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Tonights debate

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Topic: Tonights debate
Posted By: SSOK
Subject: Tonights debate
Date Posted: 03 October 2012 at 9:49pm
I am shocked I am the one starting this. I might regret it.

I am not heavily watching it since I need to do homework. My only thoughts are:

Romney is talking/looking better than Obama.

On the subject of taxes, Romney looked better than Obama.

There was one part where Mitt was talking and I was watching Obamas face. I thought it was kinda funny because he looked kinda annoyed with mitt then had to throw on a big fake smile. Made me laugh.

Also, I heard the redneck prhase of the day. "I bought a case of beer last night and drank it obamaself".


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Replies:
Posted By: agentwhale007
Date Posted: 03 October 2012 at 10:31pm
Romney did very well in this debate. It'll bounce his campaign back some, I do think. I don't think Obama did poorly, I just think Romney did exceptionally well. And with his slumping pools, he needed this. 

This is my one big point: This was a really, really clean debate. It didn't get petty like I thought it got in 2008 a little bit. Maybe it was because this one was pretty much all economic, not social issues, but everything stayed above the belt.  


Posted By: stratoaxe
Date Posted: 03 October 2012 at 10:48pm
Originally posted by agentwhale007 agentwhale007 wrote:

Romney did very well in this debate. It'll bounce his campaign back some, I do think. I don't think Obama did poorly, I just think Romney did exceptionally well. And with his slumping pools, he needed this. 

This is my one big point: This was a really, really clean debate. It didn't get petty like I thought it got in 2008 a little bit. Maybe it was because this one was pretty much all economic, not social issues, but everything stayed above the belt.  


It was not only clean, but informative. They're not talking down to people.



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Posted By: SSOK
Date Posted: 03 October 2012 at 10:53pm
I watched the end and a few of my favorite things were Romney saying something like "and poor kids... I mean err underprivileged kids" and "Mr. President, you are entitled to your own house and your own plane, but not your own facts". Obama also looked... grumpy.

Overall, I still don't like either of them. I think Romney will sink our education system, and I think Obamacare is a crappy attempt at healthcare. I want socialized healthcare or private, not some hybrid mess. I also think Obama will make some second term attack on the Second Amendment, and Romney is the only chance in the foreseeable future that I might get a chance to CCW in my own state.


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Posted By: jmac3
Date Posted: 03 October 2012 at 11:27pm
Second term attack on the second amendment? HAHAHAHA

Please tell me more about this.

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Que pasa?




Posted By: stratoaxe
Date Posted: 04 October 2012 at 1:11am
Originally posted by jmac3 jmac3 wrote:

Second term attack on the second amendment? HAHAHAHA

Please tell me more about this.


While I don't personally see it happening, I don't think that it's a completely illogical idea.

By sheer tradition the democrats stand to lose 8 years of the presidency if Obama wins in 2012 (which I believe he will.) Obama's first term was almost shockingly light on social reform here on the domestic front. It's one of the key reasons you'll read from left wing commentators as to why he gets such a lukewarm response from his own party.

The only reason I could think of as to why he hasn't pushed social issues is to keep from alienating moderates in his re-election bid.

Otherwise there are some hot button issues he's been strangely shy on (aka gay rights.)

That said, he never ran as a liberal, and honestly I don't think he's a major gun control pusher. I'd say Obama is far more moderate than he's given credit for, and in fact it seemed like he and Romney struggled to disagree with each other tonight.

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Posted By: FreeEnterprise
Date Posted: 04 October 2012 at 8:04am
Originally posted by agentwhale007 agentwhale007 wrote:

I don't think Obama did poorly, 


hahahhaa. 

Obama did exactly as I expected him to do when forced to face facts. He strawmanned Romneys plan and got called on it, over and over and over. 

Course, he couldn't fall back on his OWN plan as he is an utter failure. 5 trillion in new debt and for what? A double dip recession, more unemployment, more underemployment. And massive increases in health care when he promised those costs would go down. 

Obama is only good at picking losers. But, it is what is expected from liberals. They have good intentions you know, but they never pan out...


As far as his "gun control" ideology. It is pretty clear to anyone who doesn't have their head in the mud that Obama wanted to "skew" the numbers by pushing American guns into Mexican drug lords hands so he could crack down on gun sales in the US. As there is no other logical reason that I have heard as to why they were allowing thousands of guns to be purchased in that way in fast and furious...

I wish the government would get out of the "news" business (npr), and the propaganda of our kids with PBS. We have enough liberal talking points daily. Course it is ironic that we borrow from a communist nation to fund our communist propaganda programming...

Good intentions or something. 

Love how Obama said "if you choose me, it will be a harder job and a longer road". 

Ok, lets choose Romney and skip the double dip recession Obama will put us in with his failed policies?!?


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They tremble at my name...


Posted By: agentwhale007
Date Posted: 04 October 2012 at 8:51am
Originally posted by stratoaxe stratoaxe wrote:

 

It was not only clean, but informative. They're not talking down to people.


That was a good point as well. The general complaint about Obama's performance was that he was "professorial," as opposed to his normal sort of charismatic thing. I can see how that becomes a less-effective approach in a debate. 

Originally posted by SSOK SSOK wrote:

I watched the end and a few of my favorite things were Romney saying something like "and poor kids... I mean err underprivileged kids"

I could envision Romney's debate handler screaming at the monitor on that one. 

But this one:

Quote and "Mr. President, you are entitled to your own house and your own plane, but not your own facts". Obama also looked... grumpy.

Probably more than made up for it. That was a good zinger. 

Quote I think Obamacare is a crappy attempt at healthcare. I want socialized healthcare or private, not some hybrid mess. 
 

I think Obama didn't do enough in the debate to be like the kid in those anti-marijuana ads from the late 1970s. I LEARNED IT FROM YOU, MITT. 

He pushed the slightest bit on it, and Romney's response was "Well, in Massachusetts the bill was bipartisan." Well, yeah. Republicans in Massachusetts had the probably correct mindset that they were outnumbered, so it was better to help craft the legislation into something they could somewhat agree with than just get steamrolled. 

That's a bullet I thought Obama didn't load quite enough. I don't know what the strategy behind that was. 

(Also I agree with your sentiments on the HCRA, I'm just speaking from a campaign manager point of view). 




Posted By: Lightningbolt
Date Posted: 04 October 2012 at 8:51am
Does anyone recall what obama did immediately following his inauguration to upset his voter base? The dems were very upset for like a whole week. I'm alluding to the short attention span of this nation.

Thanks for reminding people about romneycare whale.
It's just seems so convenient how people forget things sometimes.


Posted By: agentwhale007
Date Posted: 04 October 2012 at 8:56am
Originally posted by stratoaxe stratoaxe wrote:


That said, he never ran as a liberal, and honestly I don't think he's a major gun control pusher

Pretty much, yeah.

SSOK's right in the sense that if he were to try some sort of Federal or state-pushed reform for gun control, early-as-possible in the second term is when he's going to do it, simply to just not have it hurt the chances of the new Democrat behind Obama, whomever that ends up being. 

But, I agree with you. I don't think it's anything he's big on. And I certainly don't think it ends up being a talking point of the debates. 


Posted By: Lightningbolt
Date Posted: 04 October 2012 at 9:03am
Did anyone catch santorum on letterman last night? Dodgey comedian comes to mind.


Posted By: FreeEnterprise
Date Posted: 04 October 2012 at 9:38am

Obama wouldn't even LOOK up when being addressed... 

Then when he did talk, he wouldn't look at the camera. Course lying makes people less likely to make eye contact...


I wonder if epic butt kicking is covered under Obamacare?...



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They tremble at my name...


Posted By: Ceesman762
Date Posted: 04 October 2012 at 10:04am
FE, are you wearing a Snuggie while watching the debate?

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Innocence proves nothing
FUAC!!!!!




Posted By: Reb Cpl
Date Posted: 04 October 2012 at 10:09am
Originally posted by SSOK SSOK wrote:

. I also think Obama will make some second term attack on the Second Amendment, and Romney is the only chance in the foreseeable future that I might get a chance to CCW in my own state.


You know- this might not be so far out in left field as some might think.
License applications in my state (NY) are all done completely electronically now. I don't know how long the processes actually TAKE- but when I submitted my paperwork.....they were backlogged SIX MONTHS.

Mine went on top of a pile that would best measured in feet not inches.

Our county is not that big- and you're telling me that enough enough of our population is filing for licenses all at once that you're backed up so badly? Why?

Could it be that the bulk of license applications are being held up in anticipation of something? Like some changes in the application process? Consider too that the background investigations go through federal levels, not just state and local. There could be a bottleneck at some level that even the local LE offices don't know about for some reason or other.

Related perhaps to DHS purchasing several billion rounds of 5.56mm ammunition?

I don't buy conspiracy issues much, but the part of me that doesn't trust the people in charge anymore has plenty of free time to wonder.


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Posted By: Ceesman762
Date Posted: 04 October 2012 at 10:15am
^^^Rifle, handgun and shotgun sales are up at my local shops.^^^^

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Innocence proves nothing
FUAC!!!!!




Posted By: Lightningbolt
Date Posted: 04 October 2012 at 10:43am
Again, near election time the gun club isn't accepting applications for membership.full


Posted By: Ceesman762
Date Posted: 04 October 2012 at 10:47am
Originally posted by Lightningbolt Lightningbolt wrote:

Again, near election time the gun club isn't accepting applications for membership.full

I had stopped in at a local shop/dealer recently and he was saying how many AR and AK platforms are being ordered. Depending on the manufacturer, many are back ordered nearly 2 months or more.


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Innocence proves nothing
FUAC!!!!!




Posted By: SSOK
Date Posted: 04 October 2012 at 11:07am
I should have said I think it isn't out of the question that Obama may push something anti 2A.

There are a lot of people out there (read the NRA's American Rifleman) that believe Obama/Hitlery/Nazi Pelosi are comin to take der guhns! Through some evil second term amendment or something, or even using the UN to force registration of everything and blocking the sales on ammo. What I think may (stong word there) happen in a second Obama term:

An increase in taxes on ammo and possibly guns, and blocking the online sale of ammo. Considering the James Holmes thing, now is the best time to block online sales. 

A roadblock to the national CCW movement going on right now. Gun sales are skyrocketing right now and a lot of people are looking to carry. A lot of people from the different gun culture in other states have traveled to NJ/NY with valid CCW licenses for their home state and got arrested. Many of them are also being let off the hook because NJ/NY doesn't want the spotlight on them. 

Possible new 1994 AWB. 


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Posted By: FreeEnterprise
Date Posted: 04 October 2012 at 11:51am
Things that stood out to me in the debate. 

Obama crying to the mod to "move this along". 

Obama commenting on "aircrafts", another "corPSman" blunder, as aircraft is plural, and "aircrafts" is a destruction of the English language... Course if English was your second language... 

The media dying and falling over behind the curtain and disrupting the debate was humorous. 

Plus the polling that came out this morning that 47% don't care how bad Obama did, they are still voting for him no matter what. 

To that I really did laugh out loud. 







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They tremble at my name...


Posted By: Lightningbolt
Date Posted: 04 October 2012 at 11:59am
Nukyaluhr


Posted By: FreeEnterprise
Date Posted: 04 October 2012 at 12:05pm
algore blamed "man made climate change" on Obama's performance... HAHAHhahhaa

http://www.weeklystandard.com/blogs/gores-blames-altitude-obamas-debate-woes_653613.html" rel="nofollow - http://www.weeklystandard.com/blogs/gores-blames-altitude-obamas-debate-woes_653613.html

If only they hadn't made him perform at 5,000 feet above sea level when his body hadn't adapted to it yet... or something. 


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They tremble at my name...


Posted By: agentwhale007
Date Posted: 04 October 2012 at 12:10pm
Originally posted by SSOK SSOK wrote:

I should have said I think it isn't out of the question that Obama may push something anti 2A.

It's not out of the realm of possibility, but I still don't think it'd be likely, even in a second term. 


Posted By: agentwhale007
Date Posted: 04 October 2012 at 12:15pm
Originally posted by Reb Cpl Reb Cpl wrote:


Our county is not that big- and you're telling me that enough enough of our population is filing for licenses all at once that you're backed up so badly? Why?

Gun companies give a lot of money to organizations like the NRA to send out mass-mailers, buy commercial spots, etc., on the topic of scary Democrats trying to take away your guns. 

In turn, people get spooked and go and buy a lot of firearms. 

It's really, really good money for gun companies for people to be afraid. 


Posted By: FreeEnterprise
Date Posted: 04 October 2012 at 12:21pm
Yeah, it doesn't have ANYTHING to do with the video from 07 of Obama trying to start a race war... Or the fact that everything Liberals have done has failed, and the economy is horrible, and crime is rampant. 

Naa, it is the NRA printing flyers or something...

I thought this story nailed it...

http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Journalism/2012/10/04/Romney-Humiliates-media" rel="nofollow - http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Journalism/2012/10/04/Romney-Humiliates-media

""Who is this guy?" tens of millions of American voters asked themselves last night. "This isn't the Mitt Romney the media's presented to me over the last six months?"

Free of the corrupt media's corrupt filter; free of the spin, the lying fact-checkers, the gotchas, and the desperate effort to cover up any and all bad news that might hurt Obama -- by every standard, every measure, every opinion and every opinion poll, what we witnessed last night at the first presidential debate of 2012 was a commanding, dominating blow-out performance by Governor Mitt Romney.

Last night the GOP contender showed up to kick butt and chew bubblegum, but unfortunately for  Barack Obama, Romney was all out of bubblegum. The real loser, though, was a corrupt mainstream media that had just spent months desperately crafting a Mitt Romney that doesn't exist -- a Mitt Romney voters would not find acceptable as president.

We've all seen what's happened month after month after month after month: Obama's Media Palace Guards have assured us that Romney can do nothing right and Obama can do nothing wrong. This carefully crafted media game-plan (coordinated openly with the Obama campaign) was meant to strip Romney of the single quality voters demand in a president, and that's competence.  If you're not competent you’re not an acceptable alternative, which means we're going to vote for "the devil we know."

But last night all of this blew up in the media's face, and this morning the American people trust the media even less than they did the night before -- and for one very simple reason: they were lied to … again. Where was the bumbling, elitist, out of touch, awkward, wife-killing, gay-hating, corporate vulture who tortures dogs and stumbles through Europe like Chevy Chase in a "Vacation" sequel?

Well, he didn’t show up last night because that's not who Mitt Romney is. That Mitt Romney is a media creation manufactured out of lies and desperation by those who spend 24 hours a day crafting trip wires, fabricating gaffes, and standing before the elephant of Barack Obama's failures and asking, "What elephant?"

For all of moderator Jim Lehrer's flaws last night, the 78 year-old semi-retired PBS newsman did the only thing we conservatives ask of the media: he mostly stayed out of the way and offered up a fairly level playing field. There were no gotcha questions and no,What about your gaaaaaffes? To his great credit (though he did try to rescue the president more than once), Lehrer kept the debate in an arena no liberal can win in --and that's on the issues.

Unlike his cretin colleagues, Lehrer was actually interested in the issues that matter. So he asked about taxes, job creation, education, the deficit, and an overall governing philosophy. In other words, he didn't stack the deck to distract away from what a horrible philosophy big government liberalism really is. With a rare opportunity like this, if you’re smart, prepared and all out of bubblegum, a conservative can win any debate. Obviously, Mitt Romney not only won last night, he delivered the kind of satisfying drubbing to Barack Obama we conservatives have been waiting four years to savor.

Yes, someone finally was given and took full advantage of the opportunity to point to that little emperor and say to the world, "Look, he's naked!"

And now the lying, biased, corrupt, degenerate mainstream media has a problem on its hands. Because now the whole world knows that they were not only pointing to clothes that didn’t exist but also attempting to destroy anyone who dared cry "Naked!"

In ninety short but delicious and unforgettable minutes, Mitt Romney not only exposed President FailureTeleprompter as the churlish, entitled failure he truly is -- he also destroyed the caricature our thoroughly corrupted media institutions had built around him.  

Romney's commanding victory was Reaganesque, and so is the result. In 1980, the media did everything in its power to  scare voters away from Ronald Reagan by portraying him as a scary warmonger. But during his first and only debate with then-President Jimmy Carter, Reagan proved the media a liar."



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They tremble at my name...


Posted By: Reb Cpl
Date Posted: 04 October 2012 at 12:25pm
Originally posted by agentwhale007 agentwhale007 wrote:

Originally posted by Reb Cpl Reb Cpl wrote:


Our county is not that big- and you're telling me that enough enough of our population is filing for licenses all at once that you're backed up so badly? Why?

Gun companies give a lot of money to organizations like the NRA to send out mass-mailers, buy commercial spots, etc., on the topic of scary Democrats trying to take away your guns. 

In turn, people get spooked and go and buy a lot of firearms. 

It's really, really good money for gun companies for people to be afraid. 


I don't know. I still don't buy that there's enough applicants in our county registering for pistol applications all at once because they get nervous about mailings.

If someone's smart enough to go through NY's application process in its entirety, they've got to be smart enough to see through the BS that extremist organizations will spout.
There's a hold-up more than an influx, I'm almost positive.


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Posted By: agentwhale007
Date Posted: 04 October 2012 at 12:27pm
Originally posted by FreeEnterprise FreeEnterprise wrote:

the economy is horrible,

Digging the nugget of truth from the trough of silly, there is a connection between economic downturns and firearm sales, which is most likely a confounding variable of the growth of crime during economic downturns. 

I don't think it's responsible for widespread buying spikes right before elections, but it is interesting, none-the-less. 


Posted By: agentwhale007
Date Posted: 04 October 2012 at 12:27pm
Originally posted by Reb Cpl Reb Cpl wrote:


I don't know. I still don't buy that there's enough applicants in our county registering for pistol applications all at once because they get nervous about mailings.

Ohhh. Were you asking why there is a backup to begin with?




Posted By: FreeEnterprise
Date Posted: 04 October 2012 at 12:35pm
Originally posted by agentwhale007 agentwhale007 wrote:

 

Digging the nugget of truth from the trough of silly,


Always classy whale, lemme guess, this teacher is your role model?...

http://www.nbcphiladelphia.com/news/politics/Romney-High-School-T-Shirt-Flap-172627871.html" rel="nofollow - http://www.nbcphiladelphia.com/news/politics/Romney-High-School-T-Shirt-Flap-172627871.html


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They tremble at my name...


Posted By: tallen702
Date Posted: 04 October 2012 at 12:44pm
Originally posted by FreeEnterprise FreeEnterprise wrote:

I wonder if epic butt kicking is covered under Obamacare?...


Dennis Miller called, he's ordering you to cease and desist with stealing his craptastic jokes from his twitter feed.

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<Removed overly wide sig. Tsk, you know better.>


Posted By: Reb Cpl
Date Posted: 04 October 2012 at 1:00pm
Originally posted by agentwhale007 agentwhale007 wrote:

Originally posted by Reb Cpl Reb Cpl wrote:


I don't know. I still don't buy that there's enough applicants in our county registering for pistol applications all at once because they get nervous about mailings.

Ohhh. Were you asking why there is a backup to begin with?




Eh- more pointing out that there IS one than asking 'why' because dark conspiracy is more fun than assuming an enhanced interest in 2nd amendment practices or lazy law enforcement offices.

 


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Posted By: impulse418
Date Posted: 04 October 2012 at 1:36pm
Didn't watch the debate, but someone mentioned it mostly pertained to the economy?

I don't see much of debate then. Both are pro big government. How can either canidate help promote economic growth? They should of focused on wedge issues, would of been more entertaining to watch.

Paul/Schiff


Posted By: stratoaxe
Date Posted: 04 October 2012 at 2:41pm
I grew up a pretty avid shooter and I can remember every election season the NRA would send out their warning letters and BAM!-ammo is sold out around the country and prices have doubled. It's like a stock outlook for guns...invest every fourth November.

In fact the NRA has been rather quiet under this president...if I recall the best they've had to work with has been that farce of a UN treaty and actually pointing out the suspicious nature of Obama NOT talking about gun control.

That said, I have no doubt that the local suppliers believe what they say. It's the manufacturers that I believe are gouging / shorting supply.

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Posted By: agentwhale007
Date Posted: 05 October 2012 at 6:26pm
Originally posted by Reb Cpl Reb Cpl wrote:

 
Eh- more pointing out that there IS one 

Ah, I gotcha. 

At its core, I wonder how many people are ultimately in charge of reading and approving those applications. 


Posted By: Mack
Date Posted: 07 October 2012 at 11:50am
Originally posted by agentwhale007 agentwhale007 wrote:

Romney did very well in this debate. It'll bounce his campaign back some, I do think. I don't think Obama did poorly, I just think Romney did exceptionally well. And with his slumping pools, he needed this. 

This is my one big point: This was a really, really clean debate. It didn't get petty like I thought it got in 2008 a little bit. Maybe it was because this one was pretty much all economic, not social issues, but everything stayed above the belt.  


Oddly, I had pretty much the opposite view.  Romney performed as I expected.  He came across as professional and prepared.  President Obama did much worse than I expected.  (Whale may have hit the nail on the head with a later comment about a "professorial" approach but I think there was more to it.)  He came across as having come into the debate expecting to be held to a lower standard because he is the incumbent and apparent favorite.  I really think he expected Romney to show up unprepared and all he thought he would need to do to be declared the winner is throw out some platitudes and smile a bit.  (He just seemed really unprepared and there is really no excuse for it - even if he felt for some reason that this was going to be an automatic win, somebody in his campaign should have known better.)

Back to the professorial approach:  One of the main problems I have with liberal politicians is that they all tend to come across as if they know what is best for everyone else (which tends to come across as condescending and having a lack of respect for their constituents), this approach doesn't help avoid this.


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