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Securing the border.

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.Ryan View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote .Ryan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Securing the border.
    Posted: 16 May 2006 at 2:24pm
   So Bush is gonna send some National Guard down to help stop some of the illegals from crossing. He talked about technology use and what not but I don't know, didn't seem very solid to me. So, my question to you: How would you secure this nation's southern border?


   I personally would set up a number of guard/lookout stations. About every 8 miles or so with some light baracades in between and constant drone overflights and motion sensors and what not. I'd beef up the patrols to around 3 or 4 thousand with some good force multipliers and equip all troops/patrols with some less-than-lethal gear to deal with the non-heavily-armed drug smugglers, thinkin' tasers and pepperball guns. Have the regular patrols constantly running and have a fast reaction force with choppers or dune buggies and atvs, or all of the above to intercept the crossers that the drones and sensors miss. I'd also catalog those captured via finger prints and have like a three strike rule, at the end of which, they get jail time. I think if you could keep it up and do it well, it could work. Plus, it wouldn't be all that inhumane. In the background you could have a path-to-citizenship program that doesn't turn immagrints into endentured servents and a crack down on those employers that insiste(sp) on exploiting workers and giving them zero benefits and poor pay. It would take time, but I think it could resolve the problem. It'd be easier if we so streched out right now, but yeah.

You?


ps
  The northern border is pretty scary too, but all that would take is proper funding and implementation of the usual border laws. Not understating the problem up there, but it would be a much easier fix. Ports are pretty simple too, if they'd just do it.


Edited by .Ryan - 17 May 2006 at 2:44pm

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procarbinefreak View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote procarbinefreak Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 May 2006 at 2:30pm
i say we build a "great wall of 'merica"  
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Zesty Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 May 2006 at 2:33pm
If I was gonna try and keep immigrants from crossing illegally, this is what I would do:

I don't know how long the border is, so someone will have to back me up with that info. Either way, I would basically have a bunch of snipers with .50BMG's, posted in 2's, back to back along the border. I figure with the range of the .50cal, they could probably be spread a couple miles apart.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Reb Cpl Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 May 2006 at 2:35pm

Dig a huge ditch.

Fill it with fire.

?

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Benjichang Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 May 2006 at 2:42pm
Originally posted by Reb Cpl Reb Cpl wrote:

Dig a huge ditch.

Fill it with fire.

Hahaha. Firey ditches ftw.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ShortyBP Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 May 2006 at 3:13pm
We're talking a large-scale area here.

Your plan sounds nice... but would be ineffective given the large area involved.   I don't really have an effective answer, so instead I'll pick apart yours. . No offense... just my bits.

A guard tower every 8mi is a tall order to fill (244).   Constant drone overflights are burdensome, and while there are some UAVs in service, they cannot keep watch over the entire border constantly.
Three to four thousand total border agents is less than what we have now, and it's not nearly enough. Especially if implementing the 8mi tower bit. The border patrol today has 11,000 people... and it's still stretched miserably thin.
Less than lethal is pointless. Most border crossers are unarmed and non-violent. Those who are armed should be met with armed force.
Regular patrols are constantly running.
They already deploy helicopters, ATVs and 4x4s.
Three strike rule is pointless as putting them in jail is still a costly measure. What jail do you put them in? And for how long? Honestly, what jail in America is even large enough to handle such an amount of people?

-----------------------------------------------------

Fact is, I don't think we'll ever STOP the influx. The best we can hope for is to slow it down, and create enough of a disincentive to dissuade a few. You won't dissuade them all... but to dissuade a few is still a "victory".
While not entirely effective, and initially costly... a simple fence would be the first step. Will people find a way around them? Sure. But at least you're making them work for it, and not simply handing them the free entry card.
Vast increase in manpower. Border Patrol has equipment, they have skilled agents, they have some of the latest technology. But it's not enough. I support use of National Guard troops as a stopgap measure until more Agents are employed.

And that's about all you can do. Fence. And an increase in manpower with a parallel increase in equipment.

After that, it's out of our hands. More pressure should be applied on the Mexican Government to help out on their end, but it's not in their best interest, so they won't.

Firey ditch sounds great.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote oreomann33 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 May 2006 at 3:15pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Snake6 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 May 2006 at 3:19pm
I'm with freak. Great Wall of 'merica!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Tae Kwon Do Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 May 2006 at 3:19pm
ZOMG NUKE MEXICO FTW

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NotDaveEllis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 May 2006 at 3:21pm
Dig a moat, fill it with caniverous sharks with laser beams, profit.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote .Ryan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 May 2006 at 3:39pm
Ok Shorty, adjust the numbers then, lol. The pepperballs were more of a deterant than anything else too. I also disagree with your assertion that closing the boarders is impossible. Otherwise, I liked Colbert last night, "a fire-filled moat as with fireproof crocks"! Or something like that.


ps
  What about an altamatum on Mexico, stop encouraging and help us stop illegal immagration or we impose sanctions. Plus, we could add the carrot of financial help with creating jobs if they help us....The fact that we're a giant cop-out for them needs to be handled in some way or another.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Sammy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 May 2006 at 3:47pm


There we go.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote merc Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 May 2006 at 3:49pm
have bottle necks and invite people to them...then fill cargoplanes with people and drop them in africa...
saving the world, one warship at a time.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote .Ryan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 May 2006 at 4:06pm
Sammy, no autoturrets or landmines?

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ShortyBP Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 May 2006 at 4:26pm
Originally posted by .Ryan .Ryan wrote:

I also disagree with your assertion that closing the boarders is impossible.

Oh, it CAN be done. But at what cost and with how much effort? The idea is to close the border without "militarizing" it. Give it an endless budget, slap in minefields and recreate the 38th Parallel of Korea... one step closer to a closed border. And even with THAT, some will make it across.
Anything short of that, is nothing more than a simple hurdle.


Originally posted by .Ryan .Ryan wrote:

What about an altamatum on Mexico, stop encouraging and help us stop illegal immagration or we impose sanctions. Plus, we could add the carrot of financial help with creating jobs if they help us....The fact that we're a giant cop-out for them needs to be handled in some way or another.

Because then we'd be "meanies". And we're not allowed to be a "meanie". We're supposed to be nice, and fair, and humane, and understanding, and every other 'nicey' thing you can think of.   Sanctions on our "poor" neighbor wouldn't be looked upon too favorably, and would never gain much support from anyone.
Mexico doesn't need any more carrots. And they wouldn't be in such bad shape if it weren't for rampant graft and corruption. Monetary or other aid would simply further line the pockets of the corrupt, and do nothing to stop the poor from trying to make their way across.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Panda Man Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 May 2006 at 4:41pm
shock troopers
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote High Voltage Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 May 2006 at 4:45pm
Originally posted by .Ryan .Ryan wrote:

Sammy, no autoturrets or landmines?

TFC style, oh yeah.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Tae Kwon Do Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 May 2006 at 4:45pm
I want to play some TFC....now....

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote usafpilot07 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 May 2006 at 4:55pm
Originally posted by ShortyBP ShortyBP wrote:


Oh, it CAN be done. But at what cost and with how much effort? The idea is to close the border without "militarizing" it. Give it an endless budget, slap in minefields and recreate the 38th Parallel of Korea... one step closer to a closed border.


Beat me to it....darn.

But a combination of that and an idea gotten from Comedy central would do the trick.  A firepit with a switch, so people would think they were gonna make it, then *flip* BBQM0/\/k!3s


Edited by usafpilot07 - 16 May 2006 at 4:56pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gatyr Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 May 2006 at 5:25pm
Im good with reb's idea. 
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