Wireless Question

If someone has an unsecured wireless connection, is it illegal to use their connection to go online?

I'm just wondering since I've been using one of my neighbors' for quite a while now. You'd think they may have noticed.

Edited by Bunkered - 17 February 2009 at 7:22am

I didn't ask if it was wrong though did I?

I asked if it was illegal. n00b

Mack wrote: Bunkered wrote: I didn't ask if it was wrong though did I? I asked if it was illegal. n00b So, what exactly is the difference?

The difference between a crisp fuji and a juicy tangerine.

So your neighbor paid for something, and you think it is OK to just take it from them without their permission?

FreeEnterprise wrote: So your neighbor paid for something, and you think it is OK to just take it from them without their permission? Why don't you run an extension cord and steal the power they are paying for too? Or why don't you go over and take their food out of their pantry? Or why don't you cut a hole in the wall of your apartment, and their apartment, and put in a fan to suck their heat/ac into your apartment? Why don't you go suck out the gas out of their gas tank and put it in yours? Or steal their paper, or mail, or deliveries?...   Have some character, and stop being a mooch.   Yes, it is illegal, but you probably wouldn't get in trouble for it. Although, anytime you enter a password, the person who owns the router could be watching what you do and getting all your info...   I guess if they used the password you entered to access your bank account, and then they took out your money, would you be upset?

While your original point is valid and I agree that it's not right to steal internet access, I will say that there is a difference between leeching internet access and those other examples. Things like power, heat/ac, food, gas, etc. are all things that are paid based on how much is used while internet access (in nearly all locations) is something that you pay to make available rather than paying for how much you use. Basically, my point is that his neighbor will pay $X for internet access whether people are leeching off of it or not so it doesn't cost him anything extra. The only side affect would be potential slow-downs due to the increase in traffic over his connection but if nobody is running torrents or anything highly bandwidth intensive then he likely won't even notice. That said, it still isn't right to use his connection but that's not what was asked. In most cases I believe it is illegal to do that and it is especially bad if they had security setup and you bypassed it to get in.

What I'd be more worried about is the second point FE made which is something that you should be very concerned about; security. I won't go into tremendous detail about how the technology works but basically, the internet is not a point-to-point system. You can send a message from point A destined for point B and nobody else will see it but that's only because they aren't listening. Everything you send from your computer is broadcast over many different networks until it finds its destination. So, everything you do while connected through his router is visible to anybody else on that router or the routers above it that are used to get your data to their destination. Normally, your computer sends data out that says "send me here" in a header and all devices that are not listed as the destination will either ignore it or forward it on. The type of program I mentioned will not simply ignore this data, it will let you look at it. So anything you send unencrypted over the internet will appear as plain text to anybody using one of those programs to monitor the traffic. I believe Ethereal and Wireshark are names of programs that can be used for that stuff. All he has to do is run something like that and every time you make an online purchase, check your bank account balance, etc. you'd be sending all of your information out for free. Since his network is unsecure, you can't be sure who else is on it and it only takes one evil prick to go on there and steal your information. The reason cyber-crime is such a big problem is because it's way too easy. I could sit outside your house with a laptop, steal your info, and drive off without you ever finding me . And don't think that doesn't happen to people.

If you want to protect yourself but still can't get yourself to stop mooching, at least offer to set some security up for him . That way you at least protect both of you while you steal his bandwidth.

FreeEnterprise wrote: So your neighbor paid for something, and you think it is OK to just take it from them without their permission? Why don't you run an extension cord and steal the power they are paying for too? Or why don't you go over and take their food out of their pantry? Or why don't you cut a hole in the wall of your apartment, and their apartment, and put in a fan to suck their heat/ac into your apartment? Why don't you go suck out the gas out of their gas tank and put it in yours? Or steal their paper, or mail, or deliveries?...   Have some character, and stop being a mooch.   Yes, it is illegal, but you probably wouldn't get in trouble for it. Although, anytime you enter a password, the person who owns the router could be watching what you do and getting all your info...   I guess if they used the password you entered to access your bank account, and then they took out your money, would you be upset?

Good thing I don't care if they get my Tippmann password.
Other than that, I just read the news.

If they are too stupid to protect their wireless network, have at it. If they get tired of you leeching their internet connection they aren't going to call the cops, they will probably do some reading and put a key on it or enable the MAC filter.

Why don't you steal their cable tv too?

FreeEnterprise wrote: Why don't you steal their cable tv too?

Because TV is lame, and a waste of time.
My antenna provides me with the weather and morning news, and that's all I need.

Use it until they PW protect it.