Not really.
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Posted By: oldpbnoob
Date Posted: 27 February 2012 at 3:06pm
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My God, I agree with LB. ------------- "When I grow up I want to marry a rich man and live in a condor next to the beach" -- My 7yr old daughter. |
Posted By: agentwhale007
Date Posted: 27 February 2012 at 3:07pm
Where are all the people making billions while they are in office?
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Posted By: oldpbnoob
Date Posted: 27 February 2012 at 3:22pm
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You don't have to make Billions for it to be an incentive. And it's not like there aren't ways to hide money. What you said is true, if you are truly awesome at what you do, you can make tons of money in the private sector. However, if you don't have the particular skill set to make wealth in the private sector, I beleive there are plenty of ways to make it through political favors. Blagojevich would be a perfect example. He got caught, but how many don't? ------------- "When I grow up I want to marry a rich man and live in a condor next to the beach" -- My 7yr old daughter. |
Posted By: agentwhale007
Date Posted: 27 February 2012 at 3:55pm
Some interesting stuff in here. I'll think about it and discuss later tonight. |
Posted By: GroupB
Date Posted: 27 February 2012 at 4:17pm
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Has it already been discussed that perhaps wealthy people get in to politics so they can write and pass legislation that is favorable to them and their private businesses? A good example would be tax rates on investment income. -------------
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Posted By: oldpbnoob
Date Posted: 27 February 2012 at 4:19pm
------------- "When I grow up I want to marry a rich man and live in a condor next to the beach" -- My 7yr old daughter. |
Posted By: BARREL BREAK
Date Posted: 27 February 2012 at 7:29pm
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They're comprised of entrenched plutocrats with vested interests in maintaining favorable relations with private industry by acting in their interest. e:
Sure, it's possible, it is just extremely unlikely that Iraq had any weapons beyond a few stray decaying shells. UN weapons inspectors said, far in advance of US invasion, that Iraq had no more chemical or biological weapons programs, and the IAEA confirmed that their nuclear program was done with. This was indeed borne out http://articles.cnn.com/2004-03-21/us/iraq.weapons_1_nuclear-weapons-hans-blix-iaea?_s=PM:US" rel="nofollow - after the fact as well. |
Posted By: agentwhale007
Date Posted: 28 February 2012 at 11:29am
True. I don't really thing that -nobody- gets into politics for the money. I do think, however, that for most people, politics isn't really a fantastic choice if your goal is to get rich, and that is your only goal. The per-year pay is rather low, there is a lot of regulation about the money you can receive from outside donations and sources (Although that is changing), and the window of time is limited. There isn't much job security either. Unless you are appointed, you're up for election on a frequent cycle.
Ah, and this was the point I wasn't considering earlier -- lawyers. Good call on that. Lawyers run the gamut from golden-toilet rich to picking up bus stop change for some Ramen poor.
I'm just not really convinced someone gets into politics to get rich. I think they may want to secure power, or may want good benefits, or may want the public spotlight, or any other reasons. It just seems rather difficult to get rich while in office. For pork, most of that is stuff grabbed for your district or state, not really for you personally. Even if you look at Blagojevich, he was selling the seat for what, about $1.5 million? CEOs can make that in a few weeks. But yeah, I totally get what you're saying, though. |
Posted By: oldpbnoob
Date Posted: 28 February 2012 at 11:42am
As for pork, while it may not be a completely accurate useage of the term consider this. Our local representative is very much behind the expansion of the voucher system here in Ohio. It just so happens that his kids all attend or have attended the local private Catholic school that will benefit greatly from this increase. Coincidence? ------------- "When I grow up I want to marry a rich man and live in a condor next to the beach" -- My 7yr old daughter. |
Posted By: agentwhale007
Date Posted: 28 February 2012 at 11:46am
In that situation, he's doing something that will benefit him personally, but won't really make him rich. If he owned the private school, I could see it. But I get your point with Blagojevich. That's a spot-on example of where I wasn't correct.
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Posted By: CHiKUN PiMP
Date Posted: 28 February 2012 at 12:33pm
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Whale, I guess what I'm looking for is the name of a good introduction course to political issues but it doesn't really look like it's going to be that simple. So I'm guessing I want to brush up on the history of our major political parties and their ideologies first. Got the name of a good book or it's online equivalent? EDIT- sorry for the old, oversized signature ------------- www.TexasPumpAndPistolGame.com www.pettyPb.com MCB:Chickun |