Question for our resident po-pos

I'm not a law enforcement officer, but that action grabbed my attention as well.

I supposed it was because he needed to free up both of his hands to defend himself rather than responding to their approach with deadly force.

Just an idea.

hmmm... i've always thought that they may keep their weapons out if they feel that they are in danger.

obviously he was, and i'm surprised he'd holster his weapon back up instead of keeping it out and warning the guys that were coming at him.

I tend to agree with that, tallen, but this places the officer in the very difficult/dangerous situation of facing three assailants unarmed.

Was he perhaps in the process of transitioning to his baton, and they were too fast?  I wouldn't expect any officer to face this situation unarmed.

BUG. That kid should have some fresh holes.

Rambino wrote: I tend to agree with that, tallen, but this places the officer in the very difficult/dangerous situation of facing three assailants unarmed. Was he perhaps in the process of transitioning to his baton, and they were too fast? I wouldn't expect any officer to face this situation unarmed.

My guess is that he was indeed reaching for a less-lethal weapon or his radio. The problem with having a firearm out and three assailants who are obviously not afraid to attack and armed officer is that you're going to have to shoot all three of them, as they aren't going to stop regardless of one going down. All of them un-armed, and you're going to wind up losing your job and being sued into bankruptcy as well as cause hell for the entire force on top of it.

As it is, I guarantee the one that attempted to fire the weapon will get life in prison. The other two will be accessories to attempted second-degree murder on a police officer (carries extra time) as well as aggravated assault on a police officer and will wind up spending the rest of their formidable years in prison. At least the kid will have plenty of time to get his GED while in there. They'll try the 17 year old as an adult as well. he's too close to the line to get juvie-charges, especially considering the severity of his actions.

I'm suprised I wasn't reading about three teens with six fresh .45 holes in their chests.

That cop has a pair the size of the Epcot center.

Holstering a wepon as three people aproach you, all with rather unfriendly appearences?

 

Sometimes I just don't know...

My buddy is a Washington State Patrolman and I just read this to him and got an ear-full about how the officer acted accordingly. I wont make all of you live through it, but the short hand is this:

Three attackers closing in on an armed officer=turkey shoot *my words, not his*

If the sight of the weapon doesn't make you want to back down, a bullet will. As much as my buddy loves tazers, he agrees that being solo with 3 suspects would be a less than ideal time to use the tazer. If a  less-lethal weapon were to be chosen, pepper spray would have been it. However, one suspect made a motion similar to one reaching for a concealed weapon so that goes right out the window.

It is hard to tell from the story, but I have a hard time endorsing a policy that allows officers to open fire whenever three people head his way.  Versions of that scenario just happen far too often too have "shoot" be the official response.

If the baddies were basically charging him then I say fire away, but I didn't get that impression from the article at all.  Shooting has to be the last option for a PEACE officer.

My guess is that this officer misinterpreted the situation.

Rambino wrote:   Versions of that scenario just happen far too often too have "shoot" be the official response. If the baddies were basically charging him then I say fire away, but I didn't get that impression from the article at all.  Shooting has to be the last option for a PEACE officer.

I agree, but from the sounds of the story (and I realise this is a one sided account of the events) three people menacing a cop is a shoot situation.

As it played out it very nearly cost this cop his life.

I don't know the closing speeds of the badguys, or how much they crowded him, but from the story the suspects did something (reached for a possible weapon) which caused the cop to draw his firearm. This is SOP.

Not only did he draw his firearm he also tried to put distance between himself and the badguys. Again, this is not only SOP it is basic combat skills. You do not let three people who are non compliant and possibly threatening get in arms reach of you.

However if they were still refusing to comply, and they still hadn't shown the cop what they were reaching for and they were still advancing in a threatening manner, there is no need for him to put his gun away, unless it is inoperative.

It seems to me he followed the ladder of force as needed, verbal commands were interupted by the suspects actions to make the officer draw his firearm. THIS IS WHERE IT IS DOWN TO THE PERPS TO NOT GET SHOT.

When a cop draws his gun you can be fairly certain he's done it because he's in fear of his life. If you don't want to meet 9x19mm speeding death, STOP WHATEVER THE **unicorn** YOU ARE DOING!

As it is the cop holstered his weapon for some reason and the situation went **tulip** . Not only was he now in a contact fight with multiple opponents, one of them managed to access his firearm. This is B.A.D.

The exact reason he didn't drop them like they needed to be was probably his nagging thoughts "But they are unarmed" and "My department will **cup cake** me up the **fairy dust** like a 10c prostitute and hang me out to dry".

Both of those thoughts were brought on by this **lolipop**ing PC'dness that unarmed people aren't dangerous, that cops are pigs with guns who want to blatt everything in sight and that criminals are innocent until proven guilty.

These guys weren't criminals awaiting trial and able to be granted the benifit of the doubt, they were active attackers and they attempted to murder this cop. Unarmed people aren't not dangerous, they are just less dangerous than armed people, but not when they had the advantage of numbers, how long did they stay unarmed? And cops don't want to blatt everyone, but people must realise cops are there to firstly uphold the law, then protect themselves, then protect others. Cops have guns for a reason, to stop **tiara** like this happening to the people who put their lives on the line to protect others.

As for the bosses hanging his ass out to dry, this stems from the same BS politically correct mindset where people supply cops and others with the tools to use lethal force, and once they have they get treated like criminals, with no benifit of the doubt.

There are very very few cops who will gun someone down in cold blood. Those people don't become cops. Beat them maybe, but not shoot them.

Too much is erred on to the side of "protect the criminal in case we get sued". Bull**rainbow**ing-**dreamy date**You give a cop the equipment to protect himself, send him into situations where he may need to do just that and then don't support him 100% when he's had to.

Personally I'd have fired two rounds center mass to the biggest, nearest threat while backing up and trying to find more cover. If the badguys carried on advancing, wash, rinse, repeat.

It is only by the smallest margin of luck that this potentially lethal encounter didn't end up with a dead cop, a dead cop's gun on the streets and three murderers running around the strees with even less regard for people's lives.

KBK

Fixed for angry dumb rant. Honestly dude it's the interwebz take a chill pill and take this as your one and only get out of jail free card. Merry X-Mas Mod staff.


Edited by Evil Elvis - 17 November 2007 at 8:25pm

To everyone who said he's an idiot for not shooting them, he shouldn't have holstered, ect, if he did shoot them, we would all be against the cop right now, even if he did have a reasonable cause to do so. It's a double edged sword here, because think about if he did cap all 3 of them-one was a minor, and none of the 3 were armed. The didn't do anything yet except run at him, and he shot all three. He would probably be facing prison time right now.


Edited by Dye Playa - 17 November 2007 at 11:42am