Really...that entitled?
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Topic: Really...that entitled?
Posted By: oldsoldier
Subject: Really...that entitled?
Date Posted: 05 March 2014 at 9:07am
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Your opinions on that NJ case where the 18 year old who moved out of the house according to the parents because she felt like she did not have to follow any parental 'rules' anymore living in their house. Now she wants 'support' from the parents as well as college paid for etc. What is the exact 'move out' scenario is still a question, but again as a parent if you do not respect the 'rules' and frustrate and threaten the overall 'home' environment, what are my options anymore. You want to be an adult at 18 and feel the 'rules' no longer apply to you, you are on your own, Basic child rearing 101, for those who are still too young here to deal with this as parents, this case will have a great effect on how your 'kids' can 'rule' your home. My opinion is simple, under my roof my rules, if not and you want to move out, best of luck to you the bank of 'dad' is now closed. ------------- 
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Replies:
Posted By: Eville
Date Posted: 05 March 2014 at 9:14am
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I would be shocked and disappointed if this goes in her favor. That being said, I don't know anything about the situation other than what I read in a headline. ------------- 
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Posted By: Mack
Date Posted: 05 March 2014 at 10:12am
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I don't know anything beyond what I read in the article but the way I see it, she's 18. That makes her an adult and anything that parents provide once someone is an adult is a courtesy or gift, not required as a parent. Edited Addition: She needs to grow the heck up. ------------- 
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Posted By: rednekk98
Date Posted: 05 March 2014 at 5:47pm
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As a teacher, and someone who is saddled with a goodly amount of student loan debt, my sympathy is seriously lacking for this girl who already has a $20k scholarship, and last I heard a judge basically told her to go kick rocks. But it's in my nature to try to see the other sides of these issues. Let's say her parents had divorced, and know many people who were able to force a parent to legally provide college assistance. It sounds like they cut her off when she was still 17 (or she moved out or whatever) and she might have some form of argument to make here. When applying for federal loans, your parents income is considered, the feds make assumptions that your parents will contribute. Nothing says they are required to, but their income level can push you towards more restrictive and expensive private loans. Same with insurance, you can now stay on a parents plan until you are 26, your parents can still drop you, leaving you to buy insurance through the school, and probably pay for it with a federal loan, and to qualify, you need to maintain full-time status. Kinda hard to do that and totally fend for yourself. I took the option of buying insurance through school since it was $800 a year and my loans could be applied towards it, while buying it outright through a state exchange was over $2.4K That option was the only feasible one for me, but I'm paying interest on being insured for those years, and took a bunch of unnecessary classes to maintain full-time status because classes I needed weren't always offered, and it cost me more than an extra year of schooling. I'd recommend this girl suck it up and look into a community college with good transfer compacts with 4-year schools. It still blows my mind that US students end up with so much debt compared to peers in the rest of the English-speaking world. It really does limit economic action. Recent grads could be putting that money back into the economy, buying a new entry-level car, using it to relocate to a place with decent jobs instead of ending up with a business degree, $90k in debt and tending bar. Instead the money goes back to write more loans. It was a lot easier for me to pick up a teaching job in Asia with benefits than to relocate within the US to areas that really could use teachers. If my bills weren't so high, I would have had many more options. Even had I still done the Asia thing, I could have gone to a few places with lower cost of living and a bit less pay, banked my cash and saved enough to buy a car or down payment on a starter home within a few years. It's a dumb situation that lenders (including the gov't)are the ones getting so much of the economic action of this generation when we could instead by buying stuff that helps create the jobs we don't have. |
Posted By: oldsoldier
Date Posted: 05 March 2014 at 6:42pm
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An interesting take. Let's look at other options. Based on my service I received the old GI Bill and recently due to my 100% service connected wounds and injuries I have $0.00 in debt from finishing the degree. My kids now again based on my disability get through Nebraska a 100% paid tuition to any Nebraska University and/or community college, plus through the Federal "Chapter' my dependent kids get a monthly stipend of $1100.00 as long as they are 'fulltime. Anna my youngest and stepdaughter is at University of Nebraska (Lincoln) on this program...graduates in 4 years $0.00 debt. Now what was the cost of all this, service to the nation in exchange for the benefit. I really have no sympathy for those complaining about student debt as there are ways to aliviate them. National Guard or Reserve duty will get you benefits as well as a good paying 'part time' job. Yet few takers. -------------
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Posted By: rednekk98
Date Posted: 05 March 2014 at 7:45pm
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Which is great, but a majority of the population isn't fit for military service, and our armed forces don't need to be that large. I'd be all for programs that involve public service of some type in exchange for a full ride, though if you're wiling to risk life and limb your kids should be able to get benefits as well. You could make a strong argument that public subsidies for education would help our national security. Somebody needs to design and build the systems our soldiers use, I'd rather it be Americans, and eliminating the debt burden would also make selling state secrets a bit less appealing. Heck, I'd be fine if it expired if you went more than four years, or you had to repay in full if you dropped out or got kicked out of school. The arguments against public funding so often boil down to moral suppositions about personal responsibility and work ethic, which is a great thing to immediately dump on someone just entering society and an economy created by their predecessors. I guess I've just run into too many people who found themselves with degrees in an over-saturated field that all of the publications, guidance counselors and teaches were pushing when they were in high school, found themselves taking on too much debt, and upon graduation sold plasma to make ends meet, before leaving the country. |
Posted By: SSOK
Date Posted: 05 March 2014 at 8:23pm
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I actually laughed at this a lot.. The high school she is going to is filled with self entitled snobs and has a major drug problem. Was about 5 minutes from mine. ------------- 
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Posted By: agentwhale007
Date Posted: 06 March 2014 at 5:49pm
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This whole case is just odd from a legal standpoint. She's 18 but didn't emancipate herself when she was a minor(I don't think she can if she's already 18), so the legality of everything is just kinda weird. Her whole lawsuit is based on the premise of her parents continuing to pay tuition for her private high school AND pay for her college tuition and living expenses. If she was just saying that her parents have an obligation to get her through high school, I might be able to see the point of her lawsuit. But why add on the college part? If you're going to claim being legally separated, which you can do at 18, that's one thing, but you cannot then ask for money for college. It doesn't even really matter at that point if it was in a dedicated college fund for her, I don't think. Her parents are clearly legally able to remove the money from the college fund, albeit with one hell of a tax loss if it was something like a 529 Plan. It sounds a lot to me like a lawyer talked her into filing this civil case, which essentially is not able to be won. To an extent I almost feel bad for her, if that is the case. |
Posted By: agentwhale007
Date Posted: 06 March 2014 at 5:52pm
To be fair, she claims she left because of verbal and emotional abuse as well as threats of physical abuse. |
oldsoldier wrote:Posted By: tallen702
Date Posted: 06 March 2014 at 5:53pm
From what I've read, the lawyer representing her is the father of the friend who she is staying with (ie. she is currently living under his roof). Which makes me wonder if he's not doing it to get her out of his hair in a "Sure, I'll take your case pro bono (so that when you lose, you'll realize how stupid you've been and move back in with your folks)" scenario if you would. But who knows. She doesn't have a leg to stand on. Parents are claiming that she willingly left home, that they didn't actually kick her out. ------------- <Removed overly wide sig. Tsk, you know better.> |
Posted By: jmac3
Date Posted: 11 March 2014 at 1:04am
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I just actually got mad at OS for saying all his kids earned free college for his service. What service did your kids complete to get a debt free college? Absolutely none. You earned college for yourself. Seeing as how you still ride dirtbikes and aren't a double amputee paraplegic I find it silly you think they deserve it. ------------- Que pasa? 
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Posted By: Salvation
Date Posted: 11 March 2014 at 1:44am
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Jmac, Are you serious? Just because someone has a disability, doesnt mean they are incapable of physical activities. I have seen people play paintball in wheel chairs and a Marine double amputee play. Does that mean he doesnt deserve disability? Does his family have to suffer because while he may be physically capable of certain activities he may not be able to find a job that he can be successful at and provide for his family due to the same disability? Or prove to challenging for his potential employer to provide the tools for for their success. It also not just physical disabilities that affect our service members there are mental ones as well. PTSD has been over looked in conflicts in the past, but its a major issue today. Its not even PTSD necessarily that causes the issues its many of the symptoms associated with it that do. You might be upset at OldSoldiers benefits of service but I'm willing to bet that it came at a great cost to him and his family. I would encourage you to think about the situation a little bit more before making your final judgement on the matter. Kev |
Posted By: jmac3
Date Posted: 11 March 2014 at 1:56am
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Yes I am serious. Why does OS's kids deserve free college because one parent is disabled? They have another parent to provide for the family. I never said OS doesn't deserve anything. I grew up with neither parent raised by just my grandmother and I'm not entitled to free college. She raised me and my sister. The worst part is I've seen OS on this very forum talk about entitlements, and even this very thread is about it. ------------- Que pasa?
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Posted By: Eville
Date Posted: 11 March 2014 at 4:16am
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Both of my parents worked their entire lives and couldn't afford to send 3 kids to college, and they were big on saving. Why should OS's kids be denied college because their dad was disabled from his military service? -------------
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Posted By: oldsoldier
Date Posted: 11 March 2014 at 7:51am
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When you sign that contract with the government for certain future benefits that you earn for an exchange of your military service, it is part of the total package. I earned college for my kids based on my service and the service connected disabilities from that service. Those who can not understand why they are not entitled for similar benefits for no exchange of service, that is the issue. Getting something for nothing, a feeling of entitlement. As for my disabilities, define disabilities. My options are pretty simple, enjoy the rest of my life to the best of my ability, and function, or sit in a chair take drugs and die. -------------
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Posted By: usafpilot07
Date Posted: 11 March 2014 at 8:06am
My biggest disagreement with this is much as OS's response says. I don't think it's an entitlement if it is guaranteed in your employment "contract," as it were. Plenty of employers offer unique benefits to their employees. If the military doesn't want to offer that as a benefit to new recruits, just don't offer it. But don't try and take it away from those you already promised it to. ------------- Buffalo buffalo Buffalo buffalo buffalo buffalo Buffalo buffalo |
Posted By: Mack
Date Posted: 11 March 2014 at 11:11am
While I disagree with JMac3 in this thread, I think you misunderstand what he is saying. (Or you just phrased your response really poorly.) He doesn't seem to have a problem with OS having earned benefits for himself. More to the point, he doesn't think that OS's kids should be denied college because OS is disabled from military service. He just doesn't think OS's children are entitled to benefit's that OS isn't using because OS, not the children, earned those benefits. As for the benefits themselves, USAF covered the point well, but I will add this. Part of the reason for the ability to use such military disability benefits to aid one's children's education is to compensate for the aid the parent in question would have provided, had that parent not been disabled and rendered less capable of providing that aid. -------------
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Posted By: SSOK
Date Posted: 11 March 2014 at 11:25am
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Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't OS' kids entitled to free college regardless of disability or not? I believe I would have had my tuition waived if my dad was still in or retired after 20. Also, OS, weren't you NYC LEO post Vietnam? -------------
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Posted By: usafpilot07
Date Posted: 11 March 2014 at 11:28am
I thought the GI Bill was kind of a one-hit wonder, regardless of who(veteran, dependant, etc) used it? I know my brother-in-law debated whether to save his for my nephew. ------------- Buffalo buffalo Buffalo buffalo buffalo buffalo Buffalo buffalo |
Posted By: evillepaintball
Date Posted: 11 March 2014 at 2:56pm
This is what I was getting at, it was just really early in the morning. ------------- 
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Posted By: oldsoldier
Date Posted: 11 March 2014 at 3:42pm
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Once again, the benefits. I finished my degree between the 'old' GI Bill, and then VA Vocational Rehabilitation Program once I could not work in my trained field. As part of the 'contract' if the veteran is rated 100% service connected disabled, which I am, the dependents of that veteran will receive certain VA education Benefits, usually a monthly stipe end and cost assistance, and then the State of Nebraska pays 100% of tuition to a Nebraska University or Community College as long as veteran and student are Nebraska residents. Mitch in Arizona only gets the VA stipe-end and costs, so he has to use the stipe end to 'pay' for tuition at the Arizona school. He 'quit' the Nebraska program to chase a skirt to Arizona, so he will have some college debt, Anna last daughter is using the full Federal as well as State programs, essentially 'free', essentially no debt on graduation. After leaving the Army after 23years, did work NYPD for awhile. -------------
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Posted By: tallen702
Date Posted: 13 March 2014 at 10:29am
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So, there's an update on the original topic of this thread: http://www.foxnews.com/us/2014/03/12/new-jersey-teen-who-sued-parents-returns-home/" rel="nofollow - She's back home but apparently the lawsuit is still on. I think she now realizes that she's not going to win at the very least and is hoping to patch things up before the suit shuts her out forever. ------------- <Removed overly wide sig. Tsk, you know better.> |
Posted By: Mack
Date Posted: 13 March 2014 at 10:44am
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I wouldn't have let her come home. Not being mean, I just think she needs to learn a lesson. It would have been tough love. -------------
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Posted By: Reb Cpl
Date Posted: 13 March 2014 at 10:46am
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I really think that she was sleeping with the friend's dad to be honest. The guy is a lawyer and he was fronting the dough for the lawsuit? Who does that and why? The only reason I can think of is a bit inappropriate.
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Posted By: oldsoldier
Date Posted: 13 March 2014 at 11:14am
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And this move back in will work out 'well', the parents are setting themselves up and have no clue. I could never trust her and the potentials of 'trouble' from her are endless...Daddy beat me, here comes the social workers and courts as she 'gets even', and that syster Lawyer, I'm with Reb, bettin he dipped the wick in the well. In my world you make the I can make it on my own comment, best of luck to ya, let me know how it all turns out. All my kids did it, now understand it and we are back on 'good' terms, but the never got and will never get the move back in invitation (unless some catastrophic event) -------------
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Posted By: Ceesman762
Date Posted: 13 March 2014 at 11:25am
Agreed. ------------- Innocence proves nothing FUAC!!!!! |
Posted By: Mack
Date Posted: 13 March 2014 at 12:23pm
I disagree . . . I think he is just a typical liberal* who thinks everyone should be able to live how they want on other people's money without having to actually work and earn anything for themselves. /sarcasm *Yes, I went there.  -------------
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Posted By: Lightningbolt
Date Posted: 14 March 2014 at 6:52am
| She needs to do her homework, clean her room, clean up her dishes and take the garbage out... |
Posted By: StormyKnight
Date Posted: 14 March 2014 at 3:20pm
Fixed. Sarcasm unnecessary. ------------- 
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Posted By: Reb Cpl
Date Posted: 15 March 2014 at 7:44am
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USA TODAY had an article, this little twit is back home, but is looking to file as 'non-emancipated' and get $654 a week from her parents in financial support, plus still force them to pay upcoming college tuition. ------------- ? |
Posted By: Mack
Date Posted: 15 March 2014 at 9:54am
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^^^ When she graduates high school, I'd throw her the heck out.
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Posted By: oldsoldier
Date Posted: 15 March 2014 at 10:26am
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If a judge folds on this it will be the end of parenthood and the teenagers across the country are now in charge. I really don't think any judge is that crazy, but it is NJ. And the parents letting her back in are crazy, and really did not see this coming? PLEASE are this generation of parents that out of touch? If I were the parents just to PO here lawyer, rack up a ton of credit card debt, declare bankruptcy, and tell Dear Daughter, suck on it see you in 7 years. -------------
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Posted By: Dazed
Date Posted: 16 March 2014 at 4:20pm
| As the parents, I'd be hard pressed not to quit my job and move out of the country, or convert to the Amish way of life. |