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C98+HPA+Palmers=Low velocity |
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spudcrazy 
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Joined: 14 July 2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 363 |
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 Topic: C98+HPA+Palmers=Low velocityPosted: 06 November 2005 at 9:35pm |
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Okay...I played for the first time, since I've gotten my HPA tank. With the CO2, I never had a problem with LOW velocity. I could actually crank my Palmer down to 700psi and get a very consistant 280fps. Today, with my HPA, I chrono'd in and couldn't get higher than 260fps and that was with my Palmer set as high as it could go (all the way in) and my velocity screw was flush with the powertube, as it normally was with CO2. It was suggested that I get a stiffer bolt spring (Madmann Spring Kit). Would this help bring my velocity back up? I keep my gun oiled and in mint condition, so I know that's not the problem. My gun isn't that old, but I have put about 6 or so cases of paint through it. Could it be the springs need replacing? Any help on this subject is appreciated. Bruce Frank, I'm sure you know what's going on, since you're an advocate for HPA. Any thoughts???? |
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baconking
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Joined: 06 September 2005 Status: Offline Points: 110 |
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Posted: 06 November 2005 at 9:51pm |
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yea, a heavier maddmann drive spring would get your velocity higher, but i dont know whats wrong with it.
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98C
2X Trigger 14" All American Response Trigger Maddmann Spring Kit Ricochet AK Pmi N2 Tank Palmer Direct Stab Al Tube+ F Bolt Rufus Dawg Center Feed Custom Milling Custom Paint Many Mods |
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You Wont See Me
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Found in Big Al’s underwear drawer Joined: 02 December 2003 Location: Neutral Zone Status: Offline Points: 13335 |
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Posted: 06 November 2005 at 9:52pm |
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Yeah, get a madmann spring kit.
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baconking
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Posted: 06 November 2005 at 9:56pm |
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i had the same problem, except the opposite. i couldnt get my velocity down low enough. i had the velocity screw all the way in and everything. so i just bought the maddmann spring kit, put in the lighter drive spring, and now i have my velocity back to normal.
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98C
2X Trigger 14" All American Response Trigger Maddmann Spring Kit Ricochet AK Pmi N2 Tank Palmer Direct Stab Al Tube+ F Bolt Rufus Dawg Center Feed Custom Milling Custom Paint Many Mods |
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Rambino
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I am even less fun in person Joined: 15 August 2002 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 16593 |
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Posted: 06 November 2005 at 10:41pm |
That may be part of the problem - when the screw is all the way in you may be choking it... Back it out a little bit and see if that helps. |
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spudcrazy
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Posted: 06 November 2005 at 11:41pm |
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^^^^^Actually, I went in a quarter turn at a time and it didn't seem to do anything. I'm stumped, other than trying a new bolt spring.
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DaddyLongLegs
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Posted: 07 November 2005 at 8:34am |
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It's the spring. Had exact same issue. Replace spring with heavy spring from Maddman or others.
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A-5
E-Grip LPK JCS Trigger Shocktec Drop Tippmann Reg JCS RVA Folding Stock 15+ BPS.... |
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Millslane
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Posted: 07 November 2005 at 11:17am |
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its not unsual that you get lower velosity when running HPA and a reg.
i can't quite put my finger on why High pressure HPA seems to be part of the low velosity problem, so i won't try to explain why. all i can say is that a regulator/stabalizer will only initially lower your velosity. you don't buy one to raise your velosity. they can't boost your previous maximum velosity. this isn't the first time i've heard of lower velosity with HPA and a reg. just try the spring kit, you aren't that far off so the spring should do it. |
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UV Halo
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Posted: 07 November 2005 at 12:20pm |
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Are the following assumptions true?
Your main spring is not old and/or compressed. You're using high output pressure tanks (fixed approx 800psi output, or adjustible set to about 800)), and not the low pressure output tanks. You're using a Male Palmer standard stabilizer (vice one with a LPA spring kit, or, the Fatty Stab (which is also LP). Your Bob Long gauge is hooked to the side output of the Palmer. If so, I recommend the following: What is the output pressure of the reg (read from the gauge)? Can you raise the output pressure via the adjustment screw? Can you lower it to zero? If so, what is the maximum output pressure you can raise it to? Test the tanks output pressure- it should be around 800 (some at 750, and some at 850). If you can get 700-800 PSI to the gun, then it's your spring. If you can't, it's your air system. |
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M98C- W/QwkStrpCut
Comp Air & Palmer Fatty Stab Gas-Thru Stock Lapco Sight Rail W/ADCO 30MM EDOT Qloader W/ CMS Freak SS W/Stif-Tip * Flatline * Armson Stealth |
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Bruce A. Frank
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Posted: 07 November 2005 at 12:40pm |
If you have a gauge on the output of the HPA tank and it is actually approximate 800 psi then I'd vote for a new spring as the first most likely fix. Even relatively new factory springs can become too soft too quickly. A couple of other tid-bits I have discovered, sometimes a freshly oiled (excessively on my part) Palmer will deliver low pressure for several hundred rounds. First time this happened I completely disassembled my Palmer to find no problems. Upon reassembly it continued to be low then suddenly jumped up to where it needed to be. Just to know what is actually going on, if you don't have them already, I would add a cylinder outbut pressure gauge and another gauge to show what is the Palmer output pressure. The regulator output pressure gauge tells me exactly what is happening with my marker. |
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spudcrazy
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Posted: 07 November 2005 at 1:52pm |
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UV Halo...to answer your questions... Main spring is not old, but like I said, several rounds have gone through the gun, so it may be worn. I DO have a female stab HP, like the sig line says...I DO have a HP output tank and a gauge on both the tank and the correct side of the reg. Bruce... I though of the oil thing (knowing how the reg works), so I did actually check it at chrono during lunch break, no change. I'm gonna try a stiff spring and see what happens. I'm assuming it will still recock with the stiffer spring, since recocking wasn't the problem. It could be (like you said) the original spring was loosing its tension, combined with the fact that I'm using HPA versus CO2. I know CO2 can still expand a bit in the valve, once it leaves the tank, thus creating the extra velocity, whereas HPA is stable throughout. I know the output of the tank is dead on at 800psi, because even with the reg all the way up, I was getting 800psi at the output of the reg. Thanks for the help. I will keep you all informed once I get the spring set and get to a chrono. Anyone know how a Chrony Chronograph is for paintball? I know they work great for my firearms.... |
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UV Halo
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Posted: 07 November 2005 at 7:21pm |
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So, it certainly looks like your main spring is the problem. Wow,
degradation after only several hundred rounds? That's pretty sad.
Now granted I never fired mine before putting the LPA kit in so, I never experienced the same problem. But, the LPA spring never seemed to get worse (it's since been replaced by the E-Bolt). i remember when Chrony chronographs were just about the only chronographs for paintball, so I can give a little bit of insight there. It's got great accuracy. However, it can be sensitive to the type of lighting you have (not a problem if you use the diffuser), and the fact that the sensor is downrange from the tip of the barrel (a little less than a foot) means that it can get splattered should you have a ball break, or even worse should somebody accidentally shoot the chrony. Personally, I recommend the paintball RADARchron. Since it's very portable and very accurate. |
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M98C- W/QwkStrpCut
Comp Air & Palmer Fatty Stab Gas-Thru Stock Lapco Sight Rail W/ADCO 30MM EDOT Qloader W/ CMS Freak SS W/Stif-Tip * Flatline * Armson Stealth |
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spudcrazy wrote: